5 ms·

These are not $20k trash cans. The program is designing and producing prototypes. This is because various designs tried so far have had significant problems.

These are not $20k trash cans. The program is designing and producing prototypes. This is because various designs tried so far have had significant problems. How much mass produced final designs might cost is not yet known.

nradov 4y ago
Those "problems" are not real problems worth wasting money on. Regular trash cans used in other cities are cheap and work fine. SF city leadership is just dysfunctional and over complicating things as usual.
- jerlam 4y ago
  The main competitor for these trash cans is the BigBelly, which cost $3,000 a year to lease. They've already been deployed in some parts of SF and surrounding cities. https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/heatherknight/article/City-has-little-love-for-Bigbelly-bins-13309542.php https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/heatherknight/article/Ci...
  - iancmceachern 4y ago
    Not true. The main competitor is a regular dumb trash can you can buy from home depot for $50. Edited to say $50 not $10 per below comment.
    - deleted 4y ago
      [deleted]
    - mindslight 4y ago
      ^ Perfect demonstration of the bikeshed effect. You could have looked at some commercial supply catalogs and seen that trash cans used by businesses cost significantly more. You could have searched around and found that businesses and other institutions have significant costs for installation, maintenance, tracking, abuse, environmental factors, etc that require more substantial solutions to mitigate. Instead, I'll summarize that into this rebuttal comment, and I may even convince you that a $10 trash can that goes next to your toilet [0] won't work as a city trash can. But it won't stop the next person from posting the exact same type of anti-enlightening comment and thinking it's insightful. [0] These days it's $50 for a 44 gallon Brute, which will still get stolen or tip over in the wind.
      - iancmceachern 4y ago
        Thank you, point noted and accepted. I revise my comment to say $50
    - m0llusk 4y ago
      Simple trash cans like this do not endure long in dense city environments. The most common designs currently found have lasted for decades and cost way more than $50 when put in place. Have you ever done trash hauling in a city or are you just a reactionary?
      - iancmceachern 4y ago
        I've designed a lot of street furniture for companies like Cemusa, Jcd, etc. Even nice fancy stainless steel things that are built better to withstand a city are very inexpensive when ordered in quantity from overseas. A good example is a shipping container. They cost about $2k to manufacture in China. So, yes, I think a trash can should cost less to manufacture than a shipping container. Source: https://www.quora.com/How-much-cost-to-make-a-new-shipping-container?top_ans=344180855 https://www.quora.com/How-much-cost-to-make-a-new-shipping-c...
- m0llusk 4y ago
  SF has huge problems with street people emptying out garbage cans in search for food and tradable goods. The Big Belly options that were tried turned out to be targets for vandals and when they did work out the compacted trash ended up being too heavy for haulers to handle without specialized equipment. The reason you think this is overcomplicating things is that you haven't bothered to actually investigate the problem or attempts that have been made to solve it.
  - nradov 4y ago
    Those are not serious or widespread problems. Other cities manage to make do with cheaper options. This is just another case of lazy, overpaid government employees trying to justify their jobs.
    - m0llusk 4y ago
      This is filthy, wretched, evil garbage. San Francisco is very much unlike most cities. Instead of being satisfied with overflowing and consistently pillaged bins people are trying to better. You are against this because you are not observing the situation, because you are not capable of understanding how complex human systems like our biggest cities function, because you have contempt for everything outside your experience. Instead of trying to understand what is going on you just project. You rely on government employees and their works, but see all of them and lazy and useless. This is just another case of lazy critics trying to justify their ennui.
      - nradov 4y ago
        Nonsense. Most government employees do good work. I only complain about the ones who are wasteful and obviously incompetent, like in this case.

nradov 4y ago

Those "problems" are not real problems worth wasting money on. Regular trash cans used in other cities are cheap and work fine. SF city leadership is just dysfunctional and over complicating things as usual.

jerlam 4y ago
The main competitor for these trash cans is the BigBelly, which cost $3,000 a year to lease. They've already been deployed in some parts of SF and surrounding cities. https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/heatherknight/article/City-has-little-love-for-Bigbelly-bins-13309542.php https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/heatherknight/article/Ci...
- iancmceachern 4y ago
  Not true. The main competitor is a regular dumb trash can you can buy from home depot for $50. Edited to say $50 not $10 per below comment.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - mindslight 4y ago
    ^ Perfect demonstration of the bikeshed effect. You could have looked at some commercial supply catalogs and seen that trash cans used by businesses cost significantly more. You could have searched around and found that businesses and other institutions have significant costs for installation, maintenance, tracking, abuse, environmental factors, etc that require more substantial solutions to mitigate. Instead, I'll summarize that into this rebuttal comment, and I may even convince you that a $10 trash can that goes next to your toilet [0] won't work as a city trash can. But it won't stop the next person from posting the exact same type of anti-enlightening comment and thinking it's insightful. [0] These days it's $50 for a 44 gallon Brute, which will still get stolen or tip over in the wind.
    - iancmceachern 4y ago
      Thank you, point noted and accepted. I revise my comment to say $50
  - m0llusk 4y ago
    Simple trash cans like this do not endure long in dense city environments. The most common designs currently found have lasted for decades and cost way more than $50 when put in place. Have you ever done trash hauling in a city or are you just a reactionary?
    - iancmceachern 4y ago
      I've designed a lot of street furniture for companies like Cemusa, Jcd, etc. Even nice fancy stainless steel things that are built better to withstand a city are very inexpensive when ordered in quantity from overseas. A good example is a shipping container. They cost about $2k to manufacture in China. So, yes, I think a trash can should cost less to manufacture than a shipping container. Source: https://www.quora.com/How-much-cost-to-make-a-new-shipping-container?top_ans=344180855 https://www.quora.com/How-much-cost-to-make-a-new-shipping-c...
m0llusk 4y ago
SF has huge problems with street people emptying out garbage cans in search for food and tradable goods. The Big Belly options that were tried turned out to be targets for vandals and when they did work out the compacted trash ended up being too heavy for haulers to handle without specialized equipment. The reason you think this is overcomplicating things is that you haven't bothered to actually investigate the problem or attempts that have been made to solve it.
- nradov 4y ago
  Those are not serious or widespread problems. Other cities manage to make do with cheaper options. This is just another case of lazy, overpaid government employees trying to justify their jobs.
  - m0llusk 4y ago
    This is filthy, wretched, evil garbage. San Francisco is very much unlike most cities. Instead of being satisfied with overflowing and consistently pillaged bins people are trying to better. You are against this because you are not observing the situation, because you are not capable of understanding how complex human systems like our biggest cities function, because you have contempt for everything outside your experience. Instead of trying to understand what is going on you just project. You rely on government employees and their works, but see all of them and lazy and useless. This is just another case of lazy critics trying to justify their ennui.
    - nradov 4y ago
      Nonsense. Most government employees do good work. I only complain about the ones who are wasteful and obviously incompetent, like in this case.