5 ms·

I'm all for it. If this edges out the razor thin margins that Redfin et. al. were making on the US housing market, let's go. As a first time homebuyer who would

I'm all for it. If this edges out the razor thin margins that Redfin et. al. were making on the US housing market, let's go. As a first time homebuyer who would like to purchase a place to live, a few points of interest are not going to dissuade my decision. But I have a strong feeling that the REIT market will pop like the bubble that it is once the financials start looking unfavorable.

Alupis 4y ago
> a few points of interest are not going to dissuade my decision Perhaps not, but if you run the math you'll see a "few points" very quickly means you'll have to buy much less house than you may have desired.
- jeffbee 4y ago
  Er, either that or the seller is going to get a much lower price than they desired. In reality, a linear solution of these two conflicting desires.
  - Alupis 4y ago
    There's a lot of opportunist sellers with locked-in sub 4% rates that are only selling because they can make a quick buck. I think we'll see desperate folks buying overpriced homes half the size that they could have afforded just months ago
  - colinmhayes 4y ago
    Or the housing market liquidity will collapse as all the would be sellers sit on their house while they wait for rates to go back down.
    - aschearer 4y ago
      Tend to think this is what will happen. Unless you have no choice what advantage is there to move if your interest rate is less than 4% in today's market? Almost certainly moving will mean a smaller/worse home for more money each month.
johnbellone 4y ago
Unfortunately those monies aren't going to come back to us but to the real estate agents.
atwebb 4y ago
I might be in the minority, I liked Redfin as a broker / NAR competitor. Seeing houses was super easy, lower fees, etc. I'm well aware of tradeoffs in the industry and connections.
dymk 4y ago
Why root for the downfall of Redfin and the like? They were finally a lower cost alternative to the stranglehold that RE agents have had on sellers for decades. Why should it cost 6% to sell a house?
- LandR 4y ago
  Do you have to pay tax to the Government where you live to buy a house ? I'm wondering if Stamp Duty is just a UK thing. Here we pay a tax to the government when you buy that is based on the value of the house you are buying. Up to £250,000 Zero The next £675,000 (the portion from £250,001 to £925,000) -5% The next £575,000 (the portion from £925,001 to £1.5 million) -10% The remaining amount (the portion above £1.5 million) - 12% The tax goes up even higher if you are buying a second home.
  - notinfuriated 4y ago
    Depends on the locality, but as far as I know, most cities in the US have a "transfer tax" that is some percentage of the home sale price. It varies quite a bit in different cities and can also be 'progressive' in some cities, where more expensive properties have a higher tax rate.
  - evancox100 4y ago
    A few states/regions have this, for instance Pennsylvania I believe has a 2% transfer tax. Overall it is not common. Edit: Based on [0] more common than I thought, though there is a really wide range in values with some of the rates quite small, e.g. 0.1%, even 0.01% in CO. This reference is 25 years old though. [0] https://www.landcan.org/pdfs/StateTransferTaxChart.pdf https://www.landcan.org/pdfs/StateTransferTaxChart.pdf
  - pridkett 4y ago
    As with most things in the US, it depends on where you live. I’ve paid anywhere from a flat rate of a couple hundred bucks to 2%. It’s generally called a real estate transfer tax. Note: this is different than points, general property tax, agent fees, etc. Ref: https://www.bankrate.com/real-estate/transfer-taxes/ https://www.bankrate.com/real-estate/transfer-taxes/
jeffbee 4y ago
Imagine believing that Redfin has any influence on the U.S. homes market. The U.S. home market is worth ~50 trillion dollars. There are > 1.3 million homes for sale at this moment.
- ramesh31 4y ago
  Someone is buying them, and it’s definitely not the average American. I have a 90th percentile income, and I cannot afford the median (or mean) home price in the US.
  - runnr_az 4y ago
    It's weird, right? Like... who is paying these crazy prices?
    - sarchertech 4y ago
      ~6 months ago, someone with a 90th percentile income could very easily afford a median priced home with a monthly payment well below $2k a month. The answer to who is paying these crazy prices now is fewer and fewer people.
    - jeffbee 4y ago
      This is basically you refusing to believe in wealth and income inequality. Once you realize that the 99th percentile net worth is 100x the median net worth, and the 99th percentile income is 50x the median, and the 99.99th percentile is 50x the 99th, it should start to become clear. There are millions of people out there walking around with fairly large inherited assets and the only thing they can imagine doing with it is parking it all in real estate.
- Supermancho 4y ago
  Everything is always for sale, listed or not. It's about the pricepoint and opportunity to leverage. 1.3M is just under 1%
nine_zeros 4y ago
Housing should not have been treated like stock market. But it was and now we have a lot of bag holders, just like there are bag holders in the stock market. The housing bag is a very expensive bag to hold.

Alupis 4y ago

> a few points of interest are not going to dissuade my decision Perhaps not, but if you run the math you'll see a "few points" very quickly means you'll have to buy much less house than you may have desired.

jeffbee 4y ago
Er, either that or the seller is going to get a much lower price than they desired. In reality, a linear solution of these two conflicting desires.
- Alupis 4y ago
  There's a lot of opportunist sellers with locked-in sub 4% rates that are only selling because they can make a quick buck. I think we'll see desperate folks buying overpriced homes half the size that they could have afforded just months ago
- colinmhayes 4y ago
  Or the housing market liquidity will collapse as all the would be sellers sit on their house while they wait for rates to go back down.
  - aschearer 4y ago
    Tend to think this is what will happen. Unless you have no choice what advantage is there to move if your interest rate is less than 4% in today's market? Almost certainly moving will mean a smaller/worse home for more money each month.

johnbellone 4y ago

Unfortunately those monies aren't going to come back to us but to the real estate agents.

atwebb 4y ago

I might be in the minority, I liked Redfin as a broker / NAR competitor. Seeing houses was super easy, lower fees, etc. I'm well aware of tradeoffs in the industry and connections.

dymk 4y ago

Why root for the downfall of Redfin and the like? They were finally a lower cost alternative to the stranglehold that RE agents have had on sellers for decades. Why should it cost 6% to sell a house?

LandR 4y ago
Do you have to pay tax to the Government where you live to buy a house ? I'm wondering if Stamp Duty is just a UK thing. Here we pay a tax to the government when you buy that is based on the value of the house you are buying. Up to £250,000 Zero The next £675,000 (the portion from £250,001 to £925,000) -5% The next £575,000 (the portion from £925,001 to £1.5 million) -10% The remaining amount (the portion above £1.5 million) - 12% The tax goes up even higher if you are buying a second home.
- notinfuriated 4y ago
  Depends on the locality, but as far as I know, most cities in the US have a "transfer tax" that is some percentage of the home sale price. It varies quite a bit in different cities and can also be 'progressive' in some cities, where more expensive properties have a higher tax rate.
- evancox100 4y ago
  A few states/regions have this, for instance Pennsylvania I believe has a 2% transfer tax. Overall it is not common. Edit: Based on [0] more common than I thought, though there is a really wide range in values with some of the rates quite small, e.g. 0.1%, even 0.01% in CO. This reference is 25 years old though. [0] https://www.landcan.org/pdfs/StateTransferTaxChart.pdf https://www.landcan.org/pdfs/StateTransferTaxChart.pdf
- pridkett 4y ago
  As with most things in the US, it depends on where you live. I’ve paid anywhere from a flat rate of a couple hundred bucks to 2%. It’s generally called a real estate transfer tax. Note: this is different than points, general property tax, agent fees, etc. Ref: https://www.bankrate.com/real-estate/transfer-taxes/ https://www.bankrate.com/real-estate/transfer-taxes/

jeffbee 4y ago

Imagine believing that Redfin has any influence on the U.S. homes market. The U.S. home market is worth ~50 trillion dollars. There are > 1.3 million homes for sale at this moment.

ramesh31 4y ago
Someone is buying them, and it’s definitely not the average American. I have a 90th percentile income, and I cannot afford the median (or mean) home price in the US.
- runnr_az 4y ago
  It's weird, right? Like... who is paying these crazy prices?
  - sarchertech 4y ago
    ~6 months ago, someone with a 90th percentile income could very easily afford a median priced home with a monthly payment well below $2k a month. The answer to who is paying these crazy prices now is fewer and fewer people.
  - jeffbee 4y ago
    This is basically you refusing to believe in wealth and income inequality. Once you realize that the 99th percentile net worth is 100x the median net worth, and the 99th percentile income is 50x the median, and the 99.99th percentile is 50x the 99th, it should start to become clear. There are millions of people out there walking around with fairly large inherited assets and the only thing they can imagine doing with it is parking it all in real estate.
Supermancho 4y ago
Everything is always for sale, listed or not. It's about the pricepoint and opportunity to leverage. 1.3M is just under 1%

nine_zeros 4y ago

Housing should not have been treated like stock market. But it was and now we have a lot of bag holders, just like there are bag holders in the stock market. The housing bag is a very expensive bag to hold.