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It’s the logo of the United Nations’ Sustainable Development Goals. And Japan is all in.

planetsprite 4y ago
Those goals being: No poverty, zero hunger, good health and well-being, quality education, gender equality, clean water and sanitation, affordable and clean energy, decent work and economic growth, industry, innovation and infrastructure, Reduced Inequality, Sustainable Cities and Communities, Responsible Consumption and Production, Climate Action, Life Below Water, Life On Land, Peace, Justice, and Strong Institutions, Partnerships for the Goals. All agreeable prospects, but all too vague and hard to define. They're more a wish-list than goals. For example, what defines poverty? Wages vs the median, or quality of life factors? What makes work "decent"? What does inequality mean in this context, economic, judicial, racial? Vague aspirational goals sound nice but are rarely met without considering the real decisions that have to be made to meet them. These things are things everyone wants, but what are we willing to sacrifice to meet them?
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- fezfight 4y ago
  Aim for best possible outcomes in each category, and be satisfied failing but pushing the overton window up.
- franciscop 4y ago
  Japan consistently ranks the last of the developed countries on gender equality[1], and they kill hundreds of dolphins a year in a frowned-upon manner[2], so are there any specific measures Japan is taking or is it all posturing? [1] https://www.asahi.com/ajw/articles/14668828 https://www.asahi.com/ajw/articles/14668828 [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taiji_dolphin_drive_hunt https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taiji_dolphin_drive_hunt
  - soperj 4y ago
    They're also one of 3 nations still hunting whales. Iceland and Norway are the others.
    - pvaldes 4y ago
      UK also.
      - soperj 4y ago
        is this a wales/whales joke? Everything I can see has the UK abandoning whaling in the 60s.
        pvaldes 4y ago
        My mistake. Is Denmark, not UK. https://edition.cnn.com/2022/07/11/europe/faroe-islands-whale-hunt-dolphin-limit-intl-scli-scn/index.html https://edition.cnn.com/2022/07/11/europe/faroe-islands-whal...
  - yongjik 4y ago
    Japan emits 8.5t CO2 per capita (2019), much less than the US (14.7t), though it's still worse than the UK (5.2t) or France (4.5t).
    - oefrha 4y ago
      And they’ve been hovering around that and on a trajectory of slow decrease long before this SDG thing is “suddenly everywhere”, so I doubt SDG has anything to do with it. This vacuous SDG thing sounds like bureaucrats and corporatists finding something to do to justify their jobs. It’s like trying to refactor working code into using abstract class factory factories.
      - yongjik 4y ago
        You're probably right about that, but I'm just saying that "They kill dolphins!" is a low-effort remark, when America is doing much more damage to the ocean via CO2 emission.
- dflock 4y ago
  Those are just the names of the high level goals! If you go here: https://sdgs.un.org/goals#goals https://sdgs.un.org/goals#goals then click on each goal, its expanded in more detail, including implementation targets, of which there are over 150.
- resoluteteeth 4y ago
  > All agreeable prospects, but all too vague and hard to define. They're more a wish-list than goals. > For example, what defines poverty? Wages vs the median, or quality of life factors? What makes work "decent"? What does inequality mean in this context, economic, judicial, racial? They're actually defined in far more detail: https://sustainabledevelopment.un.org/content/documents/21252030%20Agenda%20for%20Sustainable%20Development%20web.pdf https://sustainabledevelopment.un.org/content/documents/2125... (The details of the goals start around half way through)
- colechristensen 4y ago
  > For example, what defines poverty? Many, especially governments, have definitions of poverty which are statistical, either percentile or a proportion of median income which makes it either actually impossible (there will always be a bottom n percent) or practically impossible (nobody earning less than half median wages).
- narrator 4y ago
  They assume all these goals are mutually compatible. I see clean energy and climate action vs. everything else. Look at Sri Lanka for example. https://foreignpolicy.com/2022/03/05/sri-lanka-organic-farming-crisis/ https://foreignpolicy.com/2022/03/05/sri-lanka-organic-farmi...
- drewcoo 4y ago
  > All agreeable prospects Complete gender equality but otherwise only reduced inequality? I find that disagreeable.
- deepsun 4y ago
  And also whales. They eat them. And these goals say to eat more, to save the fish. PS: I'm not even sure whales eat fish that much. Either plankton or squid.
- JKCalhoun 4y ago
  > For example, what defines poverty? I think we can all agree that homelessness is a problem we should address. If we could somehow tackle that one our country would be in a better place. No need to kill the idea because we can't precisely describe what the definition is.
  - immibis 4y ago
    We can't even seem to agree on that. Many people - perhaps the majority - believe that homelessness is a deserved punishment for laziness etc.
    - JKCalhoun 4y ago
      Wow.
    - lioeters 4y ago
      I won't be surprised if those in the upper/ruling class considers maintaining a certain level of homelessness and unemployment as appropriate motivation to keep the working class in line.
      - JKCalhoun 4y ago
        That would seem ill advised. Having the whole cake should make you worry a bit about a growing population of people with nothing to lose.
      - immibis 4y ago
        Not sure about "the ruling class", but it's necessary for our economic system to work, yes. Look at the central bank inflation/unemployment dilemma.
zzzeek 4y ago
for evidence that this is mostly bullshit, look no further than bizarre things like this: > Whales, the argument goes, consume a ruinous quantity of fish, and controlling their population is critical for preserving the oceans’ diversity. An online video from an industry association recommends eating the mammals “to protect the balance of the marine ecosystem and contribute to marine S.D.G.s!” It is fascinating that whales have found a way to be both an endangered species, and an overpopulated ocean scourge (as an apex predator, no less) at the same time!
- freetime2 4y ago
  While I agree that is a fairly comical quote, I also think it’s an oversimplification to say that whales are “an endangered species”. There are many different species of whale, some of which are endangered and some are not. The humpback whale, for example, is no longer listed as endangered as of 2022.
  - pvaldes 4y ago
    Less than 500 North Pacific right whales remain in the planet, only 30 of them visit Alaska, and the rest live mostly around the Japanese sea. Spreading the idea that endangered animals eat "too much" is evil. Rotten to the core.
    - freetime2 4y ago
      I don’t think that’s relevant to the discussion here, because Japan does not hunt Right whales. Japan’s fishing ministry only allows hunting of Minke, Bryde’s, and Sei whales [1] - and in limited numbers which would not endanger the overall population of those species. [1] https://us.whales.org/our-4-goals/stop-whaling/whaling-in-japan/ https://us.whales.org/our-4-goals/stop-whaling/whaling-in-ja...
  - zzzeek 4y ago
    > The humpback whale, for example, is no longer listed as endangered as of 2022. I see, so , humpback whale population has just crossed the line of no longer being an endangered species, *this year*. So did they overnight become an environmental pest that is decimating the fish population? I am going to guess you would say no. So I don't think your comment is relevant to the actual point being made. If OTOH you are just applying some factual editing so that my amazing comment can be printed in a newspaper, let's clean up that language sure!
JKCalhoun 4y ago
The last time I felt the U.S. as a country had a goal that was outward looking, forward looking was when we were adopting the Metric System back in the early 70's when I was in elementary school. Good times.
- selimthegrim 4y ago
  https://twitter.com/HereToRebuild/status/1562584857653301250 https://twitter.com/HereToRebuild/status/1562584857653301250

Those goals being: No poverty, zero hunger, good health and well-being, quality education, gender equality, clean water and sanitation, affordable and clean energy, decent work and economic growth, industry, innovation and infrastructure, Reduced Inequality, Sustainable Cities and Communities, Responsible Consumption and Production, Climate Action, Life Below Water, Life On Land, Peace, Justice, and Strong Institutions, Partnerships for the Goals. All agreeable prospects, but all too vague and hard to define. They're more a wish-list than goals. For example, what defines poverty? Wages vs the median, or quality of life factors? What makes work "decent"? What does inequality mean in this context, economic, judicial, racial? Vague aspirational goals sound nice but are rarely met without considering the real decisions that have to be made to meet them. These things are things everyone wants, but what are we willing to sacrifice to meet them?

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
fezfight 4y ago
Aim for best possible outcomes in each category, and be satisfied failing but pushing the overton window up.
franciscop 4y ago
Japan consistently ranks the last of the developed countries on gender equality[1], and they kill hundreds of dolphins a year in a frowned-upon manner[2], so are there any specific measures Japan is taking or is it all posturing? [1] https://www.asahi.com/ajw/articles/14668828 https://www.asahi.com/ajw/articles/14668828 [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taiji_dolphin_drive_hunt https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taiji_dolphin_drive_hunt
- soperj 4y ago
  They're also one of 3 nations still hunting whales. Iceland and Norway are the others.
  - pvaldes 4y ago
    UK also.
    - soperj 4y ago
      is this a wales/whales joke? Everything I can see has the UK abandoning whaling in the 60s.
      - pvaldes 4y ago
        My mistake. Is Denmark, not UK. https://edition.cnn.com/2022/07/11/europe/faroe-islands-whale-hunt-dolphin-limit-intl-scli-scn/index.html https://edition.cnn.com/2022/07/11/europe/faroe-islands-whal...
- yongjik 4y ago
  Japan emits 8.5t CO2 per capita (2019), much less than the US (14.7t), though it's still worse than the UK (5.2t) or France (4.5t).
  - oefrha 4y ago
    And they’ve been hovering around that and on a trajectory of slow decrease long before this SDG thing is “suddenly everywhere”, so I doubt SDG has anything to do with it. This vacuous SDG thing sounds like bureaucrats and corporatists finding something to do to justify their jobs. It’s like trying to refactor working code into using abstract class factory factories.
    - yongjik 4y ago
      You're probably right about that, but I'm just saying that "They kill dolphins!" is a low-effort remark, when America is doing much more damage to the ocean via CO2 emission.
dflock 4y ago
Those are just the names of the high level goals! If you go here: https://sdgs.un.org/goals#goals https://sdgs.un.org/goals#goals then click on each goal, its expanded in more detail, including implementation targets, of which there are over 150.
resoluteteeth 4y ago
> All agreeable prospects, but all too vague and hard to define. They're more a wish-list than goals. > For example, what defines poverty? Wages vs the median, or quality of life factors? What makes work "decent"? What does inequality mean in this context, economic, judicial, racial? They're actually defined in far more detail: https://sustainabledevelopment.un.org/content/documents/21252030%20Agenda%20for%20Sustainable%20Development%20web.pdf https://sustainabledevelopment.un.org/content/documents/2125... (The details of the goals start around half way through)
colechristensen 4y ago
> For example, what defines poverty? Many, especially governments, have definitions of poverty which are statistical, either percentile or a proportion of median income which makes it either actually impossible (there will always be a bottom n percent) or practically impossible (nobody earning less than half median wages).
narrator 4y ago
They assume all these goals are mutually compatible. I see clean energy and climate action vs. everything else. Look at Sri Lanka for example. https://foreignpolicy.com/2022/03/05/sri-lanka-organic-farming-crisis/ https://foreignpolicy.com/2022/03/05/sri-lanka-organic-farmi...
drewcoo 4y ago
> All agreeable prospects Complete gender equality but otherwise only reduced inequality? I find that disagreeable.
deepsun 4y ago
And also whales. They eat them. And these goals say to eat more, to save the fish. PS: I'm not even sure whales eat fish that much. Either plankton or squid.
JKCalhoun 4y ago
> For example, what defines poverty? I think we can all agree that homelessness is a problem we should address. If we could somehow tackle that one our country would be in a better place. No need to kill the idea because we can't precisely describe what the definition is.
- immibis 4y ago
  We can't even seem to agree on that. Many people - perhaps the majority - believe that homelessness is a deserved punishment for laziness etc.
  - JKCalhoun 4y ago
    Wow.
  - lioeters 4y ago
    I won't be surprised if those in the upper/ruling class considers maintaining a certain level of homelessness and unemployment as appropriate motivation to keep the working class in line.
    - JKCalhoun 4y ago
      That would seem ill advised. Having the whole cake should make you worry a bit about a growing population of people with nothing to lose.
    - immibis 4y ago
      Not sure about "the ruling class", but it's necessary for our economic system to work, yes. Look at the central bank inflation/unemployment dilemma.

zzzeek 4y ago

for evidence that this is mostly bullshit, look no further than bizarre things like this: > Whales, the argument goes, consume a ruinous quantity of fish, and controlling their population is critical for preserving the oceans’ diversity. An online video from an industry association recommends eating the mammals “to protect the balance of the marine ecosystem and contribute to marine S.D.G.s!” It is fascinating that whales have found a way to be both an endangered species, and an overpopulated ocean scourge (as an apex predator, no less) at the same time!

freetime2 4y ago
While I agree that is a fairly comical quote, I also think it’s an oversimplification to say that whales are “an endangered species”. There are many different species of whale, some of which are endangered and some are not. The humpback whale, for example, is no longer listed as endangered as of 2022.
- pvaldes 4y ago
  Less than 500 North Pacific right whales remain in the planet, only 30 of them visit Alaska, and the rest live mostly around the Japanese sea. Spreading the idea that endangered animals eat "too much" is evil. Rotten to the core.
  - freetime2 4y ago
    I don’t think that’s relevant to the discussion here, because Japan does not hunt Right whales. Japan’s fishing ministry only allows hunting of Minke, Bryde’s, and Sei whales [1] - and in limited numbers which would not endanger the overall population of those species. [1] https://us.whales.org/our-4-goals/stop-whaling/whaling-in-japan/ https://us.whales.org/our-4-goals/stop-whaling/whaling-in-ja...
- zzzeek 4y ago
  > The humpback whale, for example, is no longer listed as endangered as of 2022. I see, so , humpback whale population has just crossed the line of no longer being an endangered species, *this year*. So did they overnight become an environmental pest that is decimating the fish population? I am going to guess you would say no. So I don't think your comment is relevant to the actual point being made. If OTOH you are just applying some factual editing so that my amazing comment can be printed in a newspaper, let's clean up that language sure!

JKCalhoun 4y ago

The last time I felt the U.S. as a country had a goal that was outward looking, forward looking was when we were adopting the Metric System back in the early 70's when I was in elementary school. Good times.

selimthegrim 4y ago
https://twitter.com/HereToRebuild/status/1562584857653301250 https://twitter.com/HereToRebuild/status/1562584857653301250