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But you can also say the opposite: handouts increase inequality and poverty. Who is going to suffer because of the enormous covid handouts and subsequent infla

But you can also say the opposite: handouts increase inequality and poverty. Who is going to suffer because of the enormous covid handouts and subsequent inflation? It was nice while it happened but a lot of rich people really benefited and a lot of poor people are going to go through the worst consequences of inflation and recession.

ArnoVW 4y ago
Even if I also have a hunch that your attribution of inflation to handouts is true, I do not believe that it has been established. What is clear however, that increased prices for labor, wheat and energy, combined with post-covid logistics issues, have very clearly increased consumer pricing.
- colechristensen 4y ago
  Inflation is due to the amount of money (over $10 trillion? hard to find a solid number that doesn't end in bickering about small details) created by the US Federal Reserve, in no small part in order to pay for handouts to people in businesses.
chongli 4y ago
handouts increase inequality and poverty. Or perhaps another way to say it is this: cash doesn’t matter. It’s all about capital. If you want to reduce inequality, give the poor some capital. Unfortunately, I think they’ll likely sell their capital to buy food or pay rent.
- piva00 4y ago
  Capital is only valuable when your basic needs are met. If shelter, food, energy and transportation costs creep into you every week it's just logical you'd trade some capital for cash to meet those needs...
  - chongli 4y ago
    Yes, and unfortunately we’ve built a society where home owners have all the power to ratchet up shelter and transportation costs for everyone else.
    - pessimizer 4y ago
      And homeowners are increasingly becoming massive companies rather than individuals. That's going to end up being feudalism, right? The ownership of these companies is going to be passed down through families.
ZeroGravitas 4y ago
> But you can also say the opposite: handouts increase inequality and poverty. They didn't say anything that would let you conclude either of those things in the article, one they said the exact opposite of. Not read the whole paper yet though.
tpxl 4y ago
> Who is going to suffer because of the enormous covid handouts and subsequent inflation? Don't know how it played where you live, but in my country, most covid handouts went to the rich, not to the poor. 1. Cash was given to companies they could then give to the people, instead of straight to the people. 2. Cheap/free loans were given to companies/rich people, not poor people, because poor people can't pay off loans so nobody gives them any. The insane stock market profits were the result of this - rich people getting excess money. If it went to the poor people, they'd buy food and shelter, not stonks.
- colechristensen 4y ago
  In the US 1 & 2 happened in a big way certainly, but there were also large direct payments to people below a certain income along with significantly bumping up unemployment benefits (to the extent that many were making more unemployed than they were when they had jobs)
  - remram 4y ago
    How large?
    - asdff 4y ago
      It was only like $1200 for individuals.
      - colechristensen 4y ago
        More for families, many state programs which added to this, hundreds of billions of federal funding to states for responses. And much expanded unemployment payments, +$600 and +$300 *weekly on top of normal unemployment for long periods, as well as significantly expanded eligibility for who could get it and for how long. Plenty of people made more money unemployed for significant amounts of time than they did with their jobs pre-pandemic. Something like 10% of the population was on unemployment for a good while.
imtringued 4y ago
We use handouts to prevent revolutions and political instability. You don't recognize the absolutely massive benefits that those payments have to everyone because they get to ignore the poor.

ArnoVW 4y ago

Even if I also have a hunch that your attribution of inflation to handouts is true, I do not believe that it has been established. What is clear however, that increased prices for labor, wheat and energy, combined with post-covid logistics issues, have very clearly increased consumer pricing.

colechristensen 4y ago
Inflation is due to the amount of money (over $10 trillion? hard to find a solid number that doesn't end in bickering about small details) created by the US Federal Reserve, in no small part in order to pay for handouts to people in businesses.

chongli 4y ago

handouts increase inequality and poverty. Or perhaps another way to say it is this: cash doesn’t matter. It’s all about capital. If you want to reduce inequality, give the poor some capital. Unfortunately, I think they’ll likely sell their capital to buy food or pay rent.

piva00 4y ago
Capital is only valuable when your basic needs are met. If shelter, food, energy and transportation costs creep into you every week it's just logical you'd trade some capital for cash to meet those needs...
- chongli 4y ago
  Yes, and unfortunately we’ve built a society where home owners have all the power to ratchet up shelter and transportation costs for everyone else.
  - pessimizer 4y ago
    And homeowners are increasingly becoming massive companies rather than individuals. That's going to end up being feudalism, right? The ownership of these companies is going to be passed down through families.

ZeroGravitas 4y ago

> But you can also say the opposite: handouts increase inequality and poverty. They didn't say anything that would let you conclude either of those things in the article, one they said the exact opposite of. Not read the whole paper yet though.

tpxl 4y ago

> Who is going to suffer because of the enormous covid handouts and subsequent inflation? Don't know how it played where you live, but in my country, most covid handouts went to the rich, not to the poor. 1. Cash was given to companies they could then give to the people, instead of straight to the people. 2. Cheap/free loans were given to companies/rich people, not poor people, because poor people can't pay off loans so nobody gives them any. The insane stock market profits were the result of this - rich people getting excess money. If it went to the poor people, they'd buy food and shelter, not stonks.

colechristensen 4y ago
In the US 1 & 2 happened in a big way certainly, but there were also large direct payments to people below a certain income along with significantly bumping up unemployment benefits (to the extent that many were making more unemployed than they were when they had jobs)
- remram 4y ago
  How large?
  - asdff 4y ago
    It was only like $1200 for individuals.
    - colechristensen 4y ago
      More for families, many state programs which added to this, hundreds of billions of federal funding to states for responses. And much expanded unemployment payments, +$600 and +$300 *weekly on top of normal unemployment for long periods, as well as significantly expanded eligibility for who could get it and for how long. Plenty of people made more money unemployed for significant amounts of time than they did with their jobs pre-pandemic. Something like 10% of the population was on unemployment for a good while.

imtringued 4y ago

We use handouts to prevent revolutions and political instability. You don't recognize the absolutely massive benefits that those payments have to everyone because they get to ignore the poor.