5 ms·

Sure, they probably had a previous agreement assuring the auction, but it wasn't the police's job to make that decision. They're the executive, not the judicat

Sure, they probably had a previous agreement assuring the auction, but it wasn't the police's job to make that decision. They're the executive, not the judicative. A judge would've had to make this assertion, which clearly didn't happen as they didn't have a warrant. The officers still drove all over the state into a different jurisdiction (while using taxpayers money). They likely could've gotten the goat without making it into such a shit show, that's exactly the point I was trying to make.

JumpCrisscross 4y ago
> it wasn't the police's job to make that decision If my car is stolen and I see it in someone’s garage, I absolutely expect the police to do something about it. In this case, the facts about lawful ownership were straightforward.
- threatofrain 4y ago
  Although the conceptual boundary is thin, stealing is a crime and contractual violation is a tort. If we believe that our rights are secured by the counterbalancing of powers, then we ought not permit police to adjudicate torts.
  - JumpCrisscross 4y ago
    > stealing is a crime and contractual violation is a tort Purchase and sale of livestock has a deep body of law attached. Judicial involvement isn’t always necessary, though either side can petition its review. (These cops had a warrant, by the way [1].) In this case, the parents waited until after the auction, after the seizure and after the slaughter to do that. [1] https://dig.abclocal.go.com/kgo/PDF/2022-08-31-Complaint.pdf https://dig.abclocal.go.com/kgo/PDF/2022-08-31-Complaint.pdf
- kittiepryde 4y ago
  An anecdote- my mother's car was stolen, stripped for parts, and the repair shop that stole out, had it visible and out in the open the entire time, police (Virginia, Hampton area, a decade ago) refused to recover property, and we couldn't afford to go to court.
- Hizonner 4y ago
  The facts were straightforward and against your position. The girl was at all times the lawful owner of the goat. The goat was not legally sold. Even if she had not been, there was a good faith dispute, under which circumstances destruction of the disputed property is not the sort of thing that a court would allow. Which is why police need to not play cowboy. By the way, if your car is stolen and you see it in somebody's garage, the police are NOT just going to grab it and hand it back to you. They'll impound it until things are settled. Complaint: https://dig.abclocal.go.com/kgo/PDF/2022-08-31-Complaint.pdf https://dig.abclocal.go.com/kgo/PDF/2022-08-31-Complaint.pdf
  - JumpCrisscross 4y ago
    > girl was at all times the lawful owner of the goat. The goat was not legally sold. The complaint leaves this far from settled. > why police need to not play cowboy They got a warrant [1]. > if your car is stolen and you see it in somebody's garage, the police are NOT just going to grab it and hand it back to you I have recovered my phone from someone’s house with the help of police. They coöperated and in exchange I didn’t press charges. Had they not, I would have pressed, they’d have been arrested and sure, a court would have been involved. To the extent the police acted outside their authority, it was in not arresting. [1] https://dig.abclocal.go.com/kgo/PDF/2022-08-31-Complaint.pdf https://dig.abclocal.go.com/kgo/PDF/2022-08-31-Complaint.pdf page 9
    - ahahahahah 4y ago
      > They got a warrant [1]. They had no warrant to search or seize the goat from the farm that it was at [1]. [1] https://dig.abclocal.go.com/kgo/PDF/2022-08-31-Complaint.pdf https://dig.abclocal.go.com/kgo/PDF/2022-08-31-Complaint.pdf page 11
      - JumpCrisscross 4y ago
        > had no warrant to search or seize the goat from the farm that it was at If Sonoma Farm resisted the police, sure, there might be a Fourteenth Amendment claim in respect of the search. There is no indication they did. That makes the seizure totally valid.
- krisoft 4y ago
  > facts about lawful ownership were straightforward Clearly not, otherwise we wouldn’t be reading about it in the news. This was a civil dispute. One party is of the opinion that they bought a goat and the other party is of the opinion that they haven’t sold it. This is where you need a court to decide who is right and who is wrong.
- rdtwo 4y ago
  You must not live in any major city the west coast. Here if it’s stolen it’s theirs, police won’t help even if you can locate the stolen item
deleted 4y ago
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JumpCrisscross 4y ago

> it wasn't the police's job to make that decision If my car is stolen and I see it in someone’s garage, I absolutely expect the police to do something about it. In this case, the facts about lawful ownership were straightforward.

threatofrain 4y ago
Although the conceptual boundary is thin, stealing is a crime and contractual violation is a tort. If we believe that our rights are secured by the counterbalancing of powers, then we ought not permit police to adjudicate torts.
- JumpCrisscross 4y ago
  > stealing is a crime and contractual violation is a tort Purchase and sale of livestock has a deep body of law attached. Judicial involvement isn’t always necessary, though either side can petition its review. (These cops had a warrant, by the way [1].) In this case, the parents waited until after the auction, after the seizure and after the slaughter to do that. [1] https://dig.abclocal.go.com/kgo/PDF/2022-08-31-Complaint.pdf https://dig.abclocal.go.com/kgo/PDF/2022-08-31-Complaint.pdf
kittiepryde 4y ago
An anecdote- my mother's car was stolen, stripped for parts, and the repair shop that stole out, had it visible and out in the open the entire time, police (Virginia, Hampton area, a decade ago) refused to recover property, and we couldn't afford to go to court.
Hizonner 4y ago
The facts were straightforward and against your position. The girl was at all times the lawful owner of the goat. The goat was not legally sold. Even if she had not been, there was a good faith dispute, under which circumstances destruction of the disputed property is not the sort of thing that a court would allow. Which is why police need to not play cowboy. By the way, if your car is stolen and you see it in somebody's garage, the police are NOT just going to grab it and hand it back to you. They'll impound it until things are settled. Complaint: https://dig.abclocal.go.com/kgo/PDF/2022-08-31-Complaint.pdf https://dig.abclocal.go.com/kgo/PDF/2022-08-31-Complaint.pdf
- JumpCrisscross 4y ago
  > girl was at all times the lawful owner of the goat. The goat was not legally sold. The complaint leaves this far from settled. > why police need to not play cowboy They got a warrant [1]. > if your car is stolen and you see it in somebody's garage, the police are NOT just going to grab it and hand it back to you I have recovered my phone from someone’s house with the help of police. They coöperated and in exchange I didn’t press charges. Had they not, I would have pressed, they’d have been arrested and sure, a court would have been involved. To the extent the police acted outside their authority, it was in not arresting. [1] https://dig.abclocal.go.com/kgo/PDF/2022-08-31-Complaint.pdf https://dig.abclocal.go.com/kgo/PDF/2022-08-31-Complaint.pdf page 9
  - ahahahahah 4y ago
    > They got a warrant [1]. They had no warrant to search or seize the goat from the farm that it was at [1]. [1] https://dig.abclocal.go.com/kgo/PDF/2022-08-31-Complaint.pdf https://dig.abclocal.go.com/kgo/PDF/2022-08-31-Complaint.pdf page 11
    - JumpCrisscross 4y ago
      > had no warrant to search or seize the goat from the farm that it was at If Sonoma Farm resisted the police, sure, there might be a Fourteenth Amendment claim in respect of the search. There is no indication they did. That makes the seizure totally valid.
krisoft 4y ago
> facts about lawful ownership were straightforward Clearly not, otherwise we wouldn’t be reading about it in the news. This was a civil dispute. One party is of the opinion that they bought a goat and the other party is of the opinion that they haven’t sold it. This is where you need a court to decide who is right and who is wrong.
rdtwo 4y ago
You must not live in any major city the west coast. Here if it’s stolen it’s theirs, police won’t help even if you can locate the stolen item

deleted 4y ago

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