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totally understand your POV. I am pro crypto because I think banks and VC and hedge funds and market makers and all of these shadow/mystery shits that go down i

by nubb 4y ago

totally understand your POV. I am pro crypto because I think banks and VC and hedge funds and market makers and all of these shadow/mystery shits that go down in the real markets are scammy and evil. while its possible to obfuscate things on a chain ledger, its impossible to really hide. blockchain tech puts everything in the open which i think would prevent a lot of crime that exists today and goes completely unchecked. i prob didnt say all that super well but i hope you get the spirit of my argument. i totally respect your opinion here though because you are not wrong :)

Closi 4y ago
> I am pro crypto because I think banks and VC and hedge funds [...] are scammy Liking Crypto because you think hedge funds are scammy is kind of like enjoying swimming because rain makes you wet. Today's crypto is much more rife with scams and Ponzi schemes than hedge funds currently are (because of actual legislation).
- asenna 4y ago
  Problem with arguments like these is you put all of crypto/web3 into one category. Yes there are scams out there. Lot more than other fields. But just take 2 or 3 solid examples - Uniswap, DyDx, etc -> These are much more open and decentralized and transparent than their TradFi counterparts. If you think Uniswap is a scam, you haven't looked into it yet. Yes the tokens that get listed on it can be scams but that's up to to the buyer to assume the risk. As a tool, it's so much more transparent than anything that existed before it.
  - Closi 4y ago
    Yes, but the parent comment also put all banks and hedge funds into a single category. > If you think Uniswap is a scam, you haven't looked into it yet. Yes the tokens that get listed on it can be scams but that's up to to the buyer to assume the risk. I never said anything about Uniswap personally, but using a company that can list scams as an example about how non-scammy crypto can be is a little strange to me.
avgDev 4y ago
You like unregulated market because you think regulated market is "scammy"? I can't recall a brokerage such as Schwab or vanguard ever losing my money, compared to Mt.Gox and other trash crypto exchanges.
rurp 4y ago
Out of curiosity, what do you find scammy about market makers?
Yizahi 4y ago
So you wish to change a system where tens of thousands people regulate currencies, and significant number of them are scammers or evil, for the system where tens of people regulate currencies and half of them were actually convicted for scams, sometimes multiple times, and who live in the non-extradition offshores. Great idea, awesome. PS: this what I actually hate a lot about tokenbros - they say that there is a problem in the economy with unaccountability of the world elites (ok, true at at least somewhat), and then want to supplant it with an even worse system, even more centralized, even more unequal, even more dangerous to common people, even less secure, and even less accountable for the elites in charge. The sheer audacity of their lies is mind boggling and induces literal rage.
- imtringued 4y ago
  This is actually my big issue with the Austrian school of economics. Get rid of state extortion and then what? Get extorted by local oligarchs or warlords doing the same thing? If the world changed into their utopia, we would end up with some form of feudalism again and we would have to fight our way back to democracy. It is easy to argue that X>0 extortion is unjust and hence this pillar of society ought to be demolished, but that is the fallacy of composition. That pillar might not be the best or prettiest but it certainly is important and without it a lot of things would go wrong. What is ignored is that the pillar protects you from Y extortion where Y > X.

by nubb 4y ago

Closi 4y ago

> I am pro crypto because I think banks and VC and hedge funds [...] are scammy Liking Crypto because you think hedge funds are scammy is kind of like enjoying swimming because rain makes you wet. Today's crypto is much more rife with scams and Ponzi schemes than hedge funds currently are (because of actual legislation).

asenna 4y ago
Problem with arguments like these is you put all of crypto/web3 into one category. Yes there are scams out there. Lot more than other fields. But just take 2 or 3 solid examples - Uniswap, DyDx, etc -> These are much more open and decentralized and transparent than their TradFi counterparts. If you think Uniswap is a scam, you haven't looked into it yet. Yes the tokens that get listed on it can be scams but that's up to to the buyer to assume the risk. As a tool, it's so much more transparent than anything that existed before it.
- Closi 4y ago
  Yes, but the parent comment also put all banks and hedge funds into a single category. > If you think Uniswap is a scam, you haven't looked into it yet. Yes the tokens that get listed on it can be scams but that's up to to the buyer to assume the risk. I never said anything about Uniswap personally, but using a company that can list scams as an example about how non-scammy crypto can be is a little strange to me.

avgDev 4y ago

You like unregulated market because you think regulated market is "scammy"? I can't recall a brokerage such as Schwab or vanguard ever losing my money, compared to Mt.Gox and other trash crypto exchanges.

rurp 4y ago

Out of curiosity, what do you find scammy about market makers?

Yizahi 4y ago

So you wish to change a system where tens of thousands people regulate currencies, and significant number of them are scammers or evil, for the system where tens of people regulate currencies and half of them were actually convicted for scams, sometimes multiple times, and who live in the non-extradition offshores. Great idea, awesome. PS: this what I actually hate a lot about tokenbros - they say that there is a problem in the economy with unaccountability of the world elites (ok, true at at least somewhat), and then want to supplant it with an even worse system, even more centralized, even more unequal, even more dangerous to common people, even less secure, and even less accountable for the elites in charge. The sheer audacity of their lies is mind boggling and induces literal rage.

imtringued 4y ago
This is actually my big issue with the Austrian school of economics. Get rid of state extortion and then what? Get extorted by local oligarchs or warlords doing the same thing? If the world changed into their utopia, we would end up with some form of feudalism again and we would have to fight our way back to democracy. It is easy to argue that X>0 extortion is unjust and hence this pillar of society ought to be demolished, but that is the fallacy of composition. That pillar might not be the best or prettiest but it certainly is important and without it a lot of things would go wrong. What is ignored is that the pillar protects you from Y extortion where Y > X.