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IMO they still have too many 3xxx cards and don't want to cannibalize sales, hence adding them to the top of the stack instead of replacing the 3080/ti (and ren

IMO they still have too many 3xxx cards and don't want to cannibalize sales, hence adding them to the top of the stack instead of replacing the 3080/ti (and renaming their 4070 as 4080 12gb). The feeling I get from the whole thing is NV doesn't care that much about consumer graphics anymore, and doesn't care about providing competitive value. More of their revenue is coming from business applications, all of which is growing, and gaming looks like its down to 1/3 and shrinking.

dcow 4y ago
Tom at MLID pretty much confirmed as much in his recent two broken silicon podcasts. Nvidia is pricing this way so they can run the 4k and 3k lines concurrently.
- nomel 4y ago
  Jensen layed this out in the Q2 earnings call: https://youtu.be/15FX4pez1dw https://youtu.be/15FX4pez1dw
ChuckNorris89 4y ago
>gaming looks like its down to 1/3 and shrinking Me and most of my PC gaming friends gave up on this hobby in the past two-three years due to the insane GPU prices. I moved to the Oculus Quest 2 and they moved to PS5 and Steamdeck since the price of a modern GPU alone buys you a whole stand-alone gaming console today. Crazy stuff. I assume the 4000 series is basically a paper launch designed to make the existing 3000 inventory look attractive and make the people who were waiting on the 4000 series being good value rethink and just buy a 3000 instead.
- jakebasile 4y ago
  This is my story. I've been a PC-first gamer since I was a kid. Diablo was my first "big" game. The pricing of PC components and GPUs in particular have forced me to take a step back and move to console first with a Steam Deck supplementing. For the price of one mid level 40 series card I can buy two consoles (Xbox Series X + Digital PS5). I know that the games themselves end up costing more, but I don't really care about the majority of new games coming out and the ones I do are often on game pass.
  - msikora 4y ago
    "I know that the games themselves end up costing more" Just got PS5 and the PS Extra membership whose library has almost every game I wanted. Maxed out my SSD storage on day 1. And I think the XBox subscription is even better. I mean PC is still cheaper but the difference is not that big anymore.
  - SergeAx 4y ago
    You don't have to buy 40 series. Actually, you even don't have to buy 30 series. Even more actually, for gaming only you may buy AMD card, more or less th same that used by Xbox and PS5.
  - fomine3 4y ago
    3060 is enough to compete with PS5/XSX. Buy used one that will getting cheap.
    - jakebasile 4y ago
      I know, I have a 2080 at the moment. But I don't like where the PC industry is headed so I am not going to support it going forward unless something changes.
- pizza234 4y ago
  > Me and most of my PC gaming friends gave up on this hobby in the past two-three years due to the insane GPU prices. Why give up? Modern games are perfectly playable at 720p/no AA, reaching 60+ FPS also on pre-GTX 2000 cards. I've moved to 1080p just because I bought my latest card before the price hike, but I still don't mind playing at 720p/no AA.
  - refulgentis 4y ago
    As presented, the choices then are: - buy a $800 GPU, keep PC gaming and all the fun maintenance associated with that - buy a cool new toy like a Xbox Series X/PS5/Steam Deck - don't do anything, game at 720P with no AA (this sounds sort of like when I had lunchables for dinner yesterday) Your alternative isn't wrong but they weren't looking to optimize for staying on a PC, but rather, for gaming, and were already thinking in terms of "how much of my disposable income do I want to spend on my hobby?" rather than "should I spend my disposable income on my hobby?"
    - cercatrova 4y ago
      I had a PS5. I sold it after playing a few exclusives because there was just nothing else to play. Games are more expensive on consoles than PC, no mods, have to pay to play online, and so on. Plus, the very fact that it's a general purpose computer I can use for work, programming, and cool GPU stuff like Stable Diffusion are what made me get a PC over a console. In other words, I'm gonna need a computer anyway, why not get one that can play games over getting a computer or laptop and also a games console that doesn't do everything as well as a gaming PC? I'm sure in the long term one would actually spend less on a PC than a console, given all these constraints.
      - novok 4y ago
        Couch experience is overall much nicer. Dual classing one pc as a tv and desk thing is just plain annoying. PC -> TV experiences are also not great in general. Also many will not buy a desktop computer, their compute device is a phone at most.
- 7speter 4y ago
  Even at 300 dollars, a 350w 3080 still looks pretty bad. I'd much rather watch prices of the 6800xt, at least until AMD makes their RDNA3 announcement. It also runs (well) on linux too :).
- pclmulqdq 4y ago
  I occasionally play games, including some recent AAA releases. Everything plays fine at 1k/medium-high settings or 4k/medium-low settings on my GTX 1060. No AA, but I don't care that much. The age of needing a new graphics card to play the new games is basically over. IIRC the GTX 1060 is still the most popular GPU on steam. I just "upgraded" to a Radeon Pro VII (for RoCM), with basically equivalent graphics performance, and everything still plays very well.
- riizade 4y ago
  Just to echo the other children of this comment; I'm pretty lost as to the reasoning here. I game at 1440p on a GTX 1080 from launch day in 2016. Cost is essentially no object for me, as gaming is my primary hobby and I can easily spend 60hrs/week playing video games, so the return would be more than justified in my mind. But I haven't upgraded in 6 years because there has been no reason to. I'm running my favorite games at 144fps, and the newer super-high fidelity stuff I can run at 60fps, which is more than reasonable. I will say that I was excited for the 40XX lineup, but at these prices I'm more inclined to hunt for a cheaper 2080 or 3080 solely for RTX functionality, but that's an enthusiast feature even for someone like me who spends a huge amount of time gaming. I couldn't imagine giving up my access to old titles, console emulators, mods, itch.io experiments, and low-budget indie games on Steam to save a few hundred bucks in the short-term to buy a console. YMMV if you're not paid well in a HCOL area, or if your location offers alternatives such as PC cafes.
  - allisdust 4y ago
    Almost 10 hours per day. I'm curious : Is it typical for gamers to spend this much time gaming?
    - riizade 4y ago
      No. I am almost certainly an outlier, even among my peer group. No kids, taking a break from work, very few responsibilities. When I have a full time job my playtime drops, but 1-3 hours on weeknights plus large binges on weekends can keep the number surprisingly high, though. This is mostly a matter of multitasking (which I know HN is fairly divded on). I play games when I watch TV, and I also use games to socialize with my friends. If an average person added up ~80% of their socialization time and all of their TV/movie/audiobook/podcast time, I suspect that it'd look pretty close to the amount of gaming I do when I have a full time job (probably fluctuates between 10-40 hours per week).
    - sangnoir 4y ago
      Weekends could easily be > 1/3 of that time (say 24h over 2 days),leaving a reasonable ~5 hours per week day. I don't know about typical, but I've had such a schedule at points in my life when playing games I really enjoyed.
- MarioMan 4y ago
  >the price of a modern GPU alone buys you a whole stand-alone gaming console today. This has been true for as long as I’ve seen. Mid-range GPUs have historically tended to cost about as much as whole consoles. Pascal, one of the most well-received lines in terms of pricing, sold the GTX 1070 for $400 MSRP, the same price as buying a whole PS4. These new prices being the equivalent of buying two whole machines is what’s truly intense.
jhanschoo 4y ago
Regarding > gaming looks like its down to 1/3 and shrinking I believe that you're looking at the same chart that I was thinking of when I saw this line, which likely incorporates crypto GPUs into the "gaming" segment.

dcow 4y ago

Tom at MLID pretty much confirmed as much in his recent two broken silicon podcasts. Nvidia is pricing this way so they can run the 4k and 3k lines concurrently.

nomel 4y ago
Jensen layed this out in the Q2 earnings call: https://youtu.be/15FX4pez1dw https://youtu.be/15FX4pez1dw

ChuckNorris89 4y ago

>gaming looks like its down to 1/3 and shrinking Me and most of my PC gaming friends gave up on this hobby in the past two-three years due to the insane GPU prices. I moved to the Oculus Quest 2 and they moved to PS5 and Steamdeck since the price of a modern GPU alone buys you a whole stand-alone gaming console today. Crazy stuff. I assume the 4000 series is basically a paper launch designed to make the existing 3000 inventory look attractive and make the people who were waiting on the 4000 series being good value rethink and just buy a 3000 instead.

jakebasile 4y ago
This is my story. I've been a PC-first gamer since I was a kid. Diablo was my first "big" game. The pricing of PC components and GPUs in particular have forced me to take a step back and move to console first with a Steam Deck supplementing. For the price of one mid level 40 series card I can buy two consoles (Xbox Series X + Digital PS5). I know that the games themselves end up costing more, but I don't really care about the majority of new games coming out and the ones I do are often on game pass.
- msikora 4y ago
  "I know that the games themselves end up costing more" Just got PS5 and the PS Extra membership whose library has almost every game I wanted. Maxed out my SSD storage on day 1. And I think the XBox subscription is even better. I mean PC is still cheaper but the difference is not that big anymore.
- SergeAx 4y ago
  You don't have to buy 40 series. Actually, you even don't have to buy 30 series. Even more actually, for gaming only you may buy AMD card, more or less th same that used by Xbox and PS5.
- fomine3 4y ago
  3060 is enough to compete with PS5/XSX. Buy used one that will getting cheap.
  - jakebasile 4y ago
    I know, I have a 2080 at the moment. But I don't like where the PC industry is headed so I am not going to support it going forward unless something changes.
pizza234 4y ago
> Me and most of my PC gaming friends gave up on this hobby in the past two-three years due to the insane GPU prices. Why give up? Modern games are perfectly playable at 720p/no AA, reaching 60+ FPS also on pre-GTX 2000 cards. I've moved to 1080p just because I bought my latest card before the price hike, but I still don't mind playing at 720p/no AA.
- refulgentis 4y ago
  As presented, the choices then are: - buy a $800 GPU, keep PC gaming and all the fun maintenance associated with that - buy a cool new toy like a Xbox Series X/PS5/Steam Deck - don't do anything, game at 720P with no AA (this sounds sort of like when I had lunchables for dinner yesterday) Your alternative isn't wrong but they weren't looking to optimize for staying on a PC, but rather, for gaming, and were already thinking in terms of "how much of my disposable income do I want to spend on my hobby?" rather than "should I spend my disposable income on my hobby?"
  - cercatrova 4y ago
    I had a PS5. I sold it after playing a few exclusives because there was just nothing else to play. Games are more expensive on consoles than PC, no mods, have to pay to play online, and so on. Plus, the very fact that it's a general purpose computer I can use for work, programming, and cool GPU stuff like Stable Diffusion are what made me get a PC over a console. In other words, I'm gonna need a computer anyway, why not get one that can play games over getting a computer or laptop and also a games console that doesn't do everything as well as a gaming PC? I'm sure in the long term one would actually spend less on a PC than a console, given all these constraints.
    - novok 4y ago
      Couch experience is overall much nicer. Dual classing one pc as a tv and desk thing is just plain annoying. PC -> TV experiences are also not great in general. Also many will not buy a desktop computer, their compute device is a phone at most.
7speter 4y ago
Even at 300 dollars, a 350w 3080 still looks pretty bad. I'd much rather watch prices of the 6800xt, at least until AMD makes their RDNA3 announcement. It also runs (well) on linux too :).
pclmulqdq 4y ago
I occasionally play games, including some recent AAA releases. Everything plays fine at 1k/medium-high settings or 4k/medium-low settings on my GTX 1060. No AA, but I don't care that much. The age of needing a new graphics card to play the new games is basically over. IIRC the GTX 1060 is still the most popular GPU on steam. I just "upgraded" to a Radeon Pro VII (for RoCM), with basically equivalent graphics performance, and everything still plays very well.
riizade 4y ago
Just to echo the other children of this comment; I'm pretty lost as to the reasoning here. I game at 1440p on a GTX 1080 from launch day in 2016. Cost is essentially no object for me, as gaming is my primary hobby and I can easily spend 60hrs/week playing video games, so the return would be more than justified in my mind. But I haven't upgraded in 6 years because there has been no reason to. I'm running my favorite games at 144fps, and the newer super-high fidelity stuff I can run at 60fps, which is more than reasonable. I will say that I was excited for the 40XX lineup, but at these prices I'm more inclined to hunt for a cheaper 2080 or 3080 solely for RTX functionality, but that's an enthusiast feature even for someone like me who spends a huge amount of time gaming. I couldn't imagine giving up my access to old titles, console emulators, mods, itch.io experiments, and low-budget indie games on Steam to save a few hundred bucks in the short-term to buy a console. YMMV if you're not paid well in a HCOL area, or if your location offers alternatives such as PC cafes.
- allisdust 4y ago
  Almost 10 hours per day. I'm curious : Is it typical for gamers to spend this much time gaming?
  - riizade 4y ago
    No. I am almost certainly an outlier, even among my peer group. No kids, taking a break from work, very few responsibilities. When I have a full time job my playtime drops, but 1-3 hours on weeknights plus large binges on weekends can keep the number surprisingly high, though. This is mostly a matter of multitasking (which I know HN is fairly divded on). I play games when I watch TV, and I also use games to socialize with my friends. If an average person added up ~80% of their socialization time and all of their TV/movie/audiobook/podcast time, I suspect that it'd look pretty close to the amount of gaming I do when I have a full time job (probably fluctuates between 10-40 hours per week).
  - sangnoir 4y ago
    Weekends could easily be > 1/3 of that time (say 24h over 2 days),leaving a reasonable ~5 hours per week day. I don't know about typical, but I've had such a schedule at points in my life when playing games I really enjoyed.
MarioMan 4y ago
>the price of a modern GPU alone buys you a whole stand-alone gaming console today. This has been true for as long as I’ve seen. Mid-range GPUs have historically tended to cost about as much as whole consoles. Pascal, one of the most well-received lines in terms of pricing, sold the GTX 1070 for $400 MSRP, the same price as buying a whole PS4. These new prices being the equivalent of buying two whole machines is what’s truly intense.

jhanschoo 4y ago

Regarding > gaming looks like its down to 1/3 and shrinking I believe that you're looking at the same chart that I was thinking of when I saw this line, which likely incorporates crypto GPUs into the "gaming" segment.