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Adjacent to this topic, I was recently thinking about how little commercial air travel has changed in the past 50 years. You can no longer smoke on an airplane,

Adjacent to this topic, I was recently thinking about how little commercial air travel has changed in the past 50 years. You can no longer smoke on an airplane, which is great. Security is a nightmare, which is less great. Has anything else changed?

kevinventullo 4y ago
I believe it is far more convenient as there are now many more direct flights and they’re much cheaper after adjusting for inflation.
hamrickdavid 4y ago
Not a ton has changed for the better - but a few things have: 1. Ticket prices have come down in real terms (especially with the advent of low cost airlines) 2. Fuel economy on newer jets has improved 3. Increased number of routes and frequencies 4. Lie flat seats in business and above on long haul 5. WiFi on planes 6. In-flight entertainment - both seatback units and video over WiFi
- ghaff 4y ago
  And you don't need to basically go into a travel agent and get a piece of paper that is incredibly hard to replace if lost. In general, travel information is a lot more frictionless. Flight cancelled, bags lost? There's an app for that. And in general, clothing expectations mean I have to check bags a lot fewer times. As you say, seating is better if you're willing to pay for it but I've never bought WiFi on a flight. It's one of the few opportunities I have to really read anyway.
  - AnimalMuppet 4y ago
    Flight information online is huge. Just yesterday[1], we had to pick someone up at the airport when their flight was 10 hours late. We got to do our waiting not at the airport. That's a game changer. [1] Well, we were supposed to pick them up yesterday. They actually arrived today. 10 hours late on an afternoon flight is like that.
- Aloha 4y ago
  Airplanes no long crash into the earth at an alarmingly frequent rate. Like they used to sell life insurance at the airport because of both the perception of how unsafe things were and the reality of it - per Wikipedia, in 1969 there were 21 air crashes or incidents - the vast majority of which had fatalities, in 2019, there were 12, the vast majority of which had none - this on top of an order of magnitude more flights in 2019 vs 1969 - the disparity grows even further when you look back into the 50's.
- eru 4y ago
  About the first and third ones, see https://www.econlib.org/library/Enc/AirlineDeregulation.html https://www.econlib.org/library/Enc/AirlineDeregulation.html
lazycouchpotato 4y ago
The significant "cool" things I can think of is internet on planes, and being able to take a shower on certain first class flights. https://youtu.be/84WIaK3bl_s?t=424 https://youtu.be/84WIaK3bl_s?t=424
- ghaff 4y ago
  I don't find Internet on flights a particular convenience and, if you can take showers at airline clubs, that's not a big deal either. And I've never taken advantage of in either case.
  - drdaeman 4y ago
    > I don't find Internet on flights a particular convenience YMMV. I love being able to stay in touch with my folks or scroll HN/Reddit while I'm in the air with nothing to do but read a book or try to nap. > take showers at airline clubs That video is about Emirates First Class, where one can take a shower during the flight. This kind of convenience costs somewhat obscene amount of money, most people here I guess aren't the target audience.
    - ghaff 4y ago
      Well, nothing to do but read a book sounds delightful.
    - loloquwowndueo 4y ago
      Reading beats doomscrolling any time, airplane or not.
- bobthepanda 4y ago
  Lie flat seats are probably more important. Sleeping upright in a chair, even a very comfortable chair, sucks. Lie flat seats are a significant change in improvement, such that flying business today might actually be a better experience than first used to be.
rwc 4y ago
Safety! That's the biggest change. https://news.aviation-safety.net/2017/12/30/preliminary-asn-data-show-2017-safest-year-aviation-history/ https://news.aviation-safety.net/2017/12/30/preliminary-asn-...
- Aloha 4y ago
  You hit the nail on the head there.
- slg 4y ago
  There is no mention of terrorism on that list, but I think that is a safety related improvement that largely goes unnoticed. Yes, the TSA is generally mismanaged security theater, but overall security is so much better than it was 50 years ago. I don't think people realise how common hijacking where in the late 60s and early 70s. There was literally a hijacking every week or two. Now they are incredibly rare. There hasn't been a major one in the us in the 20+ years since 9/11.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
autoexec 4y ago
Seat width and leg room have decreased to pack in as many people as possible. They don't offer peanuts because the increasing numbers of people developing peanut allergies have made it too deadly. Passengers used to dress up for air travel, but now they dress for comfort. Alcohol used to be served for free. Passenger violence has increased. They started making people pay for bringing luggage in the 2000s, first with checked bag fees and then carry on bag fees.
- czstar 4y ago
  I remember flying during regulation and I wish we’d go back to those days. Flying back then was so much better.
  - tahoeskibum 4y ago
    It was also a lot more expensive back then. Today you can pay first class and get better service. Ultimately this is what happens when air travel gets democratized: people focus on low costs.
    - autoexec 4y ago
      Alternately, they add or increase costs for features that were once free/affordable until most people are priced out of them. Between those two forces (airlines cutting services in order to make flying available to more people, and airlines turning once standard features into high priced "premium" features to line their pockets at the expense of most travelers) the effect is pretty much the same: Most people who want to fly have no option, but to find the most affordable rates where they can expect to get substandard service while only a small number of very wealthy people get what used to be granted to everyone with a ticket. Air travel was once a luxury experience at a luxury price, and things had to change to open it to more people, but things like standing seats (https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/standing-up-airplane-seat-testing/index.html https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/standing-up-airplane-seat...) and fees for carry on bags are certainly not necessary and are just airlines abusing passengers for profit.
decafninja 4y ago
Wasn't air travel mostly restricted to the wealthy back then?

kevinventullo 4y ago

I believe it is far more convenient as there are now many more direct flights and they’re much cheaper after adjusting for inflation.

hamrickdavid 4y ago

Not a ton has changed for the better - but a few things have: 1. Ticket prices have come down in real terms (especially with the advent of low cost airlines) 2. Fuel economy on newer jets has improved 3. Increased number of routes and frequencies 4. Lie flat seats in business and above on long haul 5. WiFi on planes 6. In-flight entertainment - both seatback units and video over WiFi

ghaff 4y ago
And you don't need to basically go into a travel agent and get a piece of paper that is incredibly hard to replace if lost. In general, travel information is a lot more frictionless. Flight cancelled, bags lost? There's an app for that. And in general, clothing expectations mean I have to check bags a lot fewer times. As you say, seating is better if you're willing to pay for it but I've never bought WiFi on a flight. It's one of the few opportunities I have to really read anyway.
- AnimalMuppet 4y ago
  Flight information online is huge. Just yesterday[1], we had to pick someone up at the airport when their flight was 10 hours late. We got to do our waiting not at the airport. That's a game changer. [1] Well, we were supposed to pick them up yesterday. They actually arrived today. 10 hours late on an afternoon flight is like that.
Aloha 4y ago
Airplanes no long crash into the earth at an alarmingly frequent rate. Like they used to sell life insurance at the airport because of both the perception of how unsafe things were and the reality of it - per Wikipedia, in 1969 there were 21 air crashes or incidents - the vast majority of which had fatalities, in 2019, there were 12, the vast majority of which had none - this on top of an order of magnitude more flights in 2019 vs 1969 - the disparity grows even further when you look back into the 50's.
eru 4y ago
About the first and third ones, see https://www.econlib.org/library/Enc/AirlineDeregulation.html https://www.econlib.org/library/Enc/AirlineDeregulation.html

lazycouchpotato 4y ago

The significant "cool" things I can think of is internet on planes, and being able to take a shower on certain first class flights. https://youtu.be/84WIaK3bl_s?t=424 https://youtu.be/84WIaK3bl_s?t=424

ghaff 4y ago
I don't find Internet on flights a particular convenience and, if you can take showers at airline clubs, that's not a big deal either. And I've never taken advantage of in either case.
- drdaeman 4y ago
  > I don't find Internet on flights a particular convenience YMMV. I love being able to stay in touch with my folks or scroll HN/Reddit while I'm in the air with nothing to do but read a book or try to nap. > take showers at airline clubs That video is about Emirates First Class, where one can take a shower during the flight. This kind of convenience costs somewhat obscene amount of money, most people here I guess aren't the target audience.
  - ghaff 4y ago
    Well, nothing to do but read a book sounds delightful.
  - loloquwowndueo 4y ago
    Reading beats doomscrolling any time, airplane or not.
bobthepanda 4y ago
Lie flat seats are probably more important. Sleeping upright in a chair, even a very comfortable chair, sucks. Lie flat seats are a significant change in improvement, such that flying business today might actually be a better experience than first used to be.

rwc 4y ago

Safety! That's the biggest change. https://news.aviation-safety.net/2017/12/30/preliminary-asn-data-show-2017-safest-year-aviation-history/ https://news.aviation-safety.net/2017/12/30/preliminary-asn-...

Aloha 4y ago
You hit the nail on the head there.
slg 4y ago
There is no mention of terrorism on that list, but I think that is a safety related improvement that largely goes unnoticed. Yes, the TSA is generally mismanaged security theater, but overall security is so much better than it was 50 years ago. I don't think people realise how common hijacking where in the late 60s and early 70s. There was literally a hijacking every week or two. Now they are incredibly rare. There hasn't been a major one in the us in the 20+ years since 9/11.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]

autoexec 4y ago

Seat width and leg room have decreased to pack in as many people as possible. They don't offer peanuts because the increasing numbers of people developing peanut allergies have made it too deadly. Passengers used to dress up for air travel, but now they dress for comfort. Alcohol used to be served for free. Passenger violence has increased. They started making people pay for bringing luggage in the 2000s, first with checked bag fees and then carry on bag fees.

czstar 4y ago
I remember flying during regulation and I wish we’d go back to those days. Flying back then was so much better.
- tahoeskibum 4y ago
  It was also a lot more expensive back then. Today you can pay first class and get better service. Ultimately this is what happens when air travel gets democratized: people focus on low costs.
  - autoexec 4y ago
    Alternately, they add or increase costs for features that were once free/affordable until most people are priced out of them. Between those two forces (airlines cutting services in order to make flying available to more people, and airlines turning once standard features into high priced "premium" features to line their pockets at the expense of most travelers) the effect is pretty much the same: Most people who want to fly have no option, but to find the most affordable rates where they can expect to get substandard service while only a small number of very wealthy people get what used to be granted to everyone with a ticket. Air travel was once a luxury experience at a luxury price, and things had to change to open it to more people, but things like standing seats (https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/standing-up-airplane-seat-testing/index.html https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/standing-up-airplane-seat...) and fees for carry on bags are certainly not necessary and are just airlines abusing passengers for profit.

decafninja 4y ago

Wasn't air travel mostly restricted to the wealthy back then?