4 ms·

>The biggest “belief-system” group to blame here are just doctors. I know this is a highly controversial opinion, but we should stop listening to doctors becaus

>The biggest “belief-system” group to blame here are just doctors. I know this is a highly controversial opinion, but we should stop listening to doctors because they’re “doctors” and start fact-checking them. That didn't go well - the way covid sceptics were treated by the Cathedral was not nice.

santiagobasulto 4y ago
With Covid it was exactly this case. There was a few months that nobody knew nothing about it. Most doctors were treating COVID as any other coronavirus. At the time, I helped with some Data-related tasks to a group of researchers (Biologists, Biochemists, PhDs, etc) and I remember it clearly. A lot of uncertainty, but yet doctors had already arrived to a conclusion.
- noobly 4y ago
  What did your data related tasks imply?
- disgruntledphd2 4y ago
  That's what doctors are paid to do. Unfortunately, they can't wait for the RCT's to be finished before making a decision, and so we train them well and pay them well to make decisions under uncertainty. It's rather like software engineering, but with lives/health at stake.
mort96 4y ago
"COVID skeptics" describes a group which includes people who think vaccines poison you with 5G, think COVID was an engineered bioweapon targeting the US, people who think injecting disinfectant would be a good treatment, people who advocate taking horse dewormer, people who think the right approach to dealing with a pandemic is to just let people die, etc etc. You may want to be more specific. Although your use of the phrase "the Cathedral" doesn't lead me to believe you're very grounded in reality yourself.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- andybak 4y ago
  I think your first paragraph makes a valid point. Your second is just raising the temperature without adding any real value, hence the downvotes you appear to be getting.
  - mort96 4y ago
    I'm sorry, but I don't think invoking a conspiracy is adding much value either. I think it's completely unwarranted. That conspiracy nuts don't like it is their problem. You'll get downvoted if you enter a flat earth convention and describe those assholes accurately too. Hacker news is weirdly populated by people with no grounding in reality on very specific topics, like this and the MOND bullshit people spew in all physics discussions. I think it's an unhealthy obsession with being contrarian mostly.
    - Gordonjcp 4y ago
      > Hacker news is weirdly populated by people with no grounding in reality on very specific topics You see the phrase "the Cathedral" flung about a lot. I take this as a fairly solid indicator of ESR-fellating big-L Libertarians.
      - ReptileMan 4y ago
        Do you have a better description of the journo political academical hivemind? Big brother maybe? Because it was almost Orwellian the way narratives switched and no one admitted at being wrong even as the policies prescribed were either less effective or counterproductive.
  - sharken 4y ago
    The first paragraph paints a picture, where all skeptics are crazy or idiotic. It's worth remembering the definition of skeptic as stated here: https://www.dictionary.com/browse/skeptic https://www.dictionary.com/browse/skeptic "a person who questions the validity or authenticity of something purporting to be factual.". But COVID discussions tend to be extremely black and white, with no place for a middle ground. The comment about skeptics serves only to keep that black and white picture, which is one reason for downvoting.
Gordonjcp 4y ago
> the way covid sceptics were treated by the Cathedral was not nice. As it should be, because they were dangerous idiots coming away with stuff that would have made a Victorian-era quack patent medicine seller blush. No, Stoney McDooberson, smoking weed will not protect you from COVID. "BuT BiG PhArMa Is TrYiNg To KeEp EveRyOnE SiCk WiTh VaCcInE cLoT sHot! BuY hOrSe WoRmEr InStEaD!!!" Yeah, who do you think makes the horse wormer? Hint - not a naturopath.
- im3w1l 4y ago
  Ivermectin is a generic medication, and the use as horse-dewormer has made it a low cost commodity. So you can't make big bucks peddling it. Unlike new and patented vaccines.
  - Gordonjcp 4y ago
    Yes, but it is also primarily a large-animal dewormer. You can use it in humans, but in a far smaller dose than you'd expect. It works quite well as a dewormer in humans too. It does precisely fuck all against COVID or any other sort of virus. Solid gold against intestinal parasites though.
    - pandaman 4y ago
      https://www.covid19treatmentguidelines.nih.gov/therapies/antiviral-therapy/ivermectin/ https://www.covid19treatmentguidelines.nih.gov/therapies/ant...
      - Gordonjcp 4y ago
        Right, so we're back to woowoo stuff from Smokey McStonerface's blog?
        pandaman 4y ago
        I am not sure what are you asking. Do you think NIH are some stoners who know less about diseases and medicines than you? It might surprise you but those people [1] actually have education and experience, unlike yourself. 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Institutes_of_Health https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Institutes_of_Health

santiagobasulto 4y ago

With Covid it was exactly this case. There was a few months that nobody knew nothing about it. Most doctors were treating COVID as any other coronavirus. At the time, I helped with some Data-related tasks to a group of researchers (Biologists, Biochemists, PhDs, etc) and I remember it clearly. A lot of uncertainty, but yet doctors had already arrived to a conclusion.

noobly 4y ago
What did your data related tasks imply?
disgruntledphd2 4y ago
That's what doctors are paid to do. Unfortunately, they can't wait for the RCT's to be finished before making a decision, and so we train them well and pay them well to make decisions under uncertainty. It's rather like software engineering, but with lives/health at stake.

mort96 4y ago

"COVID skeptics" describes a group which includes people who think vaccines poison you with 5G, think COVID was an engineered bioweapon targeting the US, people who think injecting disinfectant would be a good treatment, people who advocate taking horse dewormer, people who think the right approach to dealing with a pandemic is to just let people die, etc etc. You may want to be more specific. Although your use of the phrase "the Cathedral" doesn't lead me to believe you're very grounded in reality yourself.

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
andybak 4y ago
I think your first paragraph makes a valid point. Your second is just raising the temperature without adding any real value, hence the downvotes you appear to be getting.
- mort96 4y ago
  I'm sorry, but I don't think invoking a conspiracy is adding much value either. I think it's completely unwarranted. That conspiracy nuts don't like it is their problem. You'll get downvoted if you enter a flat earth convention and describe those assholes accurately too. Hacker news is weirdly populated by people with no grounding in reality on very specific topics, like this and the MOND bullshit people spew in all physics discussions. I think it's an unhealthy obsession with being contrarian mostly.
  - Gordonjcp 4y ago
    > Hacker news is weirdly populated by people with no grounding in reality on very specific topics You see the phrase "the Cathedral" flung about a lot. I take this as a fairly solid indicator of ESR-fellating big-L Libertarians.
    - ReptileMan 4y ago
      Do you have a better description of the journo political academical hivemind? Big brother maybe? Because it was almost Orwellian the way narratives switched and no one admitted at being wrong even as the policies prescribed were either less effective or counterproductive.
- sharken 4y ago
  The first paragraph paints a picture, where all skeptics are crazy or idiotic. It's worth remembering the definition of skeptic as stated here: https://www.dictionary.com/browse/skeptic https://www.dictionary.com/browse/skeptic "a person who questions the validity or authenticity of something purporting to be factual.". But COVID discussions tend to be extremely black and white, with no place for a middle ground. The comment about skeptics serves only to keep that black and white picture, which is one reason for downvoting.

Gordonjcp 4y ago

> the way covid sceptics were treated by the Cathedral was not nice. As it should be, because they were dangerous idiots coming away with stuff that would have made a Victorian-era quack patent medicine seller blush. No, Stoney McDooberson, smoking weed will not protect you from COVID. "BuT BiG PhArMa Is TrYiNg To KeEp EveRyOnE SiCk WiTh VaCcInE cLoT sHot! BuY hOrSe WoRmEr InStEaD!!!" Yeah, who do you think makes the horse wormer? Hint - not a naturopath.

im3w1l 4y ago
Ivermectin is a generic medication, and the use as horse-dewormer has made it a low cost commodity. So you can't make big bucks peddling it. Unlike new and patented vaccines.
- Gordonjcp 4y ago
  Yes, but it is also primarily a large-animal dewormer. You can use it in humans, but in a far smaller dose than you'd expect. It works quite well as a dewormer in humans too. It does precisely fuck all against COVID or any other sort of virus. Solid gold against intestinal parasites though.
  - pandaman 4y ago
    https://www.covid19treatmentguidelines.nih.gov/therapies/antiviral-therapy/ivermectin/ https://www.covid19treatmentguidelines.nih.gov/therapies/ant...
    - Gordonjcp 4y ago
      Right, so we're back to woowoo stuff from Smokey McStonerface's blog?
      - pandaman 4y ago
        I am not sure what are you asking. Do you think NIH are some stoners who know less about diseases and medicines than you? It might surprise you but those people [1] actually have education and experience, unlike yourself. 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Institutes_of_Health https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Institutes_of_Health