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It's about the universe as a potential observer of Earth. It takes two. Basically everyone in our galactic neighborhood with a nice telescope has already flag

It's about the universe as a potential observer of Earth. It takes two. Basically everyone in our galactic neighborhood with a nice telescope has already flagged Earth as an interesting place to visit.

amelius 4y ago
among how many other interesting places?
- willis936 4y ago
  We won't know until we have a nice telescope ourselves.
  - prox 4y ago
    What is a “nice telescope” in this context?
    - deleted 4y ago
      [deleted]
    - willis936 4y ago
      One capable of measuring atmospheric composition or maybe even surface light of exoplanets from whatever necessary distance. JWST lets us do that for nearby stars. Exciting for sure, but I don't think it will give us a large enough sample size to put meaningful bounds on the abundance of life.
    - bjelkeman-again 4y ago
      I think he speaks of none other but the telescope that is to come after James Webb. A telescope whose merest operational parameters we are not worthy to calculate - and yet astronomers will design it for you. A telescope which can show us the question to the Ultimate answer, a telescope of such infinite and subtle complexity that organic life itself will form part of its operational matrix. And humanity shall take on new forms and go down into the telescope to navigate its ten million year programme. Yes, we shall design this telescope for you, and the astronomers shall name it for you. And it shall be called the [insert name here]. With apologies to Douglas Adams.
      - mistermann 4y ago
        Best be mindful of the Streetlight Effect (including when hiring for a position)! https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streetlight_effect https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streetlight_effect
dylan604 4y ago
We keep trying to make inferences about what our nice telescopes can see of other planets. Maybe we should build a nice telescope that points at Earth but is on a Voyager-like trajectory. It could keep sending us images of Earth as it gets further away so we can compare those images to what we see of other planets. It would be a our base reference model.
denton-scratch 4y ago
> with a nice telescope Not sure about that. Given that we've only discovered a thousand or so exoplanets, and that our galactic neighbourhood contains millions of stars that probably mostly have planets, and that we've only recently spotted any that are Earth-like and in the habitable zone, I'd guess that most inhabitants of the neighbourhood have no idea this planet exists. I think the obsessive focus on alien life is misguided, and a waste of time and money. It's so certain that there is extraterrestrial life that it would add essentially nothing to our knowledge if we found evidence of life on an exoplanet. We couldn't visit them, they couldn't visit us. If we tried to visit an exoplanet, we'd have evolved into something else by the time we arrived. So my guess is that there is a very short period in the development of civilisation when "people" (including aliens) are interested in space aliens. I suspect it kicks in when "people" first understand that they are living on a spherical planet orbiting a star, and that there are many, many other stars. And I suspect it fades away when they realize that it can never make any difference to anything.
- willis936 4y ago
  You're underspecifying the nice telescope. Knowing your environment is essential to survival. It will never be an uninteresting topic to a civilization.

amelius 4y ago

among how many other interesting places?

willis936 4y ago
We won't know until we have a nice telescope ourselves.
- prox 4y ago
  What is a “nice telescope” in this context?
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - willis936 4y ago
    One capable of measuring atmospheric composition or maybe even surface light of exoplanets from whatever necessary distance. JWST lets us do that for nearby stars. Exciting for sure, but I don't think it will give us a large enough sample size to put meaningful bounds on the abundance of life.
  - bjelkeman-again 4y ago
    I think he speaks of none other but the telescope that is to come after James Webb. A telescope whose merest operational parameters we are not worthy to calculate - and yet astronomers will design it for you. A telescope which can show us the question to the Ultimate answer, a telescope of such infinite and subtle complexity that organic life itself will form part of its operational matrix. And humanity shall take on new forms and go down into the telescope to navigate its ten million year programme. Yes, we shall design this telescope for you, and the astronomers shall name it for you. And it shall be called the [insert name here]. With apologies to Douglas Adams.
    - mistermann 4y ago
      Best be mindful of the Streetlight Effect (including when hiring for a position)! https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streetlight_effect https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streetlight_effect

dylan604 4y ago

We keep trying to make inferences about what our nice telescopes can see of other planets. Maybe we should build a nice telescope that points at Earth but is on a Voyager-like trajectory. It could keep sending us images of Earth as it gets further away so we can compare those images to what we see of other planets. It would be a our base reference model.

denton-scratch 4y ago

> with a nice telescope Not sure about that. Given that we've only discovered a thousand or so exoplanets, and that our galactic neighbourhood contains millions of stars that probably mostly have planets, and that we've only recently spotted any that are Earth-like and in the habitable zone, I'd guess that most inhabitants of the neighbourhood have no idea this planet exists. I think the obsessive focus on alien life is misguided, and a waste of time and money. It's so certain that there is extraterrestrial life that it would add essentially nothing to our knowledge if we found evidence of life on an exoplanet. We couldn't visit them, they couldn't visit us. If we tried to visit an exoplanet, we'd have evolved into something else by the time we arrived. So my guess is that there is a very short period in the development of civilisation when "people" (including aliens) are interested in space aliens. I suspect it kicks in when "people" first understand that they are living on a spherical planet orbiting a star, and that there are many, many other stars. And I suspect it fades away when they realize that it can never make any difference to anything.

willis936 4y ago
You're underspecifying the nice telescope. Knowing your environment is essential to survival. It will never be an uninteresting topic to a civilization.