8 ms·

A mysterious new Babylon 5 project is coming sooner than you think

69 points by cpeterso 4y ago

gigel82 4y ago
Do Stargate next :)
- Keyframe 4y ago
  Or continue SGU. It just got started being interesting before it was cancelled!
  - koheripbal 4y ago
    The 2nd half of the season 2 was good (great even). ...but sadly it lost too many fans because of the bad first season and first half of the 2nd season. Excellent soundtrack though.
  - green-salt 4y ago
    So true, I was loving the main storyline, but they had to ruin it all with a bad soap opera draped around the plot.
- midasuni 4y ago
  Brad Wright keeps teasing with a continuation. It’s tricky. Part of the appeal of SG1 was it was based in todays world, with contemporary relatable characters playing on a galactic stage. the credibility of that got stretched as it went on, especially once they started doing things like building spaceships. I worry some of the original appeal is lost with a continuation, but a straight reboot of the concept would be very hard to replace the chemistry
- ShakataGaNai 4y ago
  The difference between B5 and SG is universe. B5 had a great universe but most people would probably be ok with rebooting it. It was a single unified story that was completed to excellence. Sure you could also jump around elsewhere in the time, but not sticking too close to the original canon probably would be fine. Stargate has 19 seasons and 2 movies, spread across SG1, Atlantis, Universe, Origins & Infinity. Rebooting that would be... dropping a tactical nuke on the franchise. Plus they've always left that universe "open" (look at Unending, the ending of SG1, they step back into the gate like its just another day), feels like there is so much more to explore.
joaomacp 4y ago
Babylon 5 is a well made SciFi show and I'd recommend it! I'm currently on season 3, started watching it because of Casey Muratori's (video game programmer, author of "Handmade Hero" educational streams) series of interviews with Jonas Kyratzes (video game designer, writer of "Talos Principle"), where they discuss the show: [0] The distinguishing point about the show is that it features a coherent world, where some small detail happening in one episode can come back 6 episodes later. It's also coherent in between seasons, since it was pre-planned as a 5-season show spanning exactly 5 years on the Babylon 5 station. Also, it features early computer animated 3D art made on Amiga computers. It hasn't aged that well but gets the job done. [0]: https://youtu.be/iASsvQ8sX9w https://youtu.be/iASsvQ8sX9w
- wvenable 4y ago
  Season 1 is a bit rough but there is some pay off in terms of foreshadowing/continuity in later seasons that make it better in retrospect. Unfortunately for the 5 year arc, they weren't sure they'd get a Season 5 so much of plot ends in Season 4 and Season 5 suffers for it.
  - ekidd 4y ago
    Yes, Season 1 is really uneven. For new viewers, if you have someone to pick out the important episodes, then you can skip the rest and come back later. (And you can always skip "TKO".) Seasons 2 to through 4 are still some of my all-time favorite science fiction TV. The three-episode mini-arc of "Messages from Earth", "Point of No Return" and "Severed Dreams" (IIRC) is still incredibly intense. The closest thing I can think of today is probably The Expanse. It has the same mix of human politics in the face of aliens we cannot comprehend. Of course, The Expanse has a higher budget and more consistent acting. In a lot of ways, Babylon 5 is the first "streaming-style" show. There's a clear series arc, viewers are expected to know what happened in previous episodes, and there's plenty of foreshadowing for the attentive viewer. (The original online Babylon 5 fandom kept track of every tiny hint.) Buffy was also moving in that direction, and Star Trek quickly followed.
    - 4y ago
smeagull 4y ago
I mean, I'm excited - loved the original. But, I've seen to many reboots crap all over their source material. I don't know what has changed about how tv shows and movies are made per se, but something definitely has. I think SNW has been the only show in recent memory that I've liked. Is this just me, or do others feel similar?
- jandrese 4y ago
  Babylon 5 was excellent. Crusade was killed off way too soon. The B5 movies however... Legend of the Rangers was really bad. Also: "All of the main cast still around participated" makes me feel sad. Andreas Katsulas is a hard act to follow.
  - Sharlin 4y ago
    The two "myth arc" movies, "In the Beginning" and "A Call to Arms" are quite good. ItB shows us the Human–Minbari War – the conflict that led to the construction of the Babylon stations, and ACtA similarly sets the stage for Crusade.
- paganel 4y ago
  > Is this just me, or do others feel similar? Same feeling here, but in my case I'm blaming it on me getting slightly older (passed the 40-year mark recently). I'm also looking at past TV series that I definitely liked back in the day (and which I still do) with different eyes. For example, when watching The Office (the US version) I've started to take Dwight's side more and more, while hating on almost any common action taken by Jim and Pam. Also, the more I re-watch Seinfeld the more I feel as one with George Costanza, and even with his dad (played by Jerry Stiller).
  - jrootabega 4y ago
    I remember watching MASH reruns as a teenager and thinking that Hawkeye was an asshole and Frank was usually right.
- midasuni 4y ago
jrootabega 4y ago
Pleasantly surprised that Peter Jurasik is still alive, given the circumstances.
- layer8 4y ago
  What circumstances?
  - jrootabega 4y ago
    The B5 Curse. The popular belief is that an unusual number of the actors have died, and many of them in abnormal/unfortunate circumstances. His character seemed older than most on the show (but Jurasik wasn't, I just learned). Plus the actors for his two closest relationships on the show have died.
tablespoon 4y ago
Does this reboot mean they'll be able to pay to get their CGI assets recreated, and re-render the original 90s-era series? For those who don't know. The original B5 was shot on film for maximum definition, but the CGI (which was used heavily for a show of that era) was only rendered at NTSC resolutions to save money. The thought was they could just re-render at a higher resolution later. However the special effects company that did it went out of business, and all the CGI assets were lost. IIRC, they've never had the money re-do the CGI, so the best they've been able to do to re-release it is upscale the NTSC (which is far from ideal).
- phire 4y ago
  > The original B5 was shot on film for maximum definition My understanding is that the quality of 16mm film was low enough that viewers could tell even over broadcast NTSC. And the next affordable step up (the same 32mm film and cameras used for most feature films) just so happened to have high enough quality that we can now do 4k remasters.
  - tablespoon 4y ago
    My understanding is Babylon 5 was shot on 35mm film -- the same used for movies.
    - phire 4y ago
      Brainfart. Why did I think movies use 32mm? Probably because it was double 16mm.
- Zardoz84 4y ago
  An exworker of these CGI studio showed some time ago some of the original assets and scenes rendered at high resolution. And it looks awesome.
stuxnet79 4y ago
Babylon 5 was the shining star of 90s television sci-fi. DS9 was the closest to B5 in terms of scope and structure but it just couldn't hold a candle to it. TNG was much too different from B5 so you can't really compare them both (apples and oranges).
- AdamJacobMuller 4y ago
  Babylon 5 has not aged as well as DS9 unfortunately. While Babylon 5 had some amazing talent and the better story arcs, DS9 had a better cast in many ways, Avery Brooks and Rene Auberjonois and Michael Dorn and others really leaned into their performances in a way which I think only Mira Furlan and Andreas Katsulas really did on B5. Writing this makes me sad about how may of the above are no longer with us.
evo_9 4y ago
Super happy to hear this, some of the best TV sci-fi ever created are episodes on that TV show. In particular the Babylon 4 episodes are just mind blowing. I can’t say anymore other than the pay off as well worth it to get through, as others have mentioned, the end of season four which is really the main plot arc fully realized, and it’s quite impressive.
temp0826 4y ago
Loved the stories of B5 but loathed the acting. Felt like a weird soap opera or an overly dramatic play
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
KerrAvon 4y ago
I was really excited a few years ago to finally get to watch B5 -- I could never find it on TV when it was first on. Everyone always said it was better than DS9, which I liked but was not so hard to find. But what a disappointment -- some actors can act well without direction, some can't, and B5 really shows you with stunning clarity which side of the line the actors are on. On top of frequently stilted dialogue (a JMS soft spot -- his screenwriting book is great but his dialogue examples are terrible) and missed opportunities for humor -- and with those aliens and that dialogue, you'd better take those opportunities if you don't want the audience to take them for you. The production values have also aged spectacularly poorly, but they probably looked decent on broadcast standard-def TV at the time and it's really not the primary issue. Which is to say, they can't really do worse than the original with JMS himself showrunning it again. Maybe it'll be a lot better since they have more money/support this time.
- Night_Thastus 4y ago
  Wow, I have a completely different opinion of it. To me, B5 is some of the best television I've ever watched. I like it for very different reasons than any of ST though, they're apples and oranges. Comparing to DS9 is a disservice to both shows, IMO. For me, that's because it tells a long-tail story really well. From the very beginning of the show they knew exactly what was going to happen later on, allowing everything to tie together really seamlessly. Watching that all unfold and your understanding of it grow is just fantastic. My only complaint is the whole S4/S5 debacle, because they got told it was being canceled so they had to wrap up quicker than expected, then got another season and had to re-open all the threads they just closed. Somewhat awkward. As for the actors, I think they did a fantastic job. They're part of the reason I don't think a newer version of the show could work - you just couldn't have a convincing Delenn, Mollari, G'kar, or Sheridan like they did in the original. And sure, the visuals of the show aren't fantastic. But who cares? A good show's merits aren't in its visuals, so long as they're sufficient to tell the story.
- poisonarena 4y ago
  you got filtered
- fezfight 4y ago
_8j50 4y ago
The CW? Guaranteed to crap. I once got drunk and tried to watch Roswell I think, I couldn't desensitize myself to make it through that. It's almost like they go to filmschool and recruit anyone who gets a D or under to save money on talent. The actors, cinematography, editing, soundtrack how can they manage to mess up everything? Please change my mind, have they made anything remotely watchable recently? How are they in business?
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- sp332 4y ago
  > The CW? No.
  - _8j50 4y ago
    I assumed project 2 will also be CW, rare to see different networks plan ahead of time to work on the same storyline.
    - sp332 4y ago
      He won't even confirm the "medium", so it could be a movie, a video game, or something audio-only without stepping on toes in that way.
Ankaios 4y ago
For anyone new to Babylon 5 that wants the authentic experience: http://www.midwinter.com/lurk/lurker.html http://www.midwinter.com/lurk/lurker.html
thrown_22 4y ago
I rather enjoyed that the backstory to Babylon 5 is basically the swamp castle Monty Python skit taken seriously. Lore: https://babylon5.fandom.com/wiki/Babylon_Project#The_Babylon_Stations https://babylon5.fandom.com/wiki/Babylon_Project#The_Babylon... Skit: https://youtu.be/aNaXdLWt17A?t=21 https://youtu.be/aNaXdLWt17A?t=21

69 points by cpeterso 4y ago

gigel82 4y ago

Do Stargate next :)

Keyframe 4y ago
Or continue SGU. It just got started being interesting before it was cancelled!
- koheripbal 4y ago
  The 2nd half of the season 2 was good (great even). ...but sadly it lost too many fans because of the bad first season and first half of the 2nd season. Excellent soundtrack though.
- green-salt 4y ago
  So true, I was loving the main storyline, but they had to ruin it all with a bad soap opera draped around the plot.
midasuni 4y ago
Brad Wright keeps teasing with a continuation. It’s tricky. Part of the appeal of SG1 was it was based in todays world, with contemporary relatable characters playing on a galactic stage. the credibility of that got stretched as it went on, especially once they started doing things like building spaceships. I worry some of the original appeal is lost with a continuation, but a straight reboot of the concept would be very hard to replace the chemistry
ShakataGaNai 4y ago
The difference between B5 and SG is universe. B5 had a great universe but most people would probably be ok with rebooting it. It was a single unified story that was completed to excellence. Sure you could also jump around elsewhere in the time, but not sticking too close to the original canon probably would be fine. Stargate has 19 seasons and 2 movies, spread across SG1, Atlantis, Universe, Origins & Infinity. Rebooting that would be... dropping a tactical nuke on the franchise. Plus they've always left that universe "open" (look at Unending, the ending of SG1, they step back into the gate like its just another day), feels like there is so much more to explore.

joaomacp 4y ago

Babylon 5 is a well made SciFi show and I'd recommend it! I'm currently on season 3, started watching it because of Casey Muratori's (video game programmer, author of "Handmade Hero" educational streams) series of interviews with Jonas Kyratzes (video game designer, writer of "Talos Principle"), where they discuss the show: [0] The distinguishing point about the show is that it features a coherent world, where some small detail happening in one episode can come back 6 episodes later. It's also coherent in between seasons, since it was pre-planned as a 5-season show spanning exactly 5 years on the Babylon 5 station. Also, it features early computer animated 3D art made on Amiga computers. It hasn't aged that well but gets the job done. [0]: https://youtu.be/iASsvQ8sX9w https://youtu.be/iASsvQ8sX9w

wvenable 4y ago
Season 1 is a bit rough but there is some pay off in terms of foreshadowing/continuity in later seasons that make it better in retrospect. Unfortunately for the 5 year arc, they weren't sure they'd get a Season 5 so much of plot ends in Season 4 and Season 5 suffers for it.
- ekidd 4y ago
  Yes, Season 1 is really uneven. For new viewers, if you have someone to pick out the important episodes, then you can skip the rest and come back later. (And you can always skip "TKO".) Seasons 2 to through 4 are still some of my all-time favorite science fiction TV. The three-episode mini-arc of "Messages from Earth", "Point of No Return" and "Severed Dreams" (IIRC) is still incredibly intense. The closest thing I can think of today is probably The Expanse. It has the same mix of human politics in the face of aliens we cannot comprehend. Of course, The Expanse has a higher budget and more consistent acting. In a lot of ways, Babylon 5 is the first "streaming-style" show. There's a clear series arc, viewers are expected to know what happened in previous episodes, and there's plenty of foreshadowing for the attentive viewer. (The original online Babylon 5 fandom kept track of every tiny hint.) Buffy was also moving in that direction, and Star Trek quickly followed.
  - 4y ago

smeagull 4y ago

I mean, I'm excited - loved the original. But, I've seen to many reboots crap all over their source material. I don't know what has changed about how tv shows and movies are made per se, but something definitely has. I think SNW has been the only show in recent memory that I've liked. Is this just me, or do others feel similar?

jandrese 4y ago
Babylon 5 was excellent. Crusade was killed off way too soon. The B5 movies however... Legend of the Rangers was really bad. Also: "All of the main cast still around participated" makes me feel sad. Andreas Katsulas is a hard act to follow.
- Sharlin 4y ago
  The two "myth arc" movies, "In the Beginning" and "A Call to Arms" are quite good. ItB shows us the Human–Minbari War – the conflict that led to the construction of the Babylon stations, and ACtA similarly sets the stage for Crusade.
paganel 4y ago
> Is this just me, or do others feel similar? Same feeling here, but in my case I'm blaming it on me getting slightly older (passed the 40-year mark recently). I'm also looking at past TV series that I definitely liked back in the day (and which I still do) with different eyes. For example, when watching The Office (the US version) I've started to take Dwight's side more and more, while hating on almost any common action taken by Jim and Pam. Also, the more I re-watch Seinfeld the more I feel as one with George Costanza, and even with his dad (played by Jerry Stiller).
- jrootabega 4y ago
  I remember watching MASH reruns as a teenager and thinking that Hawkeye was an asshole and Frank was usually right.
midasuni 4y ago

jrootabega 4y ago

Pleasantly surprised that Peter Jurasik is still alive, given the circumstances.

layer8 4y ago
What circumstances?
- jrootabega 4y ago
  The B5 Curse. The popular belief is that an unusual number of the actors have died, and many of them in abnormal/unfortunate circumstances. His character seemed older than most on the show (but Jurasik wasn't, I just learned). Plus the actors for his two closest relationships on the show have died.

tablespoon 4y ago

Does this reboot mean they'll be able to pay to get their CGI assets recreated, and re-render the original 90s-era series? For those who don't know. The original B5 was shot on film for maximum definition, but the CGI (which was used heavily for a show of that era) was only rendered at NTSC resolutions to save money. The thought was they could just re-render at a higher resolution later. However the special effects company that did it went out of business, and all the CGI assets were lost. IIRC, they've never had the money re-do the CGI, so the best they've been able to do to re-release it is upscale the NTSC (which is far from ideal).

phire 4y ago
> The original B5 was shot on film for maximum definition My understanding is that the quality of 16mm film was low enough that viewers could tell even over broadcast NTSC. And the next affordable step up (the same 32mm film and cameras used for most feature films) just so happened to have high enough quality that we can now do 4k remasters.
- tablespoon 4y ago
  My understanding is Babylon 5 was shot on 35mm film -- the same used for movies.
  - phire 4y ago
    Brainfart. Why did I think movies use 32mm? Probably because it was double 16mm.
Zardoz84 4y ago
An exworker of these CGI studio showed some time ago some of the original assets and scenes rendered at high resolution. And it looks awesome.

stuxnet79 4y ago

Babylon 5 was the shining star of 90s television sci-fi. DS9 was the closest to B5 in terms of scope and structure but it just couldn't hold a candle to it. TNG was much too different from B5 so you can't really compare them both (apples and oranges).

AdamJacobMuller 4y ago
Babylon 5 has not aged as well as DS9 unfortunately. While Babylon 5 had some amazing talent and the better story arcs, DS9 had a better cast in many ways, Avery Brooks and Rene Auberjonois and Michael Dorn and others really leaned into their performances in a way which I think only Mira Furlan and Andreas Katsulas really did on B5. Writing this makes me sad about how may of the above are no longer with us.

evo_9 4y ago

Super happy to hear this, some of the best TV sci-fi ever created are episodes on that TV show. In particular the Babylon 4 episodes are just mind blowing. I can’t say anymore other than the pay off as well worth it to get through, as others have mentioned, the end of season four which is really the main plot arc fully realized, and it’s quite impressive.

temp0826 4y ago

Loved the stories of B5 but loathed the acting. Felt like a weird soap opera or an overly dramatic play

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]

KerrAvon 4y ago

I was really excited a few years ago to finally get to watch B5 -- I could never find it on TV when it was first on. Everyone always said it was better than DS9, which I liked but was not so hard to find. But what a disappointment -- some actors can act well without direction, some can't, and B5 really shows you with stunning clarity which side of the line the actors are on. On top of frequently stilted dialogue (a JMS soft spot -- his screenwriting book is great but his dialogue examples are terrible) and missed opportunities for humor -- and with those aliens and that dialogue, you'd better take those opportunities if you don't want the audience to take them for you. The production values have also aged spectacularly poorly, but they probably looked decent on broadcast standard-def TV at the time and it's really not the primary issue. Which is to say, they can't really do worse than the original with JMS himself showrunning it again. Maybe it'll be a lot better since they have more money/support this time.

Night_Thastus 4y ago
Wow, I have a completely different opinion of it. To me, B5 is some of the best television I've ever watched. I like it for very different reasons than any of ST though, they're apples and oranges. Comparing to DS9 is a disservice to both shows, IMO. For me, that's because it tells a long-tail story really well. From the very beginning of the show they knew exactly what was going to happen later on, allowing everything to tie together really seamlessly. Watching that all unfold and your understanding of it grow is just fantastic. My only complaint is the whole S4/S5 debacle, because they got told it was being canceled so they had to wrap up quicker than expected, then got another season and had to re-open all the threads they just closed. Somewhat awkward. As for the actors, I think they did a fantastic job. They're part of the reason I don't think a newer version of the show could work - you just couldn't have a convincing Delenn, Mollari, G'kar, or Sheridan like they did in the original. And sure, the visuals of the show aren't fantastic. But who cares? A good show's merits aren't in its visuals, so long as they're sufficient to tell the story.
poisonarena 4y ago
you got filtered
fezfight 4y ago

_8j50 4y ago

The CW? Guaranteed to crap. I once got drunk and tried to watch Roswell I think, I couldn't desensitize myself to make it through that. It's almost like they go to filmschool and recruit anyone who gets a D or under to save money on talent. The actors, cinematography, editing, soundtrack how can they manage to mess up everything? Please change my mind, have they made anything remotely watchable recently? How are they in business?

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
sp332 4y ago
> The CW? No.
- _8j50 4y ago
  I assumed project 2 will also be CW, rare to see different networks plan ahead of time to work on the same storyline.
  - sp332 4y ago
    He won't even confirm the "medium", so it could be a movie, a video game, or something audio-only without stepping on toes in that way.

Ankaios 4y ago

For anyone new to Babylon 5 that wants the authentic experience: http://www.midwinter.com/lurk/lurker.html http://www.midwinter.com/lurk/lurker.html

thrown_22 4y ago

I rather enjoyed that the backstory to Babylon 5 is basically the swamp castle Monty Python skit taken seriously. Lore: https://babylon5.fandom.com/wiki/Babylon_Project#The_Babylon_Stations https://babylon5.fandom.com/wiki/Babylon_Project#The_Babylon... Skit: https://youtu.be/aNaXdLWt17A?t=21 https://youtu.be/aNaXdLWt17A?t=21