5 ms·

If I, a US citizen, started an online service that attracted Ofcom attention, what binds me to following UK regulations? The article mentions "extraterritorial

by vgel 4y ago

If I, a US citizen, started an online service that attracted Ofcom attention, what binds me to following UK regulations? The article mentions "extraterritorial enforcement", but what does that mean? Will the US extradite me to the UK if I don't put monitoring in place? Will I get arrested if I visit the UK? Will they try to sue me in US court? I mean realistically if it became a problem I'd just IP-block all of the UK because they're small, but I don't understand what the legal framework for "extraterritorial enforcement" even is.

intunderflow 4y ago
The Senior Managers Liability part means it's a criminal offence in the UK - so basically you could never visit the UK for fear of arrest.
LatteLazy 4y ago
In theory yes, in practice the US basically never extradites people to the UK and if they tried you would probably have a good defence (against extradition) under various parts of the constitution.
- solarkraft 4y ago
  Weird how it only goes one way, isn't it?
  - streblo 4y ago
    Is it?
  - Shuang1 4y ago
    It's not really weird. We have rights guaranteed to us in the United States that no other country has, so it makes sense we would not extradite.
    - rsstack 4y ago
      The US extradites people, including US citizens. That is required from the federal government by extradition treaties that are signed voluntarily by the US (in exchange for extradition _to_ the US). It is uncommon because they require escalations through the Department of State and not many crimes are serious enough to justify extradition.
      - AustinDev 4y ago
        The US does not extradite for crimes committed in the US to other countries at least I'm not aware of any cases.
        rsstack 4y ago
        No, there is not a precedent for that AFAIK. But the US does extradite, as we don't have "rights guaranteed to us in the United States that no other country has".
        AustinDev 4y ago
        I appreciate the candor. On my initial reading, I didn't get the scope of what you were saying; I agree.
      - dodobirdlord 4y ago
        The US does not allow extradition to other countries for crimes, or the enforcement of civil judgements originating in other countries, that stem from conduct that would be constitutionally protected in the US. For example, a US citizen cannot be extradited to face a charge of blasphemy.
    - louloulou 4y ago
      LOL. - Julian Assange
    - GoodbyeMrChips 4y ago
      > We have rights guaranteed to us in the United States that no other country has Good god! You really believe your own hype don't you? (I believe the American expression is "drunk the kool-aid").
  - Spivak 4y ago
    Well in this specific case it would be pants-on-head stupid because this person committed no crime while under UK jurisdiction. Like how would it even work if Alabama made it a crime for anyone in the world to have an abortion, extraditions all around?
    - rsstack 4y ago
      States aren't allowed to have treaties with foreign countries, so no country could have an extradition treaty with Alabama even if Alabama wanted to and that country agreed to it (in exchange for something has Alabama has to offer?).
  - bpye 4y ago
    The UK is frequently reluctant to extradite to the US too - often on human rights grounds.
- rsstack 4y ago
  "From January 2004 to the end of December 2011, seven known US citizens were extradited from the US to the UK. No US citizen was extradited for an alleged crime while the person was based in the US." https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/100739/response/255204/attach/3/Document.pdf?cookie_passthrough=1 https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/100739/response/25520... https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/9237663/No-American-citizens-extradited-to-UK-over-crimes-allegedly-committed-in-US.html https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/9237663/No-America...
muyuu 4y ago
as stupid as this sounds the US does the reverse already

by vgel 4y ago

intunderflow 4y ago

The Senior Managers Liability part means it's a criminal offence in the UK - so basically you could never visit the UK for fear of arrest.

LatteLazy 4y ago

In theory yes, in practice the US basically never extradites people to the UK and if they tried you would probably have a good defence (against extradition) under various parts of the constitution.

solarkraft 4y ago
Weird how it only goes one way, isn't it?
- streblo 4y ago
  Is it?
- Shuang1 4y ago
  It's not really weird. We have rights guaranteed to us in the United States that no other country has, so it makes sense we would not extradite.
  - rsstack 4y ago
    The US extradites people, including US citizens. That is required from the federal government by extradition treaties that are signed voluntarily by the US (in exchange for extradition _to_ the US). It is uncommon because they require escalations through the Department of State and not many crimes are serious enough to justify extradition.
    - AustinDev 4y ago
      The US does not extradite for crimes committed in the US to other countries at least I'm not aware of any cases.
      - rsstack 4y ago
        No, there is not a precedent for that AFAIK. But the US does extradite, as we don't have "rights guaranteed to us in the United States that no other country has".
        AustinDev 4y ago
        I appreciate the candor. On my initial reading, I didn't get the scope of what you were saying; I agree.
    - dodobirdlord 4y ago
      The US does not allow extradition to other countries for crimes, or the enforcement of civil judgements originating in other countries, that stem from conduct that would be constitutionally protected in the US. For example, a US citizen cannot be extradited to face a charge of blasphemy.
  - louloulou 4y ago
    LOL. - Julian Assange
  - GoodbyeMrChips 4y ago
    > We have rights guaranteed to us in the United States that no other country has Good god! You really believe your own hype don't you? (I believe the American expression is "drunk the kool-aid").
- Spivak 4y ago
  Well in this specific case it would be pants-on-head stupid because this person committed no crime while under UK jurisdiction. Like how would it even work if Alabama made it a crime for anyone in the world to have an abortion, extraditions all around?
  - rsstack 4y ago
    States aren't allowed to have treaties with foreign countries, so no country could have an extradition treaty with Alabama even if Alabama wanted to and that country agreed to it (in exchange for something has Alabama has to offer?).
- bpye 4y ago
  The UK is frequently reluctant to extradite to the US too - often on human rights grounds.
rsstack 4y ago
"From January 2004 to the end of December 2011, seven known US citizens were extradited from the US to the UK. No US citizen was extradited for an alleged crime while the person was based in the US." https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/100739/response/255204/attach/3/Document.pdf?cookie_passthrough=1 https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/100739/response/25520... https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/9237663/No-American-citizens-extradited-to-UK-over-crimes-allegedly-committed-in-US.html https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/9237663/No-America...

muyuu 4y ago

as stupid as this sounds the US does the reverse already