10 ms·

JetBrains Research

258 points by davidbarker 4y ago

lake_vincent 4y ago
Oh wow, they have a HoTT research group? That's very interesting, and exciting. I'd love a JetBrains automated proof assistant.
- bmc7505 4y ago
  https://arend-lang.github.io https://arend-lang.github.io
  - ericmay 4y ago
    Very neat. Thanks for sharing.
  - lake_vincent 4y ago
    swoons
estsauver 4y ago
I'm curious how they arrived on some of these topics: Things like proof assistants seem like relatively straightforward extensions of their programming language expertise, but paper summarisation seems really out of left field. It also says it's a private entity--is this structured as a pure research company owned by JetBrains or as something else? Cool my IntelliJ license is (maybe?) supporting some really interesting academic projects.
- Q6T46nT668w6i3m 4y ago
  I don’t know but it’s common, in industry research, to let researchers independently choose their focus.
- pumpkinprog 4y ago
  > is this structured as a pure research company owned by JetBrains or as something else They mostly collaborate with independent university labs, giving them funding in exchage for working under the JBR brand and promoting some of their products (like Kotlin language).
bmc7505 4y ago
JBR is one of the very few industry labs that conducts pure research in CS and programming language theory. For a relatively small company, their publication record is exemplary. https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C5&q=%22JetBrains+research%22+acm&btnG= https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C5&q=%22J...
- Genbox 4y ago
  "Small" here being 1900 full-time employees and ~250 interns in 10 different offices[1] [1] https://www.jetbrains.com/lp/annualreport-2022/ https://www.jetbrains.com/lp/annualreport-2022/
  - xeromal 4y ago
    They did write "relative" in front of small. They're a mite compared to FAANG and yet publish prolifically.
  - bmc7505 4y ago
    Compared with MSR or Brain which have over 100x their headcount, JBR punches well above their weight in CORE CS conference and journal publications.
  - mekster 4y ago
    Why do they need that many for the products they have? Sounds like just because they can but not exactly using them effectively on the new fleet offering by the look of the progress speed.
pigtailgirl 4y ago
-- JetBrains have existed since 2000 & till recently they didn't cross my radar - what happened in the last year that I see them trending all over the Dev-o-sphere? Seems they've really hit their stride - is there a particular product folks have adopted or their marketing has improved or....? --
- medwards666 4y ago
  Not sure, but they've really been active the last couple of years in language training and collaborative development. Plus, I happen to think their IDEs are probably the best out there (despite their relative complexity). Been a happy user of their IDE suite now for many years, and IMHO, nothing else comes even close.
- philipwhiuk 4y ago
  They make software IDEs IntelliJ Ultimate is widely considered one of the best for Java development (Android Studio is a fork of the open source branch).
  - TheRealDunkirk 4y ago
    I had to work on a Java-based web application for a brief-but-terrible moment, and I am very happy to have spent the money out of my own pocket for IntelliJ. I think using Java for web apps is a Bad Idea, but IntelliJ, at least, made it tolerable to write code for.
    - stjohnswarts 4y ago
      Java is great for web apps. Libraries for everything, quite fast if you keep services running (as opposed to loading them on demand) and has been quite successful in the sphere for quite some time. It's just not everyone's cup of tea. I think the more you like dynamic languages or functional the more you're going to absolutely hate java.
      - TheRealDunkirk 4y ago
user3939382 4y ago
This is amazing! The cynical side of me says, please let me switch git branches in CLI without PhpStorm losing my branch context/file set — a bug that’s been sitting for 5 years and basically looks like is never getting fixed.
- ithrow 4y ago
  This is my beef sometimes with this IDEs, is hard to change their stubborn behaviors.
- nine_k 4y ago
  Their IDEs are more or less modular. So if the git integration is included in Community Edition of anything (like Idea or PyCharm), the source code must be there, and you can theoretically fix it. Then the fix should apply everywhere.
mdaniel 4y ago
they have a GH org, too: https://github.com/JetBrains-Research https://github.com/JetBrains-Research
Drunk_Engineer 4y ago
Looks like their research groups are in Russia. Not sure how that's going to work going forward.
- helge9210 4y ago
  Since escalation in Ukraine (war itself started in 2014) they conducted a massive relocation of personnel out of Russia to EU.
  - silexia 4y ago
    - Mikeb85 4y ago
      JetBrains was founded in the Czech Republic ~2 decades ago. While what you say is no doubt true for many of their employees, I'm guessing their founders have had enough time to distance themselves from Russia given their exit was always a possibility.
- Mikeb85 4y ago
  They closed their Russia offices and no longer do any business in Russia. https://blog.jetbrains.com/blog/2022/03/11/jetbrains-statement-on-ukraine/ https://blog.jetbrains.com/blog/2022/03/11/jetbrains-stateme...
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - Drunk_Engineer 4y ago
    They should update their home page. It still shows offices in Russia, with a footnote saying "suspended".
silexia 4y ago
- stusmall 4y ago
  First, they are a Czech company. Second, they have taken a public and open stance against the war. https://blog.jetbrains.com/blog/2022/03/11/jetbrains-statement-on-ukraine/ https://blog.jetbrains.com/blog/2022/03/11/jetbrains-stateme...
  - isbvhodnvemrwvn 4y ago
    They are Czech on paper, founders and most high level employees are Russian. Their main dev center used to be Sankt Petersburg, that's why Kotlin is named like that.
    - kgeist 4y ago
      >Their main dev center used to be Sankt Petersburg Is it still true? There were news of them selling their properties in St.Petersburg.
      - Genbox 4y ago
        Their offices in Moscow (Capital of Russia. Largest city), Saint Petersburg (Second largest city in Russia) and Novosibirsk (Third largest city in Russia) were suspended indefinitely in March 2022[1] [1] https://www.jetbrains.com/company/ https://www.jetbrains.com/company/
      - atemerev 4y ago
        They are moving out from Russia as fast as they can, but unfortunately it takes time.
    - tasuki 4y ago
      ... making it even more impressive that they have taken a public stance against the war!
w10-1 4y ago
JetBrains has done well by copying and privatizing code. They're among the leaders in pretending open-source. After they were bought out, they went all-in on the subscription model. Their technical initiatives and research may be mostly for recruiting and branding. Their language toolkit has been their primary infrastructure, but no one else seems to have built anything on it. Yes, they are Russian. The concern is that their code gets downloaded and run with full privileges everywhere. But the bulk is JVM-based and easily analyzed (no?). As far as I know, they have never been caught doing anything wrong, and their code has never been implicated, in their decades of business. And Google likely vetted them before agreeing to anoint their IDE and language for Android development, right? The bio's of the computational bio researchers are suspect. It's unlikely their model is actually used for anything. I imagine data from the subscription would be very useful to Russia. In short: plenty to worry about, and nothing to worry about :)
- bigbillheck 4y ago
  > Yes, they are Russian The available evidence disagrees. (They're from Czechia)
- atleta 4y ago
  They are not 'all in' on the subscription model: if you stop paying you still get to use the last version issued while you were a subscriber. (Or maybe the one that was the current one when you paid your yearly subscription, but it doesn't make much of a difference.) They call it 'perpetual fallback license'. I think it's a fair compromise between owning what you have paid for and being able to fund continuous development of the platform (and also to be able to receive updates without having to make a buy/skip decision all the time). Also, they are not a Russian company and have severed ties with Russia a few weeks after the war has started.
  - nightski 4y ago
    Yes if you stop paying you need to downgrade to the version at the time of payment, probably from a year ago. It can make a big difference if the ecosystem is changing. For example, in .NET if you are using a newer version of .NET at that time it could make the IDE unusable. I have been using their products for over a decade but I still hate this model. Typically when buying a full product + support subscription you are supposedly paying for bug fixes/enhancements that come during that support period - it's built into the price.
newaccount2021 4y ago
gotts 4y ago
- msoad 4y ago
  with that logic many Russians also work for Google, Microsoft or Facebook. So what? Picking a name from Russia is not a crime! What is this comment?!
- user3939382 4y ago
  This feels reminiscent of Dr. Strangelove. It’s like saying: remember anyone working for a US company could be coerced by the CIA! If you don’t like Putin fine, we don’t need a witch hunt against anything remotely Russian.
- bsedlm 4y ago
  I'm appaled how the american propaganda machine convinces so many people that they're out there fighting for freedom and for the world. Obviously they have to protect their imperialistic interest in order for their hegemonic mastery over the world to make sense. Yes, they're not as terrible as some more autocratic and despotic regimes. But it is naive to think that they're not an imperial force who would never commit any attrocities. Just a remider, the USA government runs guantanamo.
- ShamelessC 4y ago
  > neither of their 1900 employees are not at risky of being forced forced What a compelling argument
Sin2x 4y ago
They also have a pretty darn good project-based learning platorm: https://hyperskill.org/tracks https://hyperskill.org/tracks
syngrog66 4y ago
JetBrains makes excellent IDEs but their heavy Russian connection makes it a challenge to consider their tools when security is a top concern. I wish I knew of tools comparable to theirs but without the problematic associations.
- The_Colonel 4y ago
  JetBrains explicitly condemned Russia on the day of invasion: https://twitter.com/jetbrains/status/1496786254494670851 https://twitter.com/jetbrains/status/1496786254494670851 And dissolved all their operations in Russia very quickly: https://blog.jetbrains.com/blog/2022/03/11/jetbrains-statement-on-ukraine/ https://blog.jetbrains.com/blog/2022/03/11/jetbrains-stateme... Their conduct was exemplary. If you mean their place of birth / nationality, then I guess there's nothing they can do about that.
- kaba0 4y ago
  The community edition is open source. Also, you can quite easily check for any data sent to specific IPs or even disable anything except your projects git repo for example.
- mekster 4y ago
  So you read general news only and not their blog.

258 points by davidbarker 4y ago

Oh wow, they have a HoTT research group? That's very interesting, and exciting. I'd love a JetBrains automated proof assistant.

bmc7505 4y ago
https://arend-lang.github.io https://arend-lang.github.io
- ericmay 4y ago
  Very neat. Thanks for sharing.
- lake_vincent 4y ago
  swoons

estsauver 4y ago

I'm curious how they arrived on some of these topics: Things like proof assistants seem like relatively straightforward extensions of their programming language expertise, but paper summarisation seems really out of left field. It also says it's a private entity--is this structured as a pure research company owned by JetBrains or as something else? Cool my IntelliJ license is (maybe?) supporting some really interesting academic projects.

Q6T46nT668w6i3m 4y ago
I don’t know but it’s common, in industry research, to let researchers independently choose their focus.
pumpkinprog 4y ago
> is this structured as a pure research company owned by JetBrains or as something else They mostly collaborate with independent university labs, giving them funding in exchage for working under the JBR brand and promoting some of their products (like Kotlin language).

bmc7505 4y ago

JBR is one of the very few industry labs that conducts pure research in CS and programming language theory. For a relatively small company, their publication record is exemplary. https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C5&q=%22JetBrains+research%22+acm&btnG= https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C5&q=%22J...

Genbox 4y ago
"Small" here being 1900 full-time employees and ~250 interns in 10 different offices[1] [1] https://www.jetbrains.com/lp/annualreport-2022/ https://www.jetbrains.com/lp/annualreport-2022/
- xeromal 4y ago
  They did write "relative" in front of small. They're a mite compared to FAANG and yet publish prolifically.
- bmc7505 4y ago
  Compared with MSR or Brain which have over 100x their headcount, JBR punches well above their weight in CORE CS conference and journal publications.
- mekster 4y ago
  Why do they need that many for the products they have? Sounds like just because they can but not exactly using them effectively on the new fleet offering by the look of the progress speed.

pigtailgirl 4y ago

-- JetBrains have existed since 2000 & till recently they didn't cross my radar - what happened in the last year that I see them trending all over the Dev-o-sphere? Seems they've really hit their stride - is there a particular product folks have adopted or their marketing has improved or....? --

medwards666 4y ago
Not sure, but they've really been active the last couple of years in language training and collaborative development. Plus, I happen to think their IDEs are probably the best out there (despite their relative complexity). Been a happy user of their IDE suite now for many years, and IMHO, nothing else comes even close.
philipwhiuk 4y ago
They make software IDEs IntelliJ Ultimate is widely considered one of the best for Java development (Android Studio is a fork of the open source branch).
- TheRealDunkirk 4y ago
  I had to work on a Java-based web application for a brief-but-terrible moment, and I am very happy to have spent the money out of my own pocket for IntelliJ. I think using Java for web apps is a Bad Idea, but IntelliJ, at least, made it tolerable to write code for.
  - stjohnswarts 4y ago
    Java is great for web apps. Libraries for everything, quite fast if you keep services running (as opposed to loading them on demand) and has been quite successful in the sphere for quite some time. It's just not everyone's cup of tea. I think the more you like dynamic languages or functional the more you're going to absolutely hate java.
    - TheRealDunkirk 4y ago

user3939382 4y ago

This is amazing! The cynical side of me says, please let me switch git branches in CLI without PhpStorm losing my branch context/file set — a bug that’s been sitting for 5 years and basically looks like is never getting fixed.

ithrow 4y ago
This is my beef sometimes with this IDEs, is hard to change their stubborn behaviors.
nine_k 4y ago
Their IDEs are more or less modular. So if the git integration is included in Community Edition of anything (like Idea or PyCharm), the source code must be there, and you can theoretically fix it. Then the fix should apply everywhere.

mdaniel 4y ago

they have a GH org, too: https://github.com/JetBrains-Research https://github.com/JetBrains-Research

Drunk_Engineer 4y ago

Looks like their research groups are in Russia. Not sure how that's going to work going forward.

helge9210 4y ago
Since escalation in Ukraine (war itself started in 2014) they conducted a massive relocation of personnel out of Russia to EU.
- silexia 4y ago
  - Mikeb85 4y ago
    JetBrains was founded in the Czech Republic ~2 decades ago. While what you say is no doubt true for many of their employees, I'm guessing their founders have had enough time to distance themselves from Russia given their exit was always a possibility.
Mikeb85 4y ago
They closed their Russia offices and no longer do any business in Russia. https://blog.jetbrains.com/blog/2022/03/11/jetbrains-statement-on-ukraine/ https://blog.jetbrains.com/blog/2022/03/11/jetbrains-stateme...
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- Drunk_Engineer 4y ago
  They should update their home page. It still shows offices in Russia, with a footnote saying "suspended".

silexia 4y ago

stusmall 4y ago
First, they are a Czech company. Second, they have taken a public and open stance against the war. https://blog.jetbrains.com/blog/2022/03/11/jetbrains-statement-on-ukraine/ https://blog.jetbrains.com/blog/2022/03/11/jetbrains-stateme...
- isbvhodnvemrwvn 4y ago
  They are Czech on paper, founders and most high level employees are Russian. Their main dev center used to be Sankt Petersburg, that's why Kotlin is named like that.
  - kgeist 4y ago
    >Their main dev center used to be Sankt Petersburg Is it still true? There were news of them selling their properties in St.Petersburg.
    - Genbox 4y ago
      Their offices in Moscow (Capital of Russia. Largest city), Saint Petersburg (Second largest city in Russia) and Novosibirsk (Third largest city in Russia) were suspended indefinitely in March 2022[1] [1] https://www.jetbrains.com/company/ https://www.jetbrains.com/company/
    - atemerev 4y ago
      They are moving out from Russia as fast as they can, but unfortunately it takes time.
  - tasuki 4y ago
    ... making it even more impressive that they have taken a public stance against the war!

w10-1 4y ago

JetBrains has done well by copying and privatizing code. They're among the leaders in pretending open-source. After they were bought out, they went all-in on the subscription model. Their technical initiatives and research may be mostly for recruiting and branding. Their language toolkit has been their primary infrastructure, but no one else seems to have built anything on it. Yes, they are Russian. The concern is that their code gets downloaded and run with full privileges everywhere. But the bulk is JVM-based and easily analyzed (no?). As far as I know, they have never been caught doing anything wrong, and their code has never been implicated, in their decades of business. And Google likely vetted them before agreeing to anoint their IDE and language for Android development, right? The bio's of the computational bio researchers are suspect. It's unlikely their model is actually used for anything. I imagine data from the subscription would be very useful to Russia. In short: plenty to worry about, and nothing to worry about :)

bigbillheck 4y ago
> Yes, they are Russian The available evidence disagrees. (They're from Czechia)
atleta 4y ago
They are not 'all in' on the subscription model: if you stop paying you still get to use the last version issued while you were a subscriber. (Or maybe the one that was the current one when you paid your yearly subscription, but it doesn't make much of a difference.) They call it 'perpetual fallback license'. I think it's a fair compromise between owning what you have paid for and being able to fund continuous development of the platform (and also to be able to receive updates without having to make a buy/skip decision all the time). Also, they are not a Russian company and have severed ties with Russia a few weeks after the war has started.
- nightski 4y ago
  Yes if you stop paying you need to downgrade to the version at the time of payment, probably from a year ago. It can make a big difference if the ecosystem is changing. For example, in .NET if you are using a newer version of .NET at that time it could make the IDE unusable. I have been using their products for over a decade but I still hate this model. Typically when buying a full product + support subscription you are supposedly paying for bug fixes/enhancements that come during that support period - it's built into the price.

newaccount2021 4y ago

gotts 4y ago

msoad 4y ago
with that logic many Russians also work for Google, Microsoft or Facebook. So what? Picking a name from Russia is not a crime! What is this comment?!
user3939382 4y ago
This feels reminiscent of Dr. Strangelove. It’s like saying: remember anyone working for a US company could be coerced by the CIA! If you don’t like Putin fine, we don’t need a witch hunt against anything remotely Russian.
bsedlm 4y ago
I'm appaled how the american propaganda machine convinces so many people that they're out there fighting for freedom and for the world. Obviously they have to protect their imperialistic interest in order for their hegemonic mastery over the world to make sense. Yes, they're not as terrible as some more autocratic and despotic regimes. But it is naive to think that they're not an imperial force who would never commit any attrocities. Just a remider, the USA government runs guantanamo.
ShamelessC 4y ago
> neither of their 1900 employees are not at risky of being forced forced What a compelling argument

Sin2x 4y ago

They also have a pretty darn good project-based learning platorm: https://hyperskill.org/tracks https://hyperskill.org/tracks

syngrog66 4y ago

JetBrains makes excellent IDEs but their heavy Russian connection makes it a challenge to consider their tools when security is a top concern. I wish I knew of tools comparable to theirs but without the problematic associations.

The_Colonel 4y ago
JetBrains explicitly condemned Russia on the day of invasion: https://twitter.com/jetbrains/status/1496786254494670851 https://twitter.com/jetbrains/status/1496786254494670851 And dissolved all their operations in Russia very quickly: https://blog.jetbrains.com/blog/2022/03/11/jetbrains-statement-on-ukraine/ https://blog.jetbrains.com/blog/2022/03/11/jetbrains-stateme... Their conduct was exemplary. If you mean their place of birth / nationality, then I guess there's nothing they can do about that.
kaba0 4y ago
The community edition is open source. Also, you can quite easily check for any data sent to specific IPs or even disable anything except your projects git repo for example.
mekster 4y ago
So you read general news only and not their blog.