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I was testing a light bulb socket one time, and accidentally shorted it - the short set fire to the metal of the bulb socket (I assume it was aluminum), which p

by ars 4y ago

I was testing a light bulb socket one time, and accidentally shorted it - the short set fire to the metal of the bulb socket (I assume it was aluminum), which proceeded to burn until it was all consumed, despite me pulling the plug. It produced a jet of flame and sparks many feet tall. I had no idea this was even something that could happen. I can't even imagine how bad a powerful arc flash would be.

colechristensen 4y ago
Yeah metal fires are no joke. Hard to start but when they do…
- kadoban 4y ago
  Not _exactly_ just a metal fire, but along similar lines: thermite reaction videos are fun to look at on youtube. In person I get the sense that they're too scary and unpleasant to really be a good time to be around, even if well controlled.
  - Gare 4y ago
    Thermite welding is commonly used to join railway tracks - not that scary in person.
    - kadoban 4y ago
      Welding giant blocks of metal together in one go is scary enough for me :)
pflanze 4y ago
> I assume it was aluminum Maybe it was magnesium? That is known to burn once ignited. Aluminium AFAIK doesn't (unless it is powder).
- zaarn 4y ago
  Aluminium burns too, just harder to get going. Almost all the metals can be coaxed into burning in various ways, all metal fires are an absolute disaster when they happen.
  - pflanze 4y ago
    Can you point to an aluminium fire that wasn't based on the aluminium being powdered, and where there were no fire enhancers (O2-enriched atmosphere, oxidizers like permanganate) present, and that sustained itself? (Because that's the conditions ars was talking about. Maybe if in ars' case the aluminium part was mostly liquid due to the short before it started burning that would explain it, but then they didn't describe it that way.)
    - zaarn 4y ago
      Google "aluminum foundry fire", there is plenty of examples. It does not burn easily but once aluminum has ignited it can continue to burn under normal atmospheric conditions, especially if it begins to melt and boil.
      - pflanze 4y ago
        Yes, what I've found indicates that aluminium burns when it boils, which is at 3073 °C, which doesn't happen in normal fires (house, car, forest fires), which is why it's safe in normal fires. It is melting at 660°C, at which point it doesn't burn unless perhaps if finely distributed by way of pressured air bursts or similar. Sparks are hotter than 3073°C, but usually they don't ignite aluminium either--there not being enough aluminium vapour to sustain the reaction. I've done what you said and googled, but have not found a case that indicates non-dust aluminium was burning. https://www.readingeagle.com/2022/04/19/reamstown-fire-aluminum-foundry/ https://www.readingeagle.com/2022/04/19/reamstown-fire-alumi... : Looks like a dust fire. Easily extinguished. Does not sound like any solid or molten aluminium was burning. https://dailyvoice.com/pennsylvania/lancaster/news/fire-breaks-out-at-central-pa-aluminum-foundry/830463/ https://dailyvoice.com/pennsylvania/lancaster/news/fire-brea... "The fire is believed to have started in the finishing area, where workers grind the aluminum castings" https://www.fox43.com/article/news/local/fire-aluminum-foundry-lancaster-county/521-ea797ae2-bc44-44dc-b44f-011795006ab7 https://www.fox43.com/article/news/local/fire-aluminum-found... no details https://lancasteronline.com/news/local/fire-damages-east-cocalico-township-aluminum-foundry/article_26a8231e-c023-11ec-88e4-530042637917.html https://lancasteronline.com/news/local/fire-damages-east-coc... "not sure what caused the fire, which began near – but not in – a dust collection system at the plant." https://www.abc4.com/news/fire-causes-400k-in-damages-to-ogden-aluminum-foundry/ https://www.abc4.com/news/fire-causes-400k-in-damages-to-ogd... "The fire was contained within an hour after crews arrived. No one was injured. Damages were mainly to the machinery and the foundry metal fabrication plant structure." https://mix999fm.iheart.com/featured/murphy-sam-jodi/content/2022-06-06-viral-video-shows-catastrophic-failure-at-aluminum-extrusion-line/ https://mix999fm.iheart.com/featured/murphy-sam-jodi/content... https://news.yahoo.com/fire-boose-aluminum-foundry-lancaster-202021510.html https://news.yahoo.com/fire-boose-aluminum-foundry-lancaster... (Video shows normal flames, not from a metal fire.)

by ars 4y ago

colechristensen 4y ago

Yeah metal fires are no joke. Hard to start but when they do…

kadoban 4y ago
Not _exactly_ just a metal fire, but along similar lines: thermite reaction videos are fun to look at on youtube. In person I get the sense that they're too scary and unpleasant to really be a good time to be around, even if well controlled.
- Gare 4y ago
  Thermite welding is commonly used to join railway tracks - not that scary in person.
  - kadoban 4y ago
    Welding giant blocks of metal together in one go is scary enough for me :)

pflanze 4y ago

> I assume it was aluminum Maybe it was magnesium? That is known to burn once ignited. Aluminium AFAIK doesn't (unless it is powder).

zaarn 4y ago
Aluminium burns too, just harder to get going. Almost all the metals can be coaxed into burning in various ways, all metal fires are an absolute disaster when they happen.
- pflanze 4y ago
  Can you point to an aluminium fire that wasn't based on the aluminium being powdered, and where there were no fire enhancers (O2-enriched atmosphere, oxidizers like permanganate) present, and that sustained itself? (Because that's the conditions ars was talking about. Maybe if in ars' case the aluminium part was mostly liquid due to the short before it started burning that would explain it, but then they didn't describe it that way.)
  - zaarn 4y ago
    Google "aluminum foundry fire", there is plenty of examples. It does not burn easily but once aluminum has ignited it can continue to burn under normal atmospheric conditions, especially if it begins to melt and boil.
    - pflanze 4y ago
      Yes, what I've found indicates that aluminium burns when it boils, which is at 3073 °C, which doesn't happen in normal fires (house, car, forest fires), which is why it's safe in normal fires. It is melting at 660°C, at which point it doesn't burn unless perhaps if finely distributed by way of pressured air bursts or similar. Sparks are hotter than 3073°C, but usually they don't ignite aluminium either--there not being enough aluminium vapour to sustain the reaction. I've done what you said and googled, but have not found a case that indicates non-dust aluminium was burning. https://www.readingeagle.com/2022/04/19/reamstown-fire-aluminum-foundry/ https://www.readingeagle.com/2022/04/19/reamstown-fire-alumi... : Looks like a dust fire. Easily extinguished. Does not sound like any solid or molten aluminium was burning. https://dailyvoice.com/pennsylvania/lancaster/news/fire-breaks-out-at-central-pa-aluminum-foundry/830463/ https://dailyvoice.com/pennsylvania/lancaster/news/fire-brea... "The fire is believed to have started in the finishing area, where workers grind the aluminum castings" https://www.fox43.com/article/news/local/fire-aluminum-foundry-lancaster-county/521-ea797ae2-bc44-44dc-b44f-011795006ab7 https://www.fox43.com/article/news/local/fire-aluminum-found... no details https://lancasteronline.com/news/local/fire-damages-east-cocalico-township-aluminum-foundry/article_26a8231e-c023-11ec-88e4-530042637917.html https://lancasteronline.com/news/local/fire-damages-east-coc... "not sure what caused the fire, which began near – but not in – a dust collection system at the plant." https://www.abc4.com/news/fire-causes-400k-in-damages-to-ogden-aluminum-foundry/ https://www.abc4.com/news/fire-causes-400k-in-damages-to-ogd... "The fire was contained within an hour after crews arrived. No one was injured. Damages were mainly to the machinery and the foundry metal fabrication plant structure." https://mix999fm.iheart.com/featured/murphy-sam-jodi/content/2022-06-06-viral-video-shows-catastrophic-failure-at-aluminum-extrusion-line/ https://mix999fm.iheart.com/featured/murphy-sam-jodi/content... https://news.yahoo.com/fire-boose-aluminum-foundry-lancaster-202021510.html https://news.yahoo.com/fire-boose-aluminum-foundry-lancaster... (Video shows normal flames, not from a metal fire.)