6 ms·

Just as broken bones are a danger inherent in riding a motorbike, depression is one of the dangers inherent in trying to start a company. Understanding this le

by benl 15y ago

Just as broken bones are a danger inherent in riding a motorbike, depression is one of the dangers inherent in trying to start a company. Understanding this leads to two helpful realizations: 1. It's nothing to be ashamed of and should not be stigmatised 2. You would be wise to take precautions to protect against the danger (just like you would wear a helmet when riding). The danger is particularly strong for solo founders, simply because of the lifestyle some have to live. Long periods of time spent on your own, slow progress toward your goals -- these are signals that the depression-triggering algorithms in your mind will latch onto. Some things that may work to counter those signals: * Socialise with friends, family or new people every day. If you can't socialise on a particular day, spend some time making plans with people to socialise in the near future. * Be having sex, and regularly. Seriously, this is a very strong signal. * Exercise a lot. Run, swim, work out -- even just walk around the neighbourhood. * Plan your work to have near-term achievable milestones. * Eat healthily and avoid alcohol. A weak immune system leads to frequent illness, which leads to slower progress.

tgrass 15y ago
I live by these five rules and agree, but I agree succinctly, that is with the letter of what you wrote: these things work to counter the signals, they do not necessarily work to remove depression. As I understand it, depression can be caused by external issues (a loved one dying, losing a job) or internal issues (chemical imbalances). Again, as I understand it this list of ways to counter can help run-of-the-mill ennui, but it is not going to forestall the abyss for someone suffering from real depression. That individual needs professional guidance.
- benl 15y ago
  I fully agree. These are things that _can_ help you prevent yourself from suffering damage, but do not guarantee it.
- disgruntledphd2 15y ago
  There is no real evidence for the chemical imbalance theory of depression, in fact the meme about chemical imbalance was begun by pharmacuetical companies to explain how SSRI's work. That, and the failure of many of the new reuptake inhibitors, suggests that depression is not caused by chemical imbalances.
  - tgrass 15y ago
    Please provide corroboration for this. This could easily suggest to a casual reader (particularly one that is a part of a pick-yourself-up-by-your-bootstraps culture) to forgo pharmaceutical help. I cannot speak on that and recommend professional help.
    - sajid 15y ago
      When someone starts out on antidepressants, their neurotransmitter [1] levels return to normal almost immediately. However, patients usually only begin to see improvements 2 - 4 weeks later. This wouldn't be the case if depression was simply due to lowered neurotransmitter levels. However, all is not lost. A new theory suggests that patients have a lowered rate of neurogenesis (creation of new brain cells) and that serotonin is crucial in kick starting the process. [1] Patients usually have lowered levels of Serotonin, norepinephrine and dopamine.
    - DanBC 15y ago
      To say that depression is a chemical imbalance is to over-simplify the cause and treatment. People hearing the chemical imbalance hypothesis may think that there's no effective evidence based therapy available, or that they will need meds for the rest of their life, or that they are going to relapse for the rest of their life. That's not true. There are effective, evidence based, talking therapies. The most well known (Cognitive Behaviour Therapy) is simple to understand, easy to apply, and can be given by therapists or can be self-applied through websites (the Australian "Mood Gym" is one) or books ("mind over matter" is a good example). A person given just meds will be more likely to relapse than someone given meds and CBT. > I cannot speak on that and recommend professional help. Yes, professional help is important. In the UK front line treatment for mild to moderate depression is not medication, but is CBT. And CBT should be used for other illnesses too. My emphasis on things like CBT is because they have been shown to work; not because I don't think that depression is a "real illness'. See, for example, the use of CBT to treat pain suffered by cancer patients.
  - afterburner 15y ago
    I don't care enough about your ridiculous statement to go dig up evidence, but I care enough to relate my own anecdote: I have chemically induced depression in myself, as a side effect of a drug. As soon as I went off the drug, the depression went away.
parfe 15y ago
>Eat healthily and avoid alcohol I'd include abstaining from a regular caffeine habit as well. It will mask sleeping problems, and can increase stress and anxiety which lead to a loss of sleep which leads to more caffeine! http://stress.about.com/od/stresshealth/a/caffeine.htm http://stress.about.com/od/stresshealth/a/caffeine.htm
- paganel 15y ago
  > It will mask sleeping problems, and can increase stress and anxiety which lead to a loss of sleep which leads to more caffeine! It's either: be dependent on caffeine to start the day and help me go through it, or be dependent on alcohol to end a lousy and stressful day. I chose caffeine.
  - wavephorm 15y ago
    I hope that's said tongue-in-cheek.
- AlexandrB 15y ago
  I find that this is exactly true. Caffeine makes me feel worse in the medium term and exacerbates stressful situations. Having said that, it sometimes feels like a necessary evil to keep operating when sleep deprived :(
davidhansen 15y ago
> Be having sex, and regularly. I know that hipsters and other socially capable people have invaded the technology industry in the last few years, but it should be noted that an entreaty to most technologists to "just have more sex" is extremely unhelpful. Would you tell a homeless person to "just make more money"? As a matter of fact, telling this to someone whose depression has a large social disconnect component to it may trigger further feelings of inadequacy via the mental model of "I'm the only one who seems to be incapable of doing what is obviously so easy to this person, and everybody else."
- nickpinkston 15y ago
  The "have sex" comment is less "you suck if you're not getting laid" and more "if you have a SigOther, have sex". I've definitely found myself too tired for it after all the craziness of a day...
  - lusr 15y ago
    The problem is that somebody who is depressed doesn't think rationally - in fact, in the vast majority of the cases this dysfunctional thinking is precisely WHY they are depressed to begin with. They WILL see the advice in the negative way, not the positive way. Furthermore, in cases of severe depression or stress, a diminished sex drive is quite normal so sex isn't even an option - further fueling the feelings of inadequacies mentioned.
- yummyfajitas 15y ago
  Would you tell a homeless person to "just make more money"? Most homeless people are just plain crazy (e.g. schizophrenic or drug addict) and are unlikely to accept your advice. However, I would tell a typical non-crazy poor person to work harder [1] and develop moneymaking skills. Similarly, I'd tell a person who isn't getting laid to work harder at getting laid, and also to develop some getting-laid skills (I'd probably point him at pickup artist literature). I've found that the biggest difference between men who get laid and men who don't is that the former category ask a lot more women to sleep with them. [1] Most poor people don't work at all and many of those that do work only part time.
24pfilms 15y ago
Excellent info Benl. Having been on the startup ropes many times, your above points are key. I find that exercise has been a real boost to my mental health and allowing me new clarity of focus to problems. Startups are very, very hard, the percentage of success is very small. The media and techcrunch make it look so easy...but there are many that do not make it any where close to the big liquidity. Mix in questionable investors, that are motivated by greed, salaries that need to be paid and a girlfriend that needs to get....
daenz 15y ago
I'd like to add another one to that list: * get SUN. or if you can't, try tanning. get the vitamin D production going. it's done wonders for me
bfe 15y ago
There's a large body of solid research showing striking benefits from regular exercise in helping avoid and overcome mental illness, as well as physical illness. Even if you feel like you don't have the time or conditioning to do anything else, try going outside and taking a walk for fifteen minutes, and do at least this much every day, then gradually incorporate longer periods of exercise and other types of exercise on some days. The mental and physical health benefits are worth more than that much time invested. Edit to add: Also, no matter what you're working on, this is also a great way to clear your mind, get away from the daily routine, and let your most important thoughts float up to the surface, and/or give your thoughts a chance to float freely enough to come together in new ways.
- billpatrianakos 15y ago
  Absolutely! I'm a recovering drug addict (3 years sober) and I have found the closest thing to the heaven I once experienced on heroin is the state of mind regular exercise puts you in. You're in control, you feel more energetic, and on and on. It's a wonderful tool and it isn't used as often as its prescribed!
deleted 15y ago
[deleted]

by benl 15y ago

tgrass 15y ago

I live by these five rules and agree, but I agree succinctly, that is with the letter of what you wrote: these things work to counter the signals, they do not necessarily work to remove depression. As I understand it, depression can be caused by external issues (a loved one dying, losing a job) or internal issues (chemical imbalances). Again, as I understand it this list of ways to counter can help run-of-the-mill ennui, but it is not going to forestall the abyss for someone suffering from real depression. That individual needs professional guidance.

benl 15y ago
I fully agree. These are things that _can_ help you prevent yourself from suffering damage, but do not guarantee it.
disgruntledphd2 15y ago
There is no real evidence for the chemical imbalance theory of depression, in fact the meme about chemical imbalance was begun by pharmacuetical companies to explain how SSRI's work. That, and the failure of many of the new reuptake inhibitors, suggests that depression is not caused by chemical imbalances.
- tgrass 15y ago
  Please provide corroboration for this. This could easily suggest to a casual reader (particularly one that is a part of a pick-yourself-up-by-your-bootstraps culture) to forgo pharmaceutical help. I cannot speak on that and recommend professional help.
  - sajid 15y ago
    When someone starts out on antidepressants, their neurotransmitter [1] levels return to normal almost immediately. However, patients usually only begin to see improvements 2 - 4 weeks later. This wouldn't be the case if depression was simply due to lowered neurotransmitter levels. However, all is not lost. A new theory suggests that patients have a lowered rate of neurogenesis (creation of new brain cells) and that serotonin is crucial in kick starting the process. [1] Patients usually have lowered levels of Serotonin, norepinephrine and dopamine.
  - DanBC 15y ago
    To say that depression is a chemical imbalance is to over-simplify the cause and treatment. People hearing the chemical imbalance hypothesis may think that there's no effective evidence based therapy available, or that they will need meds for the rest of their life, or that they are going to relapse for the rest of their life. That's not true. There are effective, evidence based, talking therapies. The most well known (Cognitive Behaviour Therapy) is simple to understand, easy to apply, and can be given by therapists or can be self-applied through websites (the Australian "Mood Gym" is one) or books ("mind over matter" is a good example). A person given just meds will be more likely to relapse than someone given meds and CBT. > I cannot speak on that and recommend professional help. Yes, professional help is important. In the UK front line treatment for mild to moderate depression is not medication, but is CBT. And CBT should be used for other illnesses too. My emphasis on things like CBT is because they have been shown to work; not because I don't think that depression is a "real illness'. See, for example, the use of CBT to treat pain suffered by cancer patients.
- afterburner 15y ago
  I don't care enough about your ridiculous statement to go dig up evidence, but I care enough to relate my own anecdote: I have chemically induced depression in myself, as a side effect of a drug. As soon as I went off the drug, the depression went away.

parfe 15y ago

>Eat healthily and avoid alcohol I'd include abstaining from a regular caffeine habit as well. It will mask sleeping problems, and can increase stress and anxiety which lead to a loss of sleep which leads to more caffeine! http://stress.about.com/od/stresshealth/a/caffeine.htm http://stress.about.com/od/stresshealth/a/caffeine.htm

paganel 15y ago
> It will mask sleeping problems, and can increase stress and anxiety which lead to a loss of sleep which leads to more caffeine! It's either: be dependent on caffeine to start the day and help me go through it, or be dependent on alcohol to end a lousy and stressful day. I chose caffeine.
- wavephorm 15y ago
  I hope that's said tongue-in-cheek.
AlexandrB 15y ago
I find that this is exactly true. Caffeine makes me feel worse in the medium term and exacerbates stressful situations. Having said that, it sometimes feels like a necessary evil to keep operating when sleep deprived :(

davidhansen 15y ago

> Be having sex, and regularly. I know that hipsters and other socially capable people have invaded the technology industry in the last few years, but it should be noted that an entreaty to most technologists to "just have more sex" is extremely unhelpful. Would you tell a homeless person to "just make more money"? As a matter of fact, telling this to someone whose depression has a large social disconnect component to it may trigger further feelings of inadequacy via the mental model of "I'm the only one who seems to be incapable of doing what is obviously so easy to this person, and everybody else."

nickpinkston 15y ago
The "have sex" comment is less "you suck if you're not getting laid" and more "if you have a SigOther, have sex". I've definitely found myself too tired for it after all the craziness of a day...
- lusr 15y ago
  The problem is that somebody who is depressed doesn't think rationally - in fact, in the vast majority of the cases this dysfunctional thinking is precisely WHY they are depressed to begin with. They WILL see the advice in the negative way, not the positive way. Furthermore, in cases of severe depression or stress, a diminished sex drive is quite normal so sex isn't even an option - further fueling the feelings of inadequacies mentioned.
yummyfajitas 15y ago
Would you tell a homeless person to "just make more money"? Most homeless people are just plain crazy (e.g. schizophrenic or drug addict) and are unlikely to accept your advice. However, I would tell a typical non-crazy poor person to work harder [1] and develop moneymaking skills. Similarly, I'd tell a person who isn't getting laid to work harder at getting laid, and also to develop some getting-laid skills (I'd probably point him at pickup artist literature). I've found that the biggest difference between men who get laid and men who don't is that the former category ask a lot more women to sleep with them. [1] Most poor people don't work at all and many of those that do work only part time.

24pfilms 15y ago

Excellent info Benl. Having been on the startup ropes many times, your above points are key. I find that exercise has been a real boost to my mental health and allowing me new clarity of focus to problems. Startups are very, very hard, the percentage of success is very small. The media and techcrunch make it look so easy...but there are many that do not make it any where close to the big liquidity. Mix in questionable investors, that are motivated by greed, salaries that need to be paid and a girlfriend that needs to get....

daenz 15y ago

I'd like to add another one to that list: * get SUN. or if you can't, try tanning. get the vitamin D production going. it's done wonders for me

bfe 15y ago

There's a large body of solid research showing striking benefits from regular exercise in helping avoid and overcome mental illness, as well as physical illness. Even if you feel like you don't have the time or conditioning to do anything else, try going outside and taking a walk for fifteen minutes, and do at least this much every day, then gradually incorporate longer periods of exercise and other types of exercise on some days. The mental and physical health benefits are worth more than that much time invested. Edit to add: Also, no matter what you're working on, this is also a great way to clear your mind, get away from the daily routine, and let your most important thoughts float up to the surface, and/or give your thoughts a chance to float freely enough to come together in new ways.

billpatrianakos 15y ago
Absolutely! I'm a recovering drug addict (3 years sober) and I have found the closest thing to the heaven I once experienced on heroin is the state of mind regular exercise puts you in. You're in control, you feel more energetic, and on and on. It's a wonderful tool and it isn't used as often as its prescribed!

deleted 15y ago

[deleted]