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> We live on around £5 a day Is it really including boat maintenance costs?

jsmith45 4y ago
I'd be quite skeptical of that. Groceries, and fuel expenditures sure. Perhaps even clothing needs can be squeezed into such a budget. But the tools, dock time, and part costs for required maintenance items really don't seem plausible to fit into that budget, even if they provide 100% of all labor themselves. Plus if they run a YouTube channel, they have internet costs. Etc.
real-dino 4y ago
Not in a way where your main currency is GBP. On a plastic boat, you don't have to black the hull, but things do break, engines need replacement oil, new filters. Painting, leaks in window frames, wifi subscriptions. There is no way that figure is achievable outside a crazy initial investment which needs zero work, and even then, the work will pile up quicly.
fxtentacle 4y ago
"Follow their adventure on their YouTube channel Wildlings Sailing" The entire article is more or less an advertisement for a new lifestyle trend and they obviously interviewed people who want to show off that they belong. EDIT: And of course, their most popular video is ... "The Yunnan Cowgirl Sails to a Nudist Island" https://youtu.be/b72bjCyJLMo?t=305 https://youtu.be/b72bjCyJLMo?t=305 I'd say Mark and Nadiyana are professional influencers and now they got their big break by being featured in the Guardian.
- mr_woozy 4y ago
myself248 4y ago
I somewhat doubt it. I watch a bunch of these sailing channels, and most of these folks are pouring quite a bit of their YouTube revenue back into the boat just to keep it shipshape. Otherwise the "cruising lifestyle" includes a lot of shore time working random gigs to pay for some part that broke, then you get back on the water until it happens again. I'm happy that some of them can make this work, but there's a limited YouTube audience, and so a limited number of folks who can work that particular model. Brian of Sailing SV Delos for instance, initially set out planning to continue his software consultancy while working remotely, until there turned out to be money in sharing his journey. Others have other plans that work for them. But I doubt anyone has their boat maintenance _and_ food down to anywhere near 5£/day. Heck, a new set of sails alone (they last around ten years) will set you back several kilobucks depending on the size of the boat. So that's on the order of a dollar a day right there. A decent chartplotter/radar/AIS (pretty essential for safety) has a similar cost and lifespan, so add another dollar a day. You probably have a data connection to download weather maps, both for travel and for storm planning, and even if you're near shore using a local SIM card, that's at least a few bucks a month, and an Iridium backup even if you don't use it is a few more. Saltwater eats everything so nothing lasts as long as you'd like, whether it's instruments or appliances, and the combination of sunlight and saltwater does a number on both the standing rigging (steel cables, 10-20 year lifespan) and running rigging (ropes, ~5 year lifespan). Then add in the cost of hauling-out and repainting the bottom with anti-fouling paint every few years, and that stuff ain't cheap either. Add incidentals like batteries, lifejackets and a PLB, a tender/RIB and outboard, and I think you're on the order of $7-10/day just for the boat, and that's if everything goes "smoothly". Doing it cheaper may be possible, but I'd like to see the breakdown. That being said, $10/day for a lifestyle that includes unlimited travel (oh, remember to add passport and visa paperwork and entry fees, plus anchorage fees in certain harbors), is still nothing to sneeze at. I'm addicted to these channels because it's immensely interesting, after all.
- fxtentacle 4y ago
  socialblade estimate puts the channel of that first featured couple at $50 per day, which I believe would realistically pay for their lifestyle.
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- haroldp 4y ago
  Wildlings is def not running on $5/day. They likely spend that little on food and rent (moorings). But they are for sure on the extreme end of cruising cheaply. I think they own four shirts, and have to share them. Their boat came with newish sails, they use phones or tablets instead of a dedicated plotter, half of their boat refit was parts out of the marina rubbish bin, their tender looks like it belongs in a back yard swimming pool, etc. Probably only WindHippy or (old) Sam Holmes cruising cheaper on YouTube.
notahacker 4y ago
I doubt it includes their fuel costs
pengaru 4y ago
For the YouTubers, seems very unlikely. In general? If you're down for living in squalor basically like a homeless person squatting on a tiny fiberglass island you don't really maintain as a seagoing vessel, rowing to shore for supplies, then I'd say £5/day would be a life of luxury in that mode. I'm reminded of Richardson Bay near SF/Sausalito: https://www.sfchronicle.com/local/article/sausalito-encampment-richardson-bay-dunphy-park-16226059.php https://www.sfchronicle.com/local/article/sausalito-encampme... As usual cost of living depends on lifestyle and expectations.
- CryptoBanker 4y ago
  Of course that cost per day is only attainable on that location by breaking the law
rr888 4y ago
The two most widely-used sayings about boats are that they are “holes in the water, into which you throw money” and “the happiest day of a boat owner’s life is the day they buy the boat and the day they sell it.” 5 quid a day doesn't work.
lbrindze 4y ago
Probably not, but cruising is likely cheaper than you expect and (if you are currently living in a major US city) significantly cheaper than your current situation. Everyone has different standards of what they consider “liveable” especially when it comes to boat maintenance and preparedness. I cruised for a while just fine with almost nothing in the way of systems or electronics (paper/home brew charts, no radar/ais, no ac or refrigeration) boat expenses were definitely my largest slice of expense after food/beer and it still only accounted for about $3-5k per year (amortized over a few years). Some larger maintenance items are only semi annual, other big ticket items (eg sails) can be procured used and last for another 5+ years. Also I didn’t have an engine so I guess that costs money too to maintain but all of this is to say it’s like anything else… it’s as cheap or expensive as you make it
themagician 4y ago
If you were really good about budgeting and the frugal life, you might be able to do it at £50/day sustainably—and that doesn't include the cost of your time. You'd have to pick your spot strategically and you probably wouldn't be doing any ocean crossing at this level. Literally everything on a boat has to be replaced (other than the hull, hopefully) over time. Sails and rigging only last so long depending on where you are. Even good engines need to be rebuilt after 5k hours or so. Decks need to be redone. Antifouling needs to be reapplied. And those are just the big expenses that will average out over time. Anything that lasts over 10 years on a boat that is actively sailing should get a special award. That is to say, a £100,000 actively used sailboat will require at least £100,000 every 10 years to keep it safe and seaworthy. So right there you are starting at a base cost of around £25/day. Total cost is going to be somewhere around £50-£100/day, especially if you want access to a decent marina and/or mooring spot. At the upper end, £100/day, you can actually have quite a nice setup if you get a really good hull in the 10-14 meter range and are willing to put in the time and work to do the maintenance yourself. Plenty of left over money for groceries, shore trips, and other supplies. You could cross oceans safely. £5/day will get you nothing. That's only £150/mo, and the odds are good that you need to buy at least £150 worth of parts and cleaning materials a month. Depending on the boat, a single simple part like a latch can easily be £150 itself depending on where you are going to need get it shipped from and how quickly you need it. At £5/day you are pooping over the side of a boat which is rapidly disintegrating and you're probably suffering from general malnutrition and scurvy. So it definitely can be done, but at this level it's really just being homeless with extra steps.
- fy20 4y ago
  > So it definitely can be done, but at this level it's really just being homeless with extra steps. Vanlife is basically the same. You just need to accept that not showering for days and pooping in a bucket is your new normal. Maybe the real solution to homelessness is we need to lower our standards of living, so 'homes' can be more affordable.

I'd be quite skeptical of that. Groceries, and fuel expenditures sure. Perhaps even clothing needs can be squeezed into such a budget. But the tools, dock time, and part costs for required maintenance items really don't seem plausible to fit into that budget, even if they provide 100% of all labor themselves. Plus if they run a YouTube channel, they have internet costs. Etc.

real-dino 4y ago

Not in a way where your main currency is GBP. On a plastic boat, you don't have to black the hull, but things do break, engines need replacement oil, new filters. Painting, leaks in window frames, wifi subscriptions. There is no way that figure is achievable outside a crazy initial investment which needs zero work, and even then, the work will pile up quicly.

fxtentacle 4y ago

"Follow their adventure on their YouTube channel Wildlings Sailing" The entire article is more or less an advertisement for a new lifestyle trend and they obviously interviewed people who want to show off that they belong. EDIT: And of course, their most popular video is ... "The Yunnan Cowgirl Sails to a Nudist Island" https://youtu.be/b72bjCyJLMo?t=305 https://youtu.be/b72bjCyJLMo?t=305 I'd say Mark and Nadiyana are professional influencers and now they got their big break by being featured in the Guardian.

mr_woozy 4y ago

myself248 4y ago

I somewhat doubt it. I watch a bunch of these sailing channels, and most of these folks are pouring quite a bit of their YouTube revenue back into the boat just to keep it shipshape. Otherwise the "cruising lifestyle" includes a lot of shore time working random gigs to pay for some part that broke, then you get back on the water until it happens again. I'm happy that some of them can make this work, but there's a limited YouTube audience, and so a limited number of folks who can work that particular model. Brian of Sailing SV Delos for instance, initially set out planning to continue his software consultancy while working remotely, until there turned out to be money in sharing his journey. Others have other plans that work for them. But I doubt anyone has their boat maintenance _and_ food down to anywhere near 5£/day. Heck, a new set of sails alone (they last around ten years) will set you back several kilobucks depending on the size of the boat. So that's on the order of a dollar a day right there. A decent chartplotter/radar/AIS (pretty essential for safety) has a similar cost and lifespan, so add another dollar a day. You probably have a data connection to download weather maps, both for travel and for storm planning, and even if you're near shore using a local SIM card, that's at least a few bucks a month, and an Iridium backup even if you don't use it is a few more. Saltwater eats everything so nothing lasts as long as you'd like, whether it's instruments or appliances, and the combination of sunlight and saltwater does a number on both the standing rigging (steel cables, 10-20 year lifespan) and running rigging (ropes, ~5 year lifespan). Then add in the cost of hauling-out and repainting the bottom with anti-fouling paint every few years, and that stuff ain't cheap either. Add incidentals like batteries, lifejackets and a PLB, a tender/RIB and outboard, and I think you're on the order of $7-10/day just for the boat, and that's if everything goes "smoothly". Doing it cheaper may be possible, but I'd like to see the breakdown. That being said, $10/day for a lifestyle that includes unlimited travel (oh, remember to add passport and visa paperwork and entry fees, plus anchorage fees in certain harbors), is still nothing to sneeze at. I'm addicted to these channels because it's immensely interesting, after all.

fxtentacle 4y ago
socialblade estimate puts the channel of that first featured couple at $50 per day, which I believe would realistically pay for their lifestyle.
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haroldp 4y ago
Wildlings is def not running on $5/day. They likely spend that little on food and rent (moorings). But they are for sure on the extreme end of cruising cheaply. I think they own four shirts, and have to share them. Their boat came with newish sails, they use phones or tablets instead of a dedicated plotter, half of their boat refit was parts out of the marina rubbish bin, their tender looks like it belongs in a back yard swimming pool, etc. Probably only WindHippy or (old) Sam Holmes cruising cheaper on YouTube.

notahacker 4y ago

I doubt it includes their fuel costs

pengaru 4y ago

For the YouTubers, seems very unlikely. In general? If you're down for living in squalor basically like a homeless person squatting on a tiny fiberglass island you don't really maintain as a seagoing vessel, rowing to shore for supplies, then I'd say £5/day would be a life of luxury in that mode. I'm reminded of Richardson Bay near SF/Sausalito: https://www.sfchronicle.com/local/article/sausalito-encampment-richardson-bay-dunphy-park-16226059.php https://www.sfchronicle.com/local/article/sausalito-encampme... As usual cost of living depends on lifestyle and expectations.

CryptoBanker 4y ago
Of course that cost per day is only attainable on that location by breaking the law

rr888 4y ago

The two most widely-used sayings about boats are that they are “holes in the water, into which you throw money” and “the happiest day of a boat owner’s life is the day they buy the boat and the day they sell it.” 5 quid a day doesn't work.

lbrindze 4y ago

Probably not, but cruising is likely cheaper than you expect and (if you are currently living in a major US city) significantly cheaper than your current situation. Everyone has different standards of what they consider “liveable” especially when it comes to boat maintenance and preparedness. I cruised for a while just fine with almost nothing in the way of systems or electronics (paper/home brew charts, no radar/ais, no ac or refrigeration) boat expenses were definitely my largest slice of expense after food/beer and it still only accounted for about $3-5k per year (amortized over a few years). Some larger maintenance items are only semi annual, other big ticket items (eg sails) can be procured used and last for another 5+ years. Also I didn’t have an engine so I guess that costs money too to maintain but all of this is to say it’s like anything else… it’s as cheap or expensive as you make it

themagician 4y ago

If you were really good about budgeting and the frugal life, you might be able to do it at £50/day sustainably—and that doesn't include the cost of your time. You'd have to pick your spot strategically and you probably wouldn't be doing any ocean crossing at this level. Literally everything on a boat has to be replaced (other than the hull, hopefully) over time. Sails and rigging only last so long depending on where you are. Even good engines need to be rebuilt after 5k hours or so. Decks need to be redone. Antifouling needs to be reapplied. And those are just the big expenses that will average out over time. Anything that lasts over 10 years on a boat that is actively sailing should get a special award. That is to say, a £100,000 actively used sailboat will require at least £100,000 every 10 years to keep it safe and seaworthy. So right there you are starting at a base cost of around £25/day. Total cost is going to be somewhere around £50-£100/day, especially if you want access to a decent marina and/or mooring spot. At the upper end, £100/day, you can actually have quite a nice setup if you get a really good hull in the 10-14 meter range and are willing to put in the time and work to do the maintenance yourself. Plenty of left over money for groceries, shore trips, and other supplies. You could cross oceans safely. £5/day will get you nothing. That's only £150/mo, and the odds are good that you need to buy at least £150 worth of parts and cleaning materials a month. Depending on the boat, a single simple part like a latch can easily be £150 itself depending on where you are going to need get it shipped from and how quickly you need it. At £5/day you are pooping over the side of a boat which is rapidly disintegrating and you're probably suffering from general malnutrition and scurvy. So it definitely can be done, but at this level it's really just being homeless with extra steps.

fy20 4y ago
> So it definitely can be done, but at this level it's really just being homeless with extra steps. Vanlife is basically the same. You just need to accept that not showering for days and pooping in a bucket is your new normal. Maybe the real solution to homelessness is we need to lower our standards of living, so 'homes' can be more affordable.