4 ms·

Let's not forget, the bubble being about getting these substances back from being banned and considered to dangerous for society to research and otherwise deal

Let's not forget, the bubble being about getting these substances back from being banned and considered to dangerous for society to research and otherwise deal with responsibly. Fits the theory that this is a paid hit piece, obviously without evidential support. Remind me, could there be an industry financially interested to get psychedelics back into the box?

eternalban 4y ago
> The findings were somewhat lackluster: it found that the psychedelic was only marginally better than traditional treatments at relieving depression. Not a peep about the side-effects of "traditional treatments", which presumably include the designer drugs.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
yung_steezy 4y ago
I'm not sure this is necessarily a hit piece. There have been a few high profile cases of psychedelic therapists in countries like Canada being investigated for questionable practice. At the moment we're in a bit of a wild west where the actual procedures surrounding the use of these drugs as treatment are not standardised.
- BobbyJo 4y ago
  That feel less like a bubble bursting and more like a cage breaking.
- Lacerda69 4y ago
  Your comment sparked some interest in me and I found this article to be very detailed and nuanced: https://www.madinamerica.com/2021/09/ending-silence-psychedelic-therapy-abuse/ https://www.madinamerica.com/2021/09/ending-silence-psychede... If you know other sources on your comment, I would love to check them out as well!
NoToP 4y ago
What industry conspiracy are you trying to insinuate? Is it big pharma? Doubt it. Guess who would ultimately own the labs, run the clinical trials, and be first to market with a safe and precise FDA approved antidepressant based on a psychedelic active ingredient. Let's not forget LSD started as a research chemical in a drug r&d lab in Switzerland. Industry never wanted it criminalized. It's not a good look to rationalise away all bad news as "paid hit piece".
- mandmandam 4y ago
  It's not a rare or unheard of thing for an industry to attack solutions that are significantly better than their own (very profitable) solution. Psychedelics _can_ permanently fix problems - anxiety, alcoholism, depression - that otherwise would make pharma companies huge amounts of money. LSD is incredibly cheap to manufacture. There's no patent on it. Same with mushrooms and many others. Now look at how much money those pharma companies made with Lexapro, with Prozac, with Risperdal. Even when they were caught marketing those drugs for unapproved uses, to children; and caught buying academics opinions, they made billions off the stuff. Compare the list of side effects on their drugs to mushrooms or LSD. Compare the effectiveness. These companies aren't maintaining huge divisions of PR goons for the fun of it; they absolutely are out there on the internet, lobbying, and on traditional media, convincing people to form opinions like yours.
  - dr_dshiv 4y ago
    > It's not a rare or unheard of thing for an industry to attack solutions that are significantly better than their own (very profitable) solution See Juul, attacked by both the smoking industry and anti-smoking lobby. Ecigs don’t have brand loyalty like “Marlboro”—and cigarettes cost only 6 cents a pack to manufacture. So, buy Juul, kill it, preserve the massive profit flow.
    - mandmandam 4y ago
      Yep. That's a pretty clear example, and it sucks to see people falling for it. Vaping is immediately and obviously far less bad than smoking, but they can't say that. The fear-porn around the issue is wild, and I'm certain legislators and media types are getting brown envelopes to demonize vaping. Cannabis / hemp would be another. Alcohol giants, cotton, painkillers, and many more have a lot to lose to an alternative that's superior in many ways. Fossil fuel companies spend huge amounts putting doubt into people's mind about nuclear and renewables, lobbying for themselves, systematically buying academics and news stories. With the above examples, there are people dying thanks to the PR FUD. Microsoft did similar stuff, buying and squashing competitors by any means necessary. Even the DoJ had to step in when they tried to own the internet. Some people think MS Office is still around because it's better than the competitors, lol. Banks lobby to make business as awkward as possible for credit unions. Bitcoin maxis smear superior tech with the most laughable arguments. Etc.

eternalban 4y ago

> The findings were somewhat lackluster: it found that the psychedelic was only marginally better than traditional treatments at relieving depression. Not a peep about the side-effects of "traditional treatments", which presumably include the designer drugs.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

yung_steezy 4y ago

I'm not sure this is necessarily a hit piece. There have been a few high profile cases of psychedelic therapists in countries like Canada being investigated for questionable practice. At the moment we're in a bit of a wild west where the actual procedures surrounding the use of these drugs as treatment are not standardised.

BobbyJo 4y ago
That feel less like a bubble bursting and more like a cage breaking.
Lacerda69 4y ago
Your comment sparked some interest in me and I found this article to be very detailed and nuanced: https://www.madinamerica.com/2021/09/ending-silence-psychedelic-therapy-abuse/ https://www.madinamerica.com/2021/09/ending-silence-psychede... If you know other sources on your comment, I would love to check them out as well!

NoToP 4y ago

What industry conspiracy are you trying to insinuate? Is it big pharma? Doubt it. Guess who would ultimately own the labs, run the clinical trials, and be first to market with a safe and precise FDA approved antidepressant based on a psychedelic active ingredient. Let's not forget LSD started as a research chemical in a drug r&d lab in Switzerland. Industry never wanted it criminalized. It's not a good look to rationalise away all bad news as "paid hit piece".

mandmandam 4y ago
It's not a rare or unheard of thing for an industry to attack solutions that are significantly better than their own (very profitable) solution. Psychedelics _can_ permanently fix problems - anxiety, alcoholism, depression - that otherwise would make pharma companies huge amounts of money. LSD is incredibly cheap to manufacture. There's no patent on it. Same with mushrooms and many others. Now look at how much money those pharma companies made with Lexapro, with Prozac, with Risperdal. Even when they were caught marketing those drugs for unapproved uses, to children; and caught buying academics opinions, they made billions off the stuff. Compare the list of side effects on their drugs to mushrooms or LSD. Compare the effectiveness. These companies aren't maintaining huge divisions of PR goons for the fun of it; they absolutely are out there on the internet, lobbying, and on traditional media, convincing people to form opinions like yours.
- dr_dshiv 4y ago
  > It's not a rare or unheard of thing for an industry to attack solutions that are significantly better than their own (very profitable) solution See Juul, attacked by both the smoking industry and anti-smoking lobby. Ecigs don’t have brand loyalty like “Marlboro”—and cigarettes cost only 6 cents a pack to manufacture. So, buy Juul, kill it, preserve the massive profit flow.
  - mandmandam 4y ago
    Yep. That's a pretty clear example, and it sucks to see people falling for it. Vaping is immediately and obviously far less bad than smoking, but they can't say that. The fear-porn around the issue is wild, and I'm certain legislators and media types are getting brown envelopes to demonize vaping. Cannabis / hemp would be another. Alcohol giants, cotton, painkillers, and many more have a lot to lose to an alternative that's superior in many ways. Fossil fuel companies spend huge amounts putting doubt into people's mind about nuclear and renewables, lobbying for themselves, systematically buying academics and news stories. With the above examples, there are people dying thanks to the PR FUD. Microsoft did similar stuff, buying and squashing competitors by any means necessary. Even the DoJ had to step in when they tried to own the internet. Some people think MS Office is still around because it's better than the competitors, lol. Banks lobby to make business as awkward as possible for credit unions. Bitcoin maxis smear superior tech with the most laughable arguments. Etc.