7 ms·

Hah, except that you get more of what you subsidize. Besides being immoral, it’s destructive to society.

pjc50 4y ago
My point is that the "war on drugs" approach is pretty ineffective while at the same time inflicting significant collateral damage. It already is underground, and it already is almost illegal in most jurisdictions. (Actually criminalizing the exchange of valuable consideration for sex hits the problem that things that look suspiciously like it are endemic in hetero dating and "giving money to your tinder date for a taxi" becomes an offence)
- a-user-you-like 4y ago
- marcus_holmes 4y ago
  Just say you're filming a porno and in most of the western world it suddenly becomes legal.
  - rtkwe 4y ago
    There's a lot of paperwork you have to keep around that IIRC dealing with actor's ages and everything.
  - krferriter 4y ago
    Yeah prostitution is legal as long as you film it and sell the video. Unclear if this is a feature or a bug.
- a-user-you-like 4y ago
  You’re skipping the moral problem. The road to hell is paved with utilitarians.
  - Volundr 4y ago
    Your religion is not my religion. The law should not prevent me from doing things just because you think it'll send me to hell, anymore than the law should force you to practice my religion. If you don't believe in freedom of religion, that's your choice, but it sort of one of the founding principles of the USA.
    - a-user-you-like 4y ago
      The founding of the USA had all 13 colonies with state churches. Sure, let’s return to that. Then all the states would outlaw this immoral practice.
      - Volundr 4y ago
        And yet the first amendment guarantees freedom of religion and none of these 13 colonies banned prostitution, so it seems your assumption is incorrect.
        a-user-you-like 4y ago
        The first Amendment guarantees that Congress will not establish a religion. The states already had them established. And adultery was a capital crime, read between the lines. Look, if your daughters came to you and said “we want to be whores for a living”, you’ve got bigger issues than arguing on this website.
        Volundr 4y ago
        > And adultery was a capital crime, read between the lines. Uhhh... No, no it was not. > Look, if your daughters came to you and said “we want to be whores for a living”, you’ve got bigger issues than arguing on this website. Better throw them in prison then. That'll solve the problem.
        inglor_cz 4y ago
        "And adultery was a capital crime" Are you confusing Islam with Christianity? Adultery is a capital crime in traditional Islamic jurisprudence.
pas 4y ago
citation needed
- vorpalhex 4y ago
  > Be kind. Don't be snarky. Have curious conversation; don't cross-examine. Please don't fulminate. Please don't sneer, including at the rest of the community. > Comments should get more thoughtful and substantive, not less, as a topic gets more divisive. Please don't comment like you're on reddit or Facebook.
  - pas 4y ago
    I commented like I'm on a site that values discussion over blind downvotes, but also substance over empty moral claims. I was genuinely interested in reading some arguments for that claim. (After all nowadays it's s trope that this or that thing corrupts society. Porn, money, capital, the Internet, music, 5G, drugs, sex, millennials, conservatives, radicals, atheists. And of course DnD.)
marcus_holmes 4y ago
I don't understand this. Why is it destructive to society to provide an easy way for people to get laid if they need to?
- jackling 4y ago
  If I had to guess (just a guess, I don't really believe these things.) - Lowering birthrate; people may be less likely to have a family and kids if the primary driver for these things (sex) is already taken care of. - Higher STI rate (regulation might help here). - More isolation; people are less likely to go out and mingle if one of the reasons to do so is easy and transactional. - Wealth inequality; I believe men are more likely to pay for sex, and women sex workers tend to make more. So, money will move from one gender to the other unidirectionally. This may result in wealth inequality if sex work becomes wide spread.
- SpicyLemonZest 4y ago
  Precisely because it feeds the destructive attitude that the "get laid" impulse is a sort of mechanical need that can be cleanly isolated from the "find a long-term partner" impulse. Sex work for someone who wants to get laid is like cigarettes for someone who wants to lose weight - it'll work (nicotine is a reasonably strong appetite suppressant), but at what cost? Imagine you met someone who says "yeah, I used to really struggle on Tinder, so now I've uninstalled the apps and just hire a prostitute every Saturday". Does he seem like a healthy guy whose needs are being met?
  - UncleMeat 4y ago
  - Brian_K_White 4y ago
    It sounds like none of my or your business. Neither of us has any legitimate interest in them other than do they rob anyone? Do they burn down houses? Do they perform at some job and pay taxes? If they spend all their money on prostitutes, it's no more your business than if they spend it all on video games or cars or rare stamps.
bambax 4y ago
For some time now it seems moral / christian crusaders are invading HN. All those accounts have very low karma (sometimes even negative) and insist on "values" and "morals". I wonder if it's the result of a concerted effort or the inevitable consequence of HN becoming mainstream. It's probably the latter, but it's pretty annoying.
- mrguyorama 4y ago
  Basically half the US thinks this way and votes this way. If you are a conservative and upset at my comment, understand the people you vote for SIGNIFICANTLY support the religious nuts.
  - bambax 4y ago
    I'm not from the US, don't live there (and don't vote there).
    - mrguyorama 4y ago
      Billions of people still live under the framing that their religion is the only truth in the universe and think that prostitution is defined as some sort of bad thing according to their holy books. Even just limiting to Christians and Muslims, that's billions of diverse people who are limited to very against prostitution and sex out of wedlock. Why are you surprised that some of them can find this community?
- rendang 4y ago
  Why would social conservatives and Christians, who make up a large share of US population, not be expected to be present among HN commenters?
  - bambax 4y ago
    Because they weren't in the past. And because HN is an international forum for tech geeks; I think social conservatives and Christians are underrepresented in tech; and I am quite certain the kind of social conservatism and "Christianity" that exist in the US doesn't exist in the same proportion, or with the same beliefs, elsewhere. In Europe for instance, so-called "pro-lifers", while they exist, make up a small minority of the public.

My point is that the "war on drugs" approach is pretty ineffective while at the same time inflicting significant collateral damage. It already is underground, and it already is almost illegal in most jurisdictions. (Actually criminalizing the exchange of valuable consideration for sex hits the problem that things that look suspiciously like it are endemic in hetero dating and "giving money to your tinder date for a taxi" becomes an offence)

a-user-you-like 4y ago
marcus_holmes 4y ago
Just say you're filming a porno and in most of the western world it suddenly becomes legal.
- rtkwe 4y ago
  There's a lot of paperwork you have to keep around that IIRC dealing with actor's ages and everything.
- krferriter 4y ago
  Yeah prostitution is legal as long as you film it and sell the video. Unclear if this is a feature or a bug.
a-user-you-like 4y ago
You’re skipping the moral problem. The road to hell is paved with utilitarians.
- Volundr 4y ago
  Your religion is not my religion. The law should not prevent me from doing things just because you think it'll send me to hell, anymore than the law should force you to practice my religion. If you don't believe in freedom of religion, that's your choice, but it sort of one of the founding principles of the USA.
  - a-user-you-like 4y ago
    The founding of the USA had all 13 colonies with state churches. Sure, let’s return to that. Then all the states would outlaw this immoral practice.
    - Volundr 4y ago
      And yet the first amendment guarantees freedom of religion and none of these 13 colonies banned prostitution, so it seems your assumption is incorrect.
      - a-user-you-like 4y ago
        The first Amendment guarantees that Congress will not establish a religion. The states already had them established. And adultery was a capital crime, read between the lines. Look, if your daughters came to you and said “we want to be whores for a living”, you’ve got bigger issues than arguing on this website.
        Volundr 4y ago
        > And adultery was a capital crime, read between the lines. Uhhh... No, no it was not. > Look, if your daughters came to you and said “we want to be whores for a living”, you’ve got bigger issues than arguing on this website. Better throw them in prison then. That'll solve the problem.
        inglor_cz 4y ago
        "And adultery was a capital crime" Are you confusing Islam with Christianity? Adultery is a capital crime in traditional Islamic jurisprudence.

pas 4y ago

citation needed

vorpalhex 4y ago
> Be kind. Don't be snarky. Have curious conversation; don't cross-examine. Please don't fulminate. Please don't sneer, including at the rest of the community. > Comments should get more thoughtful and substantive, not less, as a topic gets more divisive. Please don't comment like you're on reddit or Facebook.
- pas 4y ago
  I commented like I'm on a site that values discussion over blind downvotes, but also substance over empty moral claims. I was genuinely interested in reading some arguments for that claim. (After all nowadays it's s trope that this or that thing corrupts society. Porn, money, capital, the Internet, music, 5G, drugs, sex, millennials, conservatives, radicals, atheists. And of course DnD.)

marcus_holmes 4y ago

I don't understand this. Why is it destructive to society to provide an easy way for people to get laid if they need to?

jackling 4y ago
If I had to guess (just a guess, I don't really believe these things.) - Lowering birthrate; people may be less likely to have a family and kids if the primary driver for these things (sex) is already taken care of. - Higher STI rate (regulation might help here). - More isolation; people are less likely to go out and mingle if one of the reasons to do so is easy and transactional. - Wealth inequality; I believe men are more likely to pay for sex, and women sex workers tend to make more. So, money will move from one gender to the other unidirectionally. This may result in wealth inequality if sex work becomes wide spread.
SpicyLemonZest 4y ago
Precisely because it feeds the destructive attitude that the "get laid" impulse is a sort of mechanical need that can be cleanly isolated from the "find a long-term partner" impulse. Sex work for someone who wants to get laid is like cigarettes for someone who wants to lose weight - it'll work (nicotine is a reasonably strong appetite suppressant), but at what cost? Imagine you met someone who says "yeah, I used to really struggle on Tinder, so now I've uninstalled the apps and just hire a prostitute every Saturday". Does he seem like a healthy guy whose needs are being met?
- UncleMeat 4y ago
- Brian_K_White 4y ago
  It sounds like none of my or your business. Neither of us has any legitimate interest in them other than do they rob anyone? Do they burn down houses? Do they perform at some job and pay taxes? If they spend all their money on prostitutes, it's no more your business than if they spend it all on video games or cars or rare stamps.

bambax 4y ago

For some time now it seems moral / christian crusaders are invading HN. All those accounts have very low karma (sometimes even negative) and insist on "values" and "morals". I wonder if it's the result of a concerted effort or the inevitable consequence of HN becoming mainstream. It's probably the latter, but it's pretty annoying.

mrguyorama 4y ago
Basically half the US thinks this way and votes this way. If you are a conservative and upset at my comment, understand the people you vote for SIGNIFICANTLY support the religious nuts.
- bambax 4y ago
  I'm not from the US, don't live there (and don't vote there).
  - mrguyorama 4y ago
    Billions of people still live under the framing that their religion is the only truth in the universe and think that prostitution is defined as some sort of bad thing according to their holy books. Even just limiting to Christians and Muslims, that's billions of diverse people who are limited to very against prostitution and sex out of wedlock. Why are you surprised that some of them can find this community?
rendang 4y ago
Why would social conservatives and Christians, who make up a large share of US population, not be expected to be present among HN commenters?
- bambax 4y ago
  Because they weren't in the past. And because HN is an international forum for tech geeks; I think social conservatives and Christians are underrepresented in tech; and I am quite certain the kind of social conservatism and "Christianity" that exist in the US doesn't exist in the same proportion, or with the same beliefs, elsewhere. In Europe for instance, so-called "pro-lifers", while they exist, make up a small minority of the public.