3 ms·
There’s much truth here, but it isn’t the entire picture. Lisboa and Oporto are hideously overpriced, and it is indeed hard to see how a normal Portuguese earn
by madaxe_again 4y ago
There’s much truth here, but it isn’t the entire picture.
Lisboa and Oporto are hideously overpriced, and it is indeed hard to see how a normal Portuguese earner can afford to live in either. Even Vila Nova de Gaia, which was the “cheap” side of Oporto, is now parlously expensive.
This effect has bled along the coast, and many coastal villages now ask €200k for an unmodernised one bedroom house.
But… the interior of the country is still facing depopulation, and property prices and rents here (between Bragança and Miranda) are still low. A five bedroom house in a town in decent condition can be had for €100k. There’s a beautiful 16th c. T8 palazzo needing modernisation in our nearest town for €80k.
People don’t earn much here, but they don’t spend much, either - a lot of food is home grown or hunted and bartered, heating is from firewood, and most folks drive perhaps 50km in a week, as they live within walking distance of where they work. Almost every house that’s had modernisation done uses solar for hot water and to supplement power. They deployed a gas network four years ago, and shuttered it last, as nobody is using it. Property taxes on the above properties are about €100 a year.
They’re desperate for people to move out here - lots of vacancies, not enough people to fill them. They’ve rolled out gigabit fibre to the villages, which they are literally giving away. We’re the only estrangeiros in the county, bar returning Brasileiros.
So. The reality is that which is being played out all over the world. Cities are becoming unaffordable for mere mortals - and, in my view, that’s ok, as cities are past their useful life as industrial hubs and have principally become destinations and speculative investments.
I’m not advocating some sort of “return to the land”, but rather that people are going to have to consider that perhaps they don’t all have to live in the top 5 cities in their country.
Sure, I can’t get takeout here, but I can breathe fresh air, sit at a quiet cafe and chat with my friends in the village without enduring traffic whilst drinking my €0.60 coffee, and support local businesses run by local people, rather than vast corporate chains.
Since we’ve moved here, particularly during the pandemic, we have seen quite a few young Portuguese couples move here from Oporto - some with family ties, some without - they’re starting businesses, families, renovating old abandoned homes. It’s genuinely exciting to see the beginning of something.
The pendulum swings, the market speaks, the world turns. Sure, we may be facing down collapse - of the current way of doing things. Not of all things.
Edit: just to demonstrate the veracity of my statements re property prices here: https://www.idealista.pt/comprar-casas/braganca/vimioso/vimioso/ https://www.idealista.pt/comprar-casas/braganca/vimioso/vimi...
- zozbot234 4y ago> But… the interior of the country is still facing depopulation, and property prices and rents here are still low. Some people just don't think very highly of "flyover country". The culture is not what they're used to. Return to the land makes a whole lot of sense though, now that the basic infrastructure for hybrid remote working is pretty much ubiquitous (courtesy of COVID).
- buscoquadnary 4y agoThat's one of the things that always bothered me about cost of living arguments it always seems to be it's to expensive to live anywhere (inside of these several highly desirable locations that I want to live exclusively and are very expensive.) There are plenty of places to live and plenty of housing, just not where people want to be.
- aprdm 4y agoMaybe it's just a matter of time? In Canada even the small cities got unaffordable , mainly after COVID started. With the interest rate raise a lot of people are hoping for a crash, some banks are saying it will be up to this 20-40% in some cities. Hopefully that helps. There's no where livable in Canada that is affordable to have a house right now.
- jersak 4y agoNot gonna lie, im considering moving from BC to a farm in NS. With the mortgage i have on a 2 bdr apartment in the lower mainland i can buy up to 3 farms in NS, which is comically sad.
- zelphirkalt 4y agoSide fact, not really criticism: When I see abbreviations for US states, my brain starts inserting anything that comes to mind and is a location. In this case: "BC? British Columbia? NS? New Jersey, no that's not with an 's' ... Arg, no idea!" It is not mandatory for me to understand all the abbreviations. Just that sometimes I would like to understand more, without having to guess states.