5 ms·

I would pay to hear eastdakota try to rationalize why protecting KF is a net good for the world. He professes to be a free speech absolutist, which is how they

I would pay to hear eastdakota try to rationalize why protecting KF is a net good for the world. He professes to be a free speech absolutist, which is how they justified protecting controversial sites like The Daily Stormer and 8chan, but the purpose of KF is simply to harm specific, usually non-notable people through relentless doxxing (leading to relentless harassment or worse) usually only justified by them being transgender, or neurodivergent, or otherwise "cringe". There is nothing to debate in the free speech maximalist marketplace of ideas here, unless you seriously want to entertain the idea that vulnerable people deserve to be destroyed for the entertainment of psychopaths.

shrimp_emoji 4y ago
- IllIllIllIIlIll 4y ago
  The specifics of how Keffals behaves or what she has or hasn't done are basically irrelevant, because KF would have done exactly the same things to her regardless of any of those factors. Being a prominent trans person online means there is a significant chance of your home address being posted on KF for absolutely no reason other than you're a prominent trans person online.
bobsmooth 4y ago
>I would pay to hear eastdakota try to rationalize why protecting KF is a net good for the world. Let me try. KF is a place to archive the publicly-posted online antics of people who willingly publish said antics to the internet. Interacting with the subject of a thread is against the rules and anyone bragging about doing so is banned. If you dislike the idea of people making fun of you for your actions, don't broadcast them to the internet.
- IllIllIllIIlIll 4y ago
  You and I both know why details like home addresses and phone numbers are documented by KF threads. Interacting being against the rules is basic ass-covering, there's no reason for details like those to be posted unless the intent is for someone to harass them, whether that person is a KF user who knows not to admit it, or a drive-by reader who found the thread on Google. Nobody is buying the line that KF is a purely passive observer, when drawing their attention is so strongly correlated with receiving harassment, or that they only observe intentionally published information, when they scoop up so much obviously private information like addresses and deadnames.
phendrenad2 4y ago
As usual, it's a minority of users causing all of the problems. Most people on KF probably aren't doxxing or sending threats, but any time you get a group of people together to talk about someone, chances are some will take it too far. The ultimate example of this was Princess Diana (remember that?). The public was obsessed with her, and that demand fed a constant swarm of paparazzi which eventually led to her crash and death. If people were posting about her on KF, KF would surely be shut down by now. There need to he clear rules. If we shut down every forum where someone says something bad once, are we going to shut down Facebook and Instagram? Of course not, we'll stop short of that. So we give an unfair advantage to Facebook and Instagram, forever entrenching them as the only platforms where speech can happen? Getting back to the Princess Diana analogy, KF probably started as a harmless place to joke about public figures, but in the modern world where everyone is pushed to cultivate their own personal "brand", even someone as uninteresting as a nintendo emulator programmer, it puts regular people at risk of the worst kinds of stalking and harassment etc.
- IllIllIllIIlIll 4y ago
  > KF probably started as a harmless place to joke about public figures There's no need to assume, we know exactly where KF started. It originally focused on one specific target before branching out, a severely autistic person known as Chris Chan who isn't notable for any reason other than being a target of incredibly intense stalking, harassment and manipulation. The site didn't need to "fall from grace" when its baseline from day one was stalking a random mentally ill person for amusement.
  - richbell 4y ago
    > who isn't notable for any reason other than being a target of incredibly intense stalking, This is demonstrably false. Chris Chan became the obsession of the internet because of his incredibly odd and anti-social behavior, such as plastering signs around campus looking for a "boyfriend free girl" and telling other men with boyfriends to go jump off a cliff (https://sonichu.com/cwcki/Attraction_Sign#The_Sign.2C_Mark_1 https://sonichu.com/cwcki/Attraction_Sign#The_Sign.2C_Mark_1). Calling him "not notable" is just not true. Down the Rabbithole has a good video about him: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5IPtLvxO8hs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5IPtLvxO8hs

shrimp_emoji 4y ago

IllIllIllIIlIll 4y ago
The specifics of how Keffals behaves or what she has or hasn't done are basically irrelevant, because KF would have done exactly the same things to her regardless of any of those factors. Being a prominent trans person online means there is a significant chance of your home address being posted on KF for absolutely no reason other than you're a prominent trans person online.

bobsmooth 4y ago

>I would pay to hear eastdakota try to rationalize why protecting KF is a net good for the world. Let me try. KF is a place to archive the publicly-posted online antics of people who willingly publish said antics to the internet. Interacting with the subject of a thread is against the rules and anyone bragging about doing so is banned. If you dislike the idea of people making fun of you for your actions, don't broadcast them to the internet.

IllIllIllIIlIll 4y ago
You and I both know why details like home addresses and phone numbers are documented by KF threads. Interacting being against the rules is basic ass-covering, there's no reason for details like those to be posted unless the intent is for someone to harass them, whether that person is a KF user who knows not to admit it, or a drive-by reader who found the thread on Google. Nobody is buying the line that KF is a purely passive observer, when drawing their attention is so strongly correlated with receiving harassment, or that they only observe intentionally published information, when they scoop up so much obviously private information like addresses and deadnames.

phendrenad2 4y ago

As usual, it's a minority of users causing all of the problems. Most people on KF probably aren't doxxing or sending threats, but any time you get a group of people together to talk about someone, chances are some will take it too far. The ultimate example of this was Princess Diana (remember that?). The public was obsessed with her, and that demand fed a constant swarm of paparazzi which eventually led to her crash and death. If people were posting about her on KF, KF would surely be shut down by now. There need to he clear rules. If we shut down every forum where someone says something bad once, are we going to shut down Facebook and Instagram? Of course not, we'll stop short of that. So we give an unfair advantage to Facebook and Instagram, forever entrenching them as the only platforms where speech can happen? Getting back to the Princess Diana analogy, KF probably started as a harmless place to joke about public figures, but in the modern world where everyone is pushed to cultivate their own personal "brand", even someone as uninteresting as a nintendo emulator programmer, it puts regular people at risk of the worst kinds of stalking and harassment etc.

IllIllIllIIlIll 4y ago
> KF probably started as a harmless place to joke about public figures There's no need to assume, we know exactly where KF started. It originally focused on one specific target before branching out, a severely autistic person known as Chris Chan who isn't notable for any reason other than being a target of incredibly intense stalking, harassment and manipulation. The site didn't need to "fall from grace" when its baseline from day one was stalking a random mentally ill person for amusement.
- richbell 4y ago
  > who isn't notable for any reason other than being a target of incredibly intense stalking, This is demonstrably false. Chris Chan became the obsession of the internet because of his incredibly odd and anti-social behavior, such as plastering signs around campus looking for a "boyfriend free girl" and telling other men with boyfriends to go jump off a cliff (https://sonichu.com/cwcki/Attraction_Sign#The_Sign.2C_Mark_1 https://sonichu.com/cwcki/Attraction_Sign#The_Sign.2C_Mark_1). Calling him "not notable" is just not true. Down the Rabbithole has a good video about him: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5IPtLvxO8hs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5IPtLvxO8hs