4 ms·

I feel it's pointless debating anarchy, socialism and democracy on US-centric platforms. Not just here. Americans are (in general) just super individualistic a

by mordae 4y ago

I feel it's pointless debating anarchy, socialism and democracy on US-centric platforms. Not just here. Americans are (in general) just super individualistic and assume worst about "others" and usually "don't tread on me" instead of actually considering fairness of any given set of rules. Sorry folks. Also, the "capitalist rationalists" make my blood boil. Their inability to decompose complex social mechanisms to their explicit and implicit functions and imagine other configurations due to above sentiments (others can't be trusted, don't tread on me) make all discussions feel like arguing with a 5 year old.

the_gipsy 4y ago
I think you hit the nail on the head. It simply ends all discussion very effectively. This is the great divide in America.
samtho 4y ago
I think a main problem is we [westerners/americans] tend to consider capitalism as fundamentally existing at the same level of our democracy. Capitalism is itself an extreme case that people seem to feel compelled to follow because it is a convenient label which allows them ignore the fact that it will naturally erode societal fabric as said level. I think there is a natural selection that these terms go through. For example, Capitalism is favored heavily because under such a system, anyone can technically amass great riches, which feeds the desire for more of it by both the people who have amassed riches and those who have “yet” to do so, thus the constant buzz and support for it. Anarchy as a concept is never going to be in a place where anyone of power or means, will publicly support such a thing because Anarchy threatens the very structure that has allowed them their amassed wealth and power. In many ways anarchy is closer to capitalism than it is to socialism. Only slightly relevant, but I wonder what kind of shifts we would see if we were able to separate the concept of a free market from capitalism. I personally think a free market is one of the best incentive structures we have for a network of independent actors, but we should, as a society, support those who wish to invent mand take risks without the potential outcome being literal starvation and homelessness.

by mordae 4y ago

the_gipsy 4y ago

I think you hit the nail on the head. It simply ends all discussion very effectively. This is the great divide in America.

samtho 4y ago

I think a main problem is we [westerners/americans] tend to consider capitalism as fundamentally existing at the same level of our democracy. Capitalism is itself an extreme case that people seem to feel compelled to follow because it is a convenient label which allows them ignore the fact that it will naturally erode societal fabric as said level. I think there is a natural selection that these terms go through. For example, Capitalism is favored heavily because under such a system, anyone can technically amass great riches, which feeds the desire for more of it by both the people who have amassed riches and those who have “yet” to do so, thus the constant buzz and support for it. Anarchy as a concept is never going to be in a place where anyone of power or means, will publicly support such a thing because Anarchy threatens the very structure that has allowed them their amassed wealth and power. In many ways anarchy is closer to capitalism than it is to socialism. Only slightly relevant, but I wonder what kind of shifts we would see if we were able to separate the concept of a free market from capitalism. I personally think a free market is one of the best incentive structures we have for a network of independent actors, but we should, as a society, support those who wish to invent mand take risks without the potential outcome being literal starvation and homelessness.