10 ms·

I’m very interested in home schooling for this reason but am concerned about two things: both my wife and I work, and social interaction for my son with kids hi

by onos 4y ago

I’m very interested in home schooling for this reason but am concerned about two things: both my wife and I work, and social interaction for my son with kids his age. Trying to think about solutions for both of these. Advice?

mightybyte 4y ago
I was home schooled K-7 (skipped 8th grade). The flexibility was great and allowed me to start taking college level computer programming courses when I was 10 years old. I think I came out of it reasonably socially adjusted. I have two recommendations for anyone thinking about doing something similar: 1. Make sure your kids are involved in a decent amount of outside activities during the elementary school years that get them interacting with other kids. Things like team sports, music groups, etc. 2. Do NOT home school your kids through high school. I knew other kids who were and thought that they had socialization issues. You could easily argue that this point is mostly anecdotal and I couldn't really disagree, but I have a gut feeling that the high school years are particularly important when it comes to socialization.
nextos 4y ago
Lots of activities can lead to more healthy socialization than school, e.g. sport clubs.
mod 4y ago
I used to work at a YMCA, and I taught PE for local homeschool kids. They would come every-other Thursday or something, and we did swimming, rock climbing, badminton, and a bunch of other stuff. That's a start, but I'll say that homeschool kids are a bit off, socially. It's not always a bad thing, but it's noticeable. And, a few don't have that problem--I think it's the kids with a lot of interaction, like on sports teams etc. Honestly, a lot of the weirdness of those kids was often that they just seemed very grown up. They interacted a LOT more in 1-on-1 conversations with adults than most kids do. Nearly all of them seemed smart for their age. Scouts, karate, MTG clubs are some ideas. Honestly, gaming? In our lives I'm sure a lot of social activity will move to some virtual spaces, maybe VR etc. Anyway, just some thoughts. Good luck!
- pronlover723 4y ago
  > I'll say that homeschool kids are a bit off, socially. Nice anecdote. My experience is the exact opposite. The ~20 home schooled kids I know are the most socially adept kids I've ever met. They aren't shy. They hold nice conversations. They actually like talking to a mix of people.
  - nomdep 4y ago
    > They aren't shy. They hold nice conversations So they do seem very grown up
    - internet_user 4y ago
      seem or are?
  - 1123581321 4y ago
    Social adeptness stands out too, though. “Socially adjusted” means behaving like someone who spent twelve years in a public institution. No more or less. I think highly of the homeschooled kids I’ve known, for the record.
  - mod 4y ago
    I think they're the most socially adept kids when speaking with adults, and the most socially inept when hanging with other kids, particularly medium-to-large groups. On average. I knew plenty of them who didn't fit the mold.
  - noodlesUK 4y ago
    I'll echo some of the other posters here in saying that homeschooled kids are usually shockingly good at holding conversations with adults for their age. Not being in an institutional environment where you only really talk to schoolteachers means they get a lot more practice having normal conversations with adults. That was a benefit for me in my later teenage years for sure as I transitioned into the grown-up world.
- tleilaxu 4y ago
labster 4y ago
Does your child actually need social interactions with kids his own age? The answer is pretty dependent on the individual. Some people need the social activity to play and stay motivated, but it mostly brought me misery and distraction. Adults can socialize kids too — there’s no speed limit. Prehistorically and for most of history kids grew up alongside their parents and a wide range of ages in peers, and followed their parents around as they worked.
- bigDinosaur 4y ago
  The issue is that all the other kids of their age and of different ages will be at school. I'd say that the generalisation that kids need social interactions with kids their own age is true - an 8 y/o definitely shouldn't be interacting exclusively with people aged > 18 - although we drive that to an extreme with our rigidly age segregated schooling systems. Life around adults can be dreadfully serious and I think the innocent play of childhood amongst peers is generally crucial.
  - noodlesUK 4y ago
    > The issue is that all the other kids of their age and of different ages will be at school. This is definitely a big one. There are homeschool groups which provide enrichment during normal school hours. The biggest boon for socialising as a homeschooled kid though is after school classes of various kinds (sports, etc). They generally don't happen at school.
  - labster 4y ago
    > Life around adults can be dreadfully serious Me, singing a few bars of Brave Sir Robin as our D&D party expeditious retreats from an adult red dragon: huh?
- noodlesUK 4y ago
  I'd say kids definitely need interactions with other kids. Homeschooling generally has wider bands than school grades in terms of age ranges, which can help kids learn to socialise with a variety of different age levels. On the other hand, I definitely knew a good number of homeschooled kids (myself included) who took a somewhat unhealthy level of pride in preferring the company of adults.
linuxftw 4y ago
Homeschooling takes 2-3 hours per day, not 8, and it doesn't have to be 5 days per week. Once the kids are around 10 or so, they can do a lot on their own as far as reading material. For socializing, there's karate class, or other kid sports. Church groups, going to the local park. You know, getting out into the world.
andsoitis 4y ago
Have you considered quitting your work to be home with him; then you can also chaperone kids get togethers.
pronlover723 4y ago
My sister was part of the mom's club https://momsclub.org/ https://momsclub.org/ I believe she met lots of moms and socialized her kids with activities with them. She also did all kinds of things with her youngest son. For example they were docents at the local aquarium for a few months.
tleilaxu 4y ago
As a child homeschooled since 5 years old myself: _do not do it_. Any academic gains are not worth the social stunting, especially if the child is already shy. Happiness in life is rarely based on academic achievements, but rather on the relationships we build. These relationships are built through social skills, and our interactions with our fellow man. Homeschooling severely stunts this at a very vulnerable time in a child’s life.
- whoooooo123 4y ago
  I wasn't homeschooled, but I knew homeschooled kids growing up, and they all had friends and active social lives. Homeschooling doesn't have to mean you're locked away never interacting with anybody - in fact my homeschooled acquaintances had lots of friends who themselves were homeschooled, since their parents met through one of the various homeschooling support networks that exists in the UK. Meanwhile I went to school like everyone else from the ages of 5 to 18 and I still came out at the end with the social intelligence of a potted plant. Sending your kids to school doesn't guarantee they'll turn out normal - if that was true then everybody would be normal.
- aidenn0 4y ago
  I went to a science and tech magnet school for HS, so there were a fair number of homeschooled kids. By winter break freshman year, you couldn't tell most of the homeschooled kids from the rest. In at least two of the exceptions, the kids were specifically homeschooled because they were getting picked on in public school for being socially awkward. Counterfactuals are difficult; I was far more socially awkward than most of the kids in t high school that were homeschooled, and I was in public school from kindergarten. I think it is true that parents home schooling their kids ought not neglect social and emotional skills any more than they should neglect science or math.
  - internet_user 4y ago
    where social and emotional skills somehow taught with purpose? or it just happened on its own?
Bud 4y ago
Home-schooled kids are missing out on a lot even if you assume they are getting a good basic education and you're also somehow compensating for the social aspects. Just to cite one example: music programs. Drama programs. The arts in general. Hard to substitute for these at home. In addition, more widespread home-schooling serves the right-wing interests that are trying to tear down society in general, and to tear down the public school system in particular, in favor of religious indoctrination and elite schools for the rich. Those interests are dangerous and ascendant enough as it is. They don't need any more help right now.
- haihaibye 4y ago
  > music programs Mozart was home schooled in music by his father.
  - Bud 4y ago
    You actually think that's a useful point? It's not. Mozart's father was an extraordinary musician, and had support from royalty. Obviously, most kids, the vast majority, don't have that privilege. Furthermore, you're missing the social aspect.
- Ferrotin 4y ago
  What? The right-wing purpose of home-schooling is to get away from the religious indoctrination in public schools. And their support of school choice means elite schools for everybody, instead of just the rich, which is the status quo. And at least in my school district, homeschoolers in the district could participate in extracurriculars like band and drama a la carte.
  - 8mHMCkRHnyBi4DH 4y ago
    > The right-wing purpose of home-schooling is to get away from the religious indoctrination in public schools Not even close. https://www.texastribune.org/2022/08/18/texas-schools-in-god-we-trust/ https://www.texastribune.org/2022/08/18/texas-schools-in-god... https://www.npr.org/2022/06/27/1106290141/supreme-court-high-school-coach-right-to-pray https://www.npr.org/2022/06/27/1106290141/supreme-court-high... Their purpose is to get away from the political indoctrination in public schools. And honestly, considering how much of what's taught in school about our government and society just isn't true... I don't blame 'em. (To be fair, a lot of them would probably try and get away from religious indoctrination if it weren't Christian.) > And their support of school choice means elite schools for everybody, instead of just the rich, which is the status quo. How do you figure that? The well-off are still the only people who will be able to afford the best education, because the reality is the amount of money you spend on education is highly correlated with the success of that education. The only thing it will do for the rest is take those with plenty of money out of the public school's tax base, decreasing the quality of education there even further.
noodlesUK 4y ago
If you're looking for advice, here are my top thoughts: Your approach really depends on the age of the kid. I wasn't homeschooled until I was about 10, so my knowledge of how primary education works is much more limited. You will definitely want to ensure there are after school activities your kid enjoys that they will be able to continue if you decide to homeschool them. It's important to not rip them out of all of their social circles. See if there are any local homeschooling groups in your area. I assume you are in the US or Canada, where this is more widespread than in Europe. They will be able to advise you on what's good locally. I'd be careful to ensure that the groups are relatively well-aligned with your vision of what you and your kid want (it's often easier to find religious groups as they are usually more vocal, my assumption is that you are probably looking for a secular one). If you can't find a group that you like, seriously consider before deciding to go it completely alone. Don't expect magic to happen overnight if you do decide to homeschool the kid. You mustn't push too hard, especially at first. It's a big change. The most important part is to help your kid learn how to learn as a self-driven person. Give the kid agency. Let them choose what they learn (to a certain extent). You need to secure buy-in to the process. Without that you will just be fighting, and it will suck. If you're both working full time in an office type job, it's not going to be easy. I did know one or two people who did this, but it's much more common for one or both parents to be either WFH and have a flexible job or for there to be a stay at home parent (sadly this is almost always the mother in my experience, it can be hard for stay at home dads to break into those circles). If your kid is high school aged: think about how they might be able to go to university if they want to. Local community colleges often have programs that are suitable for dual-credit. I didn't do this but many of my friends did. Look into exams like the SAT/ACT/AP and how you can take them as an independent person. I was able to get into UK universities (I am originally British) with results in those American exams. Many of my friends used their community college credit to transfer into 4 year universities. Talk to other parents and their kids who did go to university about the route they took to get there. The other fun benefit is that you'll have a much closer relationship with your kid than most other parents do, as you'll spend much more time with them. If you decide to give it a go, good luck!

by onos 4y ago

mightybyte 4y ago

I was home schooled K-7 (skipped 8th grade). The flexibility was great and allowed me to start taking college level computer programming courses when I was 10 years old. I think I came out of it reasonably socially adjusted. I have two recommendations for anyone thinking about doing something similar: 1. Make sure your kids are involved in a decent amount of outside activities during the elementary school years that get them interacting with other kids. Things like team sports, music groups, etc. 2. Do NOT home school your kids through high school. I knew other kids who were and thought that they had socialization issues. You could easily argue that this point is mostly anecdotal and I couldn't really disagree, but I have a gut feeling that the high school years are particularly important when it comes to socialization.

nextos 4y ago

Lots of activities can lead to more healthy socialization than school, e.g. sport clubs.

mod 4y ago

I used to work at a YMCA, and I taught PE for local homeschool kids. They would come every-other Thursday or something, and we did swimming, rock climbing, badminton, and a bunch of other stuff. That's a start, but I'll say that homeschool kids are a bit off, socially. It's not always a bad thing, but it's noticeable. And, a few don't have that problem--I think it's the kids with a lot of interaction, like on sports teams etc. Honestly, a lot of the weirdness of those kids was often that they just seemed very grown up. They interacted a LOT more in 1-on-1 conversations with adults than most kids do. Nearly all of them seemed smart for their age. Scouts, karate, MTG clubs are some ideas. Honestly, gaming? In our lives I'm sure a lot of social activity will move to some virtual spaces, maybe VR etc. Anyway, just some thoughts. Good luck!

pronlover723 4y ago
> I'll say that homeschool kids are a bit off, socially. Nice anecdote. My experience is the exact opposite. The ~20 home schooled kids I know are the most socially adept kids I've ever met. They aren't shy. They hold nice conversations. They actually like talking to a mix of people.
- nomdep 4y ago
  > They aren't shy. They hold nice conversations So they do seem very grown up
  - internet_user 4y ago
    seem or are?
- 1123581321 4y ago
  Social adeptness stands out too, though. “Socially adjusted” means behaving like someone who spent twelve years in a public institution. No more or less. I think highly of the homeschooled kids I’ve known, for the record.
- mod 4y ago
  I think they're the most socially adept kids when speaking with adults, and the most socially inept when hanging with other kids, particularly medium-to-large groups. On average. I knew plenty of them who didn't fit the mold.
- noodlesUK 4y ago
  I'll echo some of the other posters here in saying that homeschooled kids are usually shockingly good at holding conversations with adults for their age. Not being in an institutional environment where you only really talk to schoolteachers means they get a lot more practice having normal conversations with adults. That was a benefit for me in my later teenage years for sure as I transitioned into the grown-up world.
tleilaxu 4y ago

labster 4y ago

Does your child actually need social interactions with kids his own age? The answer is pretty dependent on the individual. Some people need the social activity to play and stay motivated, but it mostly brought me misery and distraction. Adults can socialize kids too — there’s no speed limit. Prehistorically and for most of history kids grew up alongside their parents and a wide range of ages in peers, and followed their parents around as they worked.

bigDinosaur 4y ago
The issue is that all the other kids of their age and of different ages will be at school. I'd say that the generalisation that kids need social interactions with kids their own age is true - an 8 y/o definitely shouldn't be interacting exclusively with people aged > 18 - although we drive that to an extreme with our rigidly age segregated schooling systems. Life around adults can be dreadfully serious and I think the innocent play of childhood amongst peers is generally crucial.
- noodlesUK 4y ago
  > The issue is that all the other kids of their age and of different ages will be at school. This is definitely a big one. There are homeschool groups which provide enrichment during normal school hours. The biggest boon for socialising as a homeschooled kid though is after school classes of various kinds (sports, etc). They generally don't happen at school.
- labster 4y ago
  > Life around adults can be dreadfully serious Me, singing a few bars of Brave Sir Robin as our D&D party expeditious retreats from an adult red dragon: huh?
noodlesUK 4y ago
I'd say kids definitely need interactions with other kids. Homeschooling generally has wider bands than school grades in terms of age ranges, which can help kids learn to socialise with a variety of different age levels. On the other hand, I definitely knew a good number of homeschooled kids (myself included) who took a somewhat unhealthy level of pride in preferring the company of adults.

linuxftw 4y ago

Homeschooling takes 2-3 hours per day, not 8, and it doesn't have to be 5 days per week. Once the kids are around 10 or so, they can do a lot on their own as far as reading material. For socializing, there's karate class, or other kid sports. Church groups, going to the local park. You know, getting out into the world.

andsoitis 4y ago

Have you considered quitting your work to be home with him; then you can also chaperone kids get togethers.

pronlover723 4y ago

My sister was part of the mom's club https://momsclub.org/ https://momsclub.org/ I believe she met lots of moms and socialized her kids with activities with them. She also did all kinds of things with her youngest son. For example they were docents at the local aquarium for a few months.

tleilaxu 4y ago

As a child homeschooled since 5 years old myself: _do not do it_. Any academic gains are not worth the social stunting, especially if the child is already shy. Happiness in life is rarely based on academic achievements, but rather on the relationships we build. These relationships are built through social skills, and our interactions with our fellow man. Homeschooling severely stunts this at a very vulnerable time in a child’s life.

whoooooo123 4y ago
I wasn't homeschooled, but I knew homeschooled kids growing up, and they all had friends and active social lives. Homeschooling doesn't have to mean you're locked away never interacting with anybody - in fact my homeschooled acquaintances had lots of friends who themselves were homeschooled, since their parents met through one of the various homeschooling support networks that exists in the UK. Meanwhile I went to school like everyone else from the ages of 5 to 18 and I still came out at the end with the social intelligence of a potted plant. Sending your kids to school doesn't guarantee they'll turn out normal - if that was true then everybody would be normal.
aidenn0 4y ago
I went to a science and tech magnet school for HS, so there were a fair number of homeschooled kids. By winter break freshman year, you couldn't tell most of the homeschooled kids from the rest. In at least two of the exceptions, the kids were specifically homeschooled because they were getting picked on in public school for being socially awkward. Counterfactuals are difficult; I was far more socially awkward than most of the kids in t high school that were homeschooled, and I was in public school from kindergarten. I think it is true that parents home schooling their kids ought not neglect social and emotional skills any more than they should neglect science or math.
- internet_user 4y ago
  where social and emotional skills somehow taught with purpose? or it just happened on its own?

Bud 4y ago

Home-schooled kids are missing out on a lot even if you assume they are getting a good basic education and you're also somehow compensating for the social aspects. Just to cite one example: music programs. Drama programs. The arts in general. Hard to substitute for these at home. In addition, more widespread home-schooling serves the right-wing interests that are trying to tear down society in general, and to tear down the public school system in particular, in favor of religious indoctrination and elite schools for the rich. Those interests are dangerous and ascendant enough as it is. They don't need any more help right now.

haihaibye 4y ago
> music programs Mozart was home schooled in music by his father.
- Bud 4y ago
  You actually think that's a useful point? It's not. Mozart's father was an extraordinary musician, and had support from royalty. Obviously, most kids, the vast majority, don't have that privilege. Furthermore, you're missing the social aspect.
Ferrotin 4y ago
What? The right-wing purpose of home-schooling is to get away from the religious indoctrination in public schools. And their support of school choice means elite schools for everybody, instead of just the rich, which is the status quo. And at least in my school district, homeschoolers in the district could participate in extracurriculars like band and drama a la carte.
- 8mHMCkRHnyBi4DH 4y ago
  > The right-wing purpose of home-schooling is to get away from the religious indoctrination in public schools Not even close. https://www.texastribune.org/2022/08/18/texas-schools-in-god-we-trust/ https://www.texastribune.org/2022/08/18/texas-schools-in-god... https://www.npr.org/2022/06/27/1106290141/supreme-court-high-school-coach-right-to-pray https://www.npr.org/2022/06/27/1106290141/supreme-court-high... Their purpose is to get away from the political indoctrination in public schools. And honestly, considering how much of what's taught in school about our government and society just isn't true... I don't blame 'em. (To be fair, a lot of them would probably try and get away from religious indoctrination if it weren't Christian.) > And their support of school choice means elite schools for everybody, instead of just the rich, which is the status quo. How do you figure that? The well-off are still the only people who will be able to afford the best education, because the reality is the amount of money you spend on education is highly correlated with the success of that education. The only thing it will do for the rest is take those with plenty of money out of the public school's tax base, decreasing the quality of education there even further.

noodlesUK 4y ago

If you're looking for advice, here are my top thoughts: Your approach really depends on the age of the kid. I wasn't homeschooled until I was about 10, so my knowledge of how primary education works is much more limited. You will definitely want to ensure there are after school activities your kid enjoys that they will be able to continue if you decide to homeschool them. It's important to not rip them out of all of their social circles. See if there are any local homeschooling groups in your area. I assume you are in the US or Canada, where this is more widespread than in Europe. They will be able to advise you on what's good locally. I'd be careful to ensure that the groups are relatively well-aligned with your vision of what you and your kid want (it's often easier to find religious groups as they are usually more vocal, my assumption is that you are probably looking for a secular one). If you can't find a group that you like, seriously consider before deciding to go it completely alone. Don't expect magic to happen overnight if you do decide to homeschool the kid. You mustn't push too hard, especially at first. It's a big change. The most important part is to help your kid learn how to learn as a self-driven person. Give the kid agency. Let them choose what they learn (to a certain extent). You need to secure buy-in to the process. Without that you will just be fighting, and it will suck. If you're both working full time in an office type job, it's not going to be easy. I did know one or two people who did this, but it's much more common for one or both parents to be either WFH and have a flexible job or for there to be a stay at home parent (sadly this is almost always the mother in my experience, it can be hard for stay at home dads to break into those circles). If your kid is high school aged: think about how they might be able to go to university if they want to. Local community colleges often have programs that are suitable for dual-credit. I didn't do this but many of my friends did. Look into exams like the SAT/ACT/AP and how you can take them as an independent person. I was able to get into UK universities (I am originally British) with results in those American exams. Many of my friends used their community college credit to transfer into 4 year universities. Talk to other parents and their kids who did go to university about the route they took to get there. The other fun benefit is that you'll have a much closer relationship with your kid than most other parents do, as you'll spend much more time with them. If you decide to give it a go, good luck!