5 ms·

Salivary microbiome reveals a dysbiotic schizophrenia-associated microbiota

44 points by bmau5 4y ago

david_l_lin 4y ago
Super interesting study! Other studies also associated the oral microbiome with cognitive health, like depression and Alzheimer's, but this is an interesting finding. >H2S-producing bacteria exhibited disease-stage-specific enrichment and could be potential diagnostic biomarkers This would suggest that people with bad breath may have higher risk of schizophrenia? Or maybe the reverse? I also wonder if this was controlled for oral hygiene routines and oral health in general? I would assume people with uncontrolled schizophrenia have worse oral health, which may be a factor?
- BizarroLand 4y ago
  Makes me wonder what parts of your mental and emotional health are mediated by your own breath? Since the brain attenuates everything outside of the status quo what portion of what it is spending energy attenuating is your own malodorous exhalations? How does the static labor of keeping your autonomous body on cruise control affect your mental and emotional health? If we could identify and control some of those things, how would their presence or absence alter your mood and worldview?
- grawprog 4y ago
  This is anecdotal but, I used to know somebody with schizophrenia. This person regularly took care of their teeth but had pretty bad dental problems. Lots of cavities and gum disease and such. Apparently they were even told by a dentist at one point they just had 'bad bacteria' in their mouth and would likely have tooth problems for the rest of their life.
  - aaaaaaaaata 4y ago
    Ways to fix "bad bacteria" are plentiful. This is a story of medical and personal negligence.
cjbgkagh 4y ago
Are Clinical High Risk people medicated? Because surely the medicine would affect microbiota especially in the mouth.
- david_l_lin 4y ago
  Majority were not on medication. >Eighty-five FES patients and 35 CHR subjects were psychotropic medication naïve and all participants were free of substance abuse, suicidal ideation, and unstable medical illness.
  - cjbgkagh 4y ago
    Thanks, that’s what I was looking for.
Melatonic 4y ago
Its also linked to gut microbiome. All connected. There is growing evidence that Fluoride (or other chemicals) in toothpaste may be a cause or partial cause - fluoride is essentially a disinfectant and will kill both the good and bad bacteria in your mouth. Of course there are huge benefits in terms of helping your teeth remineralize but there is a reason they tell you very specifically to NOT swallow your toothpaste. I recently switched to HPA toothpaste (different compound than fluoride) which also helps your teeth remineralize but does not disinfect your mouth. Supposedly it may mineralize better than fluoride (although I do not have a source for this - it may be the same level or worse - but it definitely does help) and has been used in Japan for a long, long time. NASA has even been giving it to the astronauts for years that go to the space station. The idea is that since it does not destroy your mouth microbiome you can (hopefully) get it to a healthier state - probably by also eating fermented foods and prebiotics and getting your gut in sync as well. Best part is though that because its not toxic at all you are supposed to not wash it out - which means it has much longer to stay in contact with your teeth. I floss, do a light brushing with no toothpaste, rinse my mouth, and then another light brushing with the HPA toothpaste and just leave it in. It tastes good and there's no harm in swallowing. Crossing my fingers it also helps with bad breathe.

44 points by bmau5 4y ago

Super interesting study! Other studies also associated the oral microbiome with cognitive health, like depression and Alzheimer's, but this is an interesting finding. >H2S-producing bacteria exhibited disease-stage-specific enrichment and could be potential diagnostic biomarkers This would suggest that people with bad breath may have higher risk of schizophrenia? Or maybe the reverse? I also wonder if this was controlled for oral hygiene routines and oral health in general? I would assume people with uncontrolled schizophrenia have worse oral health, which may be a factor?

BizarroLand 4y ago
Makes me wonder what parts of your mental and emotional health are mediated by your own breath? Since the brain attenuates everything outside of the status quo what portion of what it is spending energy attenuating is your own malodorous exhalations? How does the static labor of keeping your autonomous body on cruise control affect your mental and emotional health? If we could identify and control some of those things, how would their presence or absence alter your mood and worldview?
grawprog 4y ago
This is anecdotal but, I used to know somebody with schizophrenia. This person regularly took care of their teeth but had pretty bad dental problems. Lots of cavities and gum disease and such. Apparently they were even told by a dentist at one point they just had 'bad bacteria' in their mouth and would likely have tooth problems for the rest of their life.
- aaaaaaaaata 4y ago
  Ways to fix "bad bacteria" are plentiful. This is a story of medical and personal negligence.

cjbgkagh 4y ago

Are Clinical High Risk people medicated? Because surely the medicine would affect microbiota especially in the mouth.

david_l_lin 4y ago
Majority were not on medication. >Eighty-five FES patients and 35 CHR subjects were psychotropic medication naïve and all participants were free of substance abuse, suicidal ideation, and unstable medical illness.
- cjbgkagh 4y ago
  Thanks, that’s what I was looking for.

Melatonic 4y ago

Its also linked to gut microbiome. All connected. There is growing evidence that Fluoride (or other chemicals) in toothpaste may be a cause or partial cause - fluoride is essentially a disinfectant and will kill both the good and bad bacteria in your mouth. Of course there are huge benefits in terms of helping your teeth remineralize but there is a reason they tell you very specifically to NOT swallow your toothpaste. I recently switched to HPA toothpaste (different compound than fluoride) which also helps your teeth remineralize but does not disinfect your mouth. Supposedly it may mineralize better than fluoride (although I do not have a source for this - it may be the same level or worse - but it definitely does help) and has been used in Japan for a long, long time. NASA has even been giving it to the astronauts for years that go to the space station. The idea is that since it does not destroy your mouth microbiome you can (hopefully) get it to a healthier state - probably by also eating fermented foods and prebiotics and getting your gut in sync as well. Best part is though that because its not toxic at all you are supposed to not wash it out - which means it has much longer to stay in contact with your teeth. I floss, do a light brushing with no toothpaste, rinse my mouth, and then another light brushing with the HPA toothpaste and just leave it in. It tastes good and there's no harm in swallowing. Crossing my fingers it also helps with bad breathe.