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It wasn't omitted. It was covered in the keynote. It's also on their website: Let friends know how remote you go. If you’re on an adventure without cell

It wasn't omitted. It was covered in the keynote. It's also on their website: Let friends know how remote you go. If you’re on an adventure without cell service, you can now use Find My to share your location via satellite so friends and family know where you are.

tonyhb 4y ago
Apple's always-on pingback no matter where you go in the globe, even if you disable cell networks. I do believe they care about privacy, though if you look at features like this it's easy to see that they can be worse than Google if they wanted.
- dymk 4y ago
  Airplane mode. Of course if you don’t trust that, you shouldn’t be buying an Apple product anyways. They could ship an always on microphone streaming to their servers if they wanted to. But we trust that they won’t.
  - alasdair_ 4y ago
    Find my works even if the iphone is turned off - does airplane mode stop this?
    - artificial 4y ago
      Since we can't remove batteries I know a mylar Cheetos snack bag does the trick.
      - mburee 4y ago
        https://www.mattblaze.org/blog/faraday/ https://www.mattblaze.org/blog/faraday/ Make of that what you want
    - ErneX 4y ago
      That’s opt-in though.
    - dwaite 4y ago
      The toggles to turn off this feature (as well as Find my in general) do stop this.
  - adolph 4y ago
    Faraday bag or turned off in a freezer “stuck in a disused lavatory with a sign on the door saying ‘Beware of the Leopard.”
    - usefulcat 4y ago
      s/freezer/bottom of a locked filing cabinet/
      - adolph 4y ago
        Edward J. Snowden insisted that a group of lawyers advising him in the Chinese territory “hide their cellphones in the refrigerator of the home where he was staying, to block any eavesdropping,” https://archive.nytimes.com/thelede.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/06/25/why-snowdens-visitors-put-their-phones-in-the-fridge/ https://archive.nytimes.com/thelede.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/0...
- wyattjoh 4y ago
  Except this (currently) requires users to point their phone at a satellite so it can connect and transmit, with clear line of site of the sky. It seems it will be more likely something you'd do when you get to your "campsite" and want friends/family to know where you are located.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - stubish 4y ago
    That limitation will have to be fixed before this accounts for 85% of a satellite network's capacity.
  - s0rce 4y ago
    edit: I didn't realize this will apparently be required due to the antenna design in the iPhone, seems very cumbersome, you can't easily see where the satellites are... You don't really need to point it, at least with my inreach if its near the top of my pack and I'm not in a canyon or something I can get a message out.
    - Jtsummers 4y ago
      > you can't easily see where the satellites are... Which is why when you're using it they guide you on how to orient the phone (per their released info so far, we'll have actual user reports in a few weeks).
      - Scoundreller 4y ago
        I look forward to whatever video game they create where you get the rescue points for holding your phone in the right orientation.
        saghm 4y ago
        And if you don't, it presumably says "you're holding it wrong!"
- zarriak 4y ago
  I agree with your sentiment but this seemed in the keynote to be something you had to do on purpose and not like the normal always on find my.
- SergeAx 4y ago
  Correction: if they shareholders wanted.
toomuchtodo 4y ago
AirTags are even more compelling when your sensor fabric is satellite comms enabled.
- lostlogin 4y ago
  Not if you can’t share them with family. What the hell is that all about? If this has changed, scratch all of the above.
  - nikdoof 4y ago
    I had the (dumb) idea of putting an AirTag in the family car, with the idea of being able to get a rough idea of where it is parked without depending on the terrible manf provided app. Every time my partner would drive the car it would ping away for a good 2-3 minutes due to the safety notifications. We're all part of the same family account, I don't really understand why it isn't an option to just ignore it.
    - mschuster91 4y ago
      > We're all part of the same family account, I don't really understand why it isn't an option to just ignore it. Because there are way too many spouses who go to as absurd lengths as setting private investigators on their partners. Stalking is just as much a concern inside families as it is for everyday persons - I might be tempted to say that the impact is worse given the potential for domestic violence. Or just imagine fundamentalist parents tracking their children to Planned Parenthood, a known LGBT-friendly place or whatever. Ideally, there would be laws and regulations on trackers - and not just hardware-ones like the AirTags, but also software-based ones - that mandate features to prevent abuse, but sadly politicians haven't caught up on tech developments yet.
      - mort96 4y ago
        That still doesn't explain why it's not an option _for nikdoof's partner_ to choose to disable notifications from that particular AirPod. It makes total sense why nikdoof shouldn't be able to disable it for their partner.
cyanydeez 4y ago
How soon till this is just. A stalker feature
- Jtsummers 4y ago
  You have control over who can see your location in Find My. If a stalker has access, that means they're already someone you trust or you've never looked at the list of people you're sharing your location with.
- ShakataGaNai 4y ago
  Well, it's fairly easy to turn off. If you are in a situation in which you think you might be stalked through technology, you should certainly check your Find My along with any applicable location sharing Applications (both Android and Apple, such as google maps location sharing). So I doubt this will be used much as a stalker feature. Unless of course they hide a phone on your person/vehicle in such a way that it is both totally unnoticeable to you AND maintains a very clear view of the sky. Apple said that sending messages could take a minute or more with even light foliage, so hiding it in/under a car will be a total no-go.
BiteCode_dev 4y ago
Ah, tracking the entire population even in the highest mountain and the deepest desert. And all that to protect your love ones, of course. People apparently forgot all about PRISM already. That didn't take long.
- xbmcuser 4y ago
  Its amazing to me how easily people are willing to give Apple their data compared to Google, Facebook or Microsoft. Specially looking at how Apple was to willing to put its servers in countries that want control of the data. I think people seem to forget the privacy fight was not about privacy from advertisers but from government over reach. People are looking at Google for building skynet but Apple seems to be successfully building it and people are enthusiastically adopting it.
  - BiteCode_dev 4y ago
    Apple is much better at marketting than Google, Facebook or Microsoft.
  - simonh 4y ago
    Apple has a really strong track record of resisting Government intrusion, within the bounds of the law, not selling customer data to third parties, and holding app developers to account for the privacy of their apps. The others have business models based entirely on selling user data. The contentious element is the "within the bounds of the law" bit. In the US and Europe that means a lot, because Apple can use the courts to block government overreach and they have done so. In China they can't do that, so they don't just as nobody else operating within China can. Google does deserve credit for refusing to operate their search services within China, while Apple and many other companies decided they were willing to do business there on Chinese government terms.
- leokennis 4y ago
  There are articles/white papers available, showing Find My info is only visible to people you authorize it to.
tinus_hn 4y ago
> You can now There is an optional feature where you can choose to share your current location using a satellite even if you don’t have coverage. It would be stupid to use this capacity to track users because the data is not worth more than what you can get for free if you just cache the location and wait for the user to move into cellular coverage again. There is no conspiracy here.

tonyhb 4y ago

Apple's always-on pingback no matter where you go in the globe, even if you disable cell networks. I do believe they care about privacy, though if you look at features like this it's easy to see that they can be worse than Google if they wanted.

dymk 4y ago
Airplane mode. Of course if you don’t trust that, you shouldn’t be buying an Apple product anyways. They could ship an always on microphone streaming to their servers if they wanted to. But we trust that they won’t.
- alasdair_ 4y ago
  Find my works even if the iphone is turned off - does airplane mode stop this?
  - artificial 4y ago
    Since we can't remove batteries I know a mylar Cheetos snack bag does the trick.
    - mburee 4y ago
      https://www.mattblaze.org/blog/faraday/ https://www.mattblaze.org/blog/faraday/ Make of that what you want
  - ErneX 4y ago
    That’s opt-in though.
  - dwaite 4y ago
    The toggles to turn off this feature (as well as Find my in general) do stop this.
- adolph 4y ago
  Faraday bag or turned off in a freezer “stuck in a disused lavatory with a sign on the door saying ‘Beware of the Leopard.”
  - usefulcat 4y ago
    s/freezer/bottom of a locked filing cabinet/
    - adolph 4y ago
      Edward J. Snowden insisted that a group of lawyers advising him in the Chinese territory “hide their cellphones in the refrigerator of the home where he was staying, to block any eavesdropping,” https://archive.nytimes.com/thelede.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/06/25/why-snowdens-visitors-put-their-phones-in-the-fridge/ https://archive.nytimes.com/thelede.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/0...
wyattjoh 4y ago
Except this (currently) requires users to point their phone at a satellite so it can connect and transmit, with clear line of site of the sky. It seems it will be more likely something you'd do when you get to your "campsite" and want friends/family to know where you are located.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- stubish 4y ago
  That limitation will have to be fixed before this accounts for 85% of a satellite network's capacity.
- s0rce 4y ago
  edit: I didn't realize this will apparently be required due to the antenna design in the iPhone, seems very cumbersome, you can't easily see where the satellites are... You don't really need to point it, at least with my inreach if its near the top of my pack and I'm not in a canyon or something I can get a message out.
  - Jtsummers 4y ago
    > you can't easily see where the satellites are... Which is why when you're using it they guide you on how to orient the phone (per their released info so far, we'll have actual user reports in a few weeks).
    - Scoundreller 4y ago
      I look forward to whatever video game they create where you get the rescue points for holding your phone in the right orientation.
      - saghm 4y ago
        And if you don't, it presumably says "you're holding it wrong!"
zarriak 4y ago
I agree with your sentiment but this seemed in the keynote to be something you had to do on purpose and not like the normal always on find my.
SergeAx 4y ago
Correction: if they shareholders wanted.

toomuchtodo 4y ago

AirTags are even more compelling when your sensor fabric is satellite comms enabled.

lostlogin 4y ago
Not if you can’t share them with family. What the hell is that all about? If this has changed, scratch all of the above.
- nikdoof 4y ago
  I had the (dumb) idea of putting an AirTag in the family car, with the idea of being able to get a rough idea of where it is parked without depending on the terrible manf provided app. Every time my partner would drive the car it would ping away for a good 2-3 minutes due to the safety notifications. We're all part of the same family account, I don't really understand why it isn't an option to just ignore it.
  - mschuster91 4y ago
    > We're all part of the same family account, I don't really understand why it isn't an option to just ignore it. Because there are way too many spouses who go to as absurd lengths as setting private investigators on their partners. Stalking is just as much a concern inside families as it is for everyday persons - I might be tempted to say that the impact is worse given the potential for domestic violence. Or just imagine fundamentalist parents tracking their children to Planned Parenthood, a known LGBT-friendly place or whatever. Ideally, there would be laws and regulations on trackers - and not just hardware-ones like the AirTags, but also software-based ones - that mandate features to prevent abuse, but sadly politicians haven't caught up on tech developments yet.
    - mort96 4y ago
      That still doesn't explain why it's not an option _for nikdoof's partner_ to choose to disable notifications from that particular AirPod. It makes total sense why nikdoof shouldn't be able to disable it for their partner.

cyanydeez 4y ago

How soon till this is just. A stalker feature

Jtsummers 4y ago
You have control over who can see your location in Find My. If a stalker has access, that means they're already someone you trust or you've never looked at the list of people you're sharing your location with.
ShakataGaNai 4y ago
Well, it's fairly easy to turn off. If you are in a situation in which you think you might be stalked through technology, you should certainly check your Find My along with any applicable location sharing Applications (both Android and Apple, such as google maps location sharing). So I doubt this will be used much as a stalker feature. Unless of course they hide a phone on your person/vehicle in such a way that it is both totally unnoticeable to you AND maintains a very clear view of the sky. Apple said that sending messages could take a minute or more with even light foliage, so hiding it in/under a car will be a total no-go.

BiteCode_dev 4y ago

Ah, tracking the entire population even in the highest mountain and the deepest desert. And all that to protect your love ones, of course. People apparently forgot all about PRISM already. That didn't take long.

xbmcuser 4y ago
Its amazing to me how easily people are willing to give Apple their data compared to Google, Facebook or Microsoft. Specially looking at how Apple was to willing to put its servers in countries that want control of the data. I think people seem to forget the privacy fight was not about privacy from advertisers but from government over reach. People are looking at Google for building skynet but Apple seems to be successfully building it and people are enthusiastically adopting it.
- BiteCode_dev 4y ago
  Apple is much better at marketting than Google, Facebook or Microsoft.
- simonh 4y ago
  Apple has a really strong track record of resisting Government intrusion, within the bounds of the law, not selling customer data to third parties, and holding app developers to account for the privacy of their apps. The others have business models based entirely on selling user data. The contentious element is the "within the bounds of the law" bit. In the US and Europe that means a lot, because Apple can use the courts to block government overreach and they have done so. In China they can't do that, so they don't just as nobody else operating within China can. Google does deserve credit for refusing to operate their search services within China, while Apple and many other companies decided they were willing to do business there on Chinese government terms.
leokennis 4y ago
There are articles/white papers available, showing Find My info is only visible to people you authorize it to.

tinus_hn 4y ago

> You can now There is an optional feature where you can choose to share your current location using a satellite even if you don’t have coverage. It would be stupid to use this capacity to track users because the data is not worth more than what you can get for free if you just cache the location and wait for the user to move into cellular coverage again. There is no conspiracy here.