6 ms·

More likely it will result in crippling the domestic UK tech industry while everyone else in the world ignores it. I really don't see most countries extraditing

More likely it will result in crippling the domestic UK tech industry while everyone else in the world ignores it. I really don't see most countries extraditing someone for the high crime of "let british users access a website without verifying their age".

solarkraft 4y ago
This has been said about the EU, but the market has proven to just be too big to ignore. It could also be the reverse (see authoritarian countries), with international players leaving the market and local ones filling the space.
- rarec 4y ago
  The EU's a bit bigger than the UK by a fair margin.
  - pessimizer 4y ago
    Probably by about 5x. If the UK makes things difficult, they can just be ignored.
    - toyg 4y ago
      It's actually 7x (65m vs 450m).
      - citrin_ru 4y ago
        Depends on what consider a proxy for market size. EU GDP to UK GDP ratio is about 4.5
- stickfigure 4y ago
  By "ignore it" I mean "ignore the law", not ignore the UK market. At some point the idea that countries can regulate the internet outside their borders falls apart. The US succeeds in enforcing its gambling laws WRT Americans, but that only works because other nations agree to do the enforcement. I just don't see that happening here. So maybe the UK becomes a no-travel zone for anyone in the worldwide tech industry? That would be sad, but it's a plausible outcome.
  - dymk 4y ago
    The US can enforce it for Americans because it's comparatively easy to see that somebody is making money from gambling, compared to visiting a website.
- mminer237 4y ago
  Very few websites comply with GDPR. Based on recent interpretations, it's essentially impossible for any US-owned or US-hosted site to comply with GDPR. The EU is just being extremely selective about its enforcement. If they ever decided to follow the law to the letter, most of the Internet would have to disconnect the EU. Theoretically the EU could make clones of all international sites like China has with Baidu and Weibo, but it's hard to see how that would be good for them. The UK's law is obviously a bit different as international companies can comply with them, but it would essentially just limit legal websites to big tech who have enough market reach that all that compliance could pay for itself.
  - akavel 4y ago
    Regarding GDPR, citation needed - do you have actual links you can share to those claimed "recent interpretations", and whose in particular they are? I'd be quite interested to see them, if true ,which I seriously doubt - for the time being, as an EU citizen, my understanding is, and continues to be, that it's totally possible for US corpos to adhere to GDPR; it would just require some money and effort to be spent by companies that blatantly hoover and hoard personally identifying data in hopes of squeezing some monies from it. And having to spend some money on anything that is not an investment into more money in the future seems to always trigger over-the-top allergic reaction in corporations. Until they feel the teeth of real law in painful fines, when suddenly "impossible" things will magically become possible.
    - mminer237 4y ago
      They're decisions by the governments of Germany, France, and Italy: * https://rewis.io/urteile/urteil/lhm-20-01-2022-3-o-1749320/ https://rewis.io/urteile/urteil/lhm-20-01-2022-3-o-1749320/ * https://www.cnil.fr/en/use-google-analytics-and-data-transfers-united-states-cnil-orders-website-manageroperator-comply https://www.cnil.fr/en/use-google-analytics-and-data-transfe... * https://www.gpdp.it/web/guest/home/docweb/-/docweb-display/docweb/9782890 https://www.gpdp.it/web/guest/home/docweb/-/docweb-display/d... So far they've just been enforced against companies that use Google Analytics, but the reasoning behind it has been that having users connect to a US server enables that server to know EU users' IP addresses (which are legally PII), which would be subject to US government subpoenas to collect such, and the US government has not agreed to handle data in compliance with the GDPR, therefore it's illegal to have users connect to any US servers. It has nothing to do with "hoover[ing] and hoard[ing]" data. The only way for an American website to comply would be to form a separate company not subject to US control at all. However, at that point it's not really an American website, since no data or control can go to the US. Theoretically you could use some international service to handle all primary routing and get users to waive their rights under the GDPR before connecting to your website proper, but I'm not aware of such a service at this time.
- calvinmorrison 4y ago
  I don't see how these multinational companies like Apple, etc don't end up with their own armies again like age old.
  - KptMarchewa 4y ago
    Like Pepsi?
    - freen 4y ago
      ^^ Underrated comment of the year.
  - bee_rider 4y ago
    Apple HIMARS -- the missile pods have rounded corners (but aren't compatible with NATO standards).
goatcode 4y ago
After my ears bleeding from trying to understand the legislation, I know I'll be ignoring it.
drusepth 4y ago
This definitely seems like a likely outcome, especially considering how the world has responded to GDPR: ignore it if you're out of the EU or throw resources at the problem to meet a bare minimum requirement (and cross your fingers) if you're in a country where it can actually be enforced.

solarkraft 4y ago

This has been said about the EU, but the market has proven to just be too big to ignore. It could also be the reverse (see authoritarian countries), with international players leaving the market and local ones filling the space.

rarec 4y ago
The EU's a bit bigger than the UK by a fair margin.
- pessimizer 4y ago
  Probably by about 5x. If the UK makes things difficult, they can just be ignored.
  - toyg 4y ago
    It's actually 7x (65m vs 450m).
    - citrin_ru 4y ago
      Depends on what consider a proxy for market size. EU GDP to UK GDP ratio is about 4.5
stickfigure 4y ago
By "ignore it" I mean "ignore the law", not ignore the UK market. At some point the idea that countries can regulate the internet outside their borders falls apart. The US succeeds in enforcing its gambling laws WRT Americans, but that only works because other nations agree to do the enforcement. I just don't see that happening here. So maybe the UK becomes a no-travel zone for anyone in the worldwide tech industry? That would be sad, but it's a plausible outcome.
- dymk 4y ago
  The US can enforce it for Americans because it's comparatively easy to see that somebody is making money from gambling, compared to visiting a website.
mminer237 4y ago
Very few websites comply with GDPR. Based on recent interpretations, it's essentially impossible for any US-owned or US-hosted site to comply with GDPR. The EU is just being extremely selective about its enforcement. If they ever decided to follow the law to the letter, most of the Internet would have to disconnect the EU. Theoretically the EU could make clones of all international sites like China has with Baidu and Weibo, but it's hard to see how that would be good for them. The UK's law is obviously a bit different as international companies can comply with them, but it would essentially just limit legal websites to big tech who have enough market reach that all that compliance could pay for itself.
- akavel 4y ago
  Regarding GDPR, citation needed - do you have actual links you can share to those claimed "recent interpretations", and whose in particular they are? I'd be quite interested to see them, if true ,which I seriously doubt - for the time being, as an EU citizen, my understanding is, and continues to be, that it's totally possible for US corpos to adhere to GDPR; it would just require some money and effort to be spent by companies that blatantly hoover and hoard personally identifying data in hopes of squeezing some monies from it. And having to spend some money on anything that is not an investment into more money in the future seems to always trigger over-the-top allergic reaction in corporations. Until they feel the teeth of real law in painful fines, when suddenly "impossible" things will magically become possible.
  - mminer237 4y ago
    They're decisions by the governments of Germany, France, and Italy: * https://rewis.io/urteile/urteil/lhm-20-01-2022-3-o-1749320/ https://rewis.io/urteile/urteil/lhm-20-01-2022-3-o-1749320/ * https://www.cnil.fr/en/use-google-analytics-and-data-transfers-united-states-cnil-orders-website-manageroperator-comply https://www.cnil.fr/en/use-google-analytics-and-data-transfe... * https://www.gpdp.it/web/guest/home/docweb/-/docweb-display/docweb/9782890 https://www.gpdp.it/web/guest/home/docweb/-/docweb-display/d... So far they've just been enforced against companies that use Google Analytics, but the reasoning behind it has been that having users connect to a US server enables that server to know EU users' IP addresses (which are legally PII), which would be subject to US government subpoenas to collect such, and the US government has not agreed to handle data in compliance with the GDPR, therefore it's illegal to have users connect to any US servers. It has nothing to do with "hoover[ing] and hoard[ing]" data. The only way for an American website to comply would be to form a separate company not subject to US control at all. However, at that point it's not really an American website, since no data or control can go to the US. Theoretically you could use some international service to handle all primary routing and get users to waive their rights under the GDPR before connecting to your website proper, but I'm not aware of such a service at this time.
calvinmorrison 4y ago
I don't see how these multinational companies like Apple, etc don't end up with their own armies again like age old.
- KptMarchewa 4y ago
  Like Pepsi?
  - freen 4y ago
    ^^ Underrated comment of the year.
- bee_rider 4y ago
  Apple HIMARS -- the missile pods have rounded corners (but aren't compatible with NATO standards).

goatcode 4y ago

After my ears bleeding from trying to understand the legislation, I know I'll be ignoring it.

drusepth 4y ago

This definitely seems like a likely outcome, especially considering how the world has responded to GDPR: ignore it if you're out of the EU or throw resources at the problem to meet a bare minimum requirement (and cross your fingers) if you're in a country where it can actually be enforced.