3 ms·

I live in South India. The temperature is often 33/34 C with 88% humidity. That is getting very close to the limit of human endurance. It’s really difficult to

I live in South India. The temperature is often 33/34 C with 88% humidity. That is getting very close to the limit of human endurance. It’s really difficult to work mentally or physically with no air conditioning. I work from home, and my wife and I mostly do our household chores (where the use of AC is not feasible) either early morning or after sunset. During the day it’s really hard to work without the AC.

doodlebugging 4y ago
Thank you for your personal story. I had to do the math to discover that 34C is actually only 93F. I have to respectfully disagree that those conditions are near the limits of human endurance. My own experience working outside in all kinds of weather causes me to see that temperature/humidity combination as fairly mild (normal summer temps for June/July) and easily survivable since I personally have known many people of all ages who manage to go about their business with no ill effects in conditions more extreme than that here in Texas. Current conditions here today were 103F (>39C) with heat index due to humidity making it feel like 106F (>41C). I worked outside all day and I am over 60 years old. I know that our world is facing extreme conditions due to human-caused climate change and I see the effects here locally even this summer as we are firmly in an extreme drought with no rain in the forecast for at least the next 10 days. Overall though I think humans are quite resilient and smart and that we will find a way to mitigate the damage that is already built in and to minimize consequences of further damage. I have to believe that as an organism, we will find a way to adapt to whatever we manage to create or destroy. I believe it is probably more accurate to frame the problem as one where vulnerable members of a population will be much closer to their endurance limits over the next few decades. The human race though will adapt. Vulnerable members could be defined as those who have medical issues or those who have spent large parts of their lives indoors where the range of temperatures that they normally see is very small. They have not hardened their constitutions to the actual physical conditions of temperature and humidity where they live and work because they shelter inside year round instead of going outside to take it all in. I think we can see examples globally of populations that have lived in what many of us in the developed world would consider extreme conditions with no hardships. They manage their limited resources to take fullest advantage of whatever meager resources their local environment provides. They will serve as a lesson to the rest of the world as to how to adapt as everything changes.
- kadoban 4y ago
  > I have to respectfully disagree that those conditions are near the limits of human endurance. My own experience working outside in all kinds of weather causes me to see that temperature/humidity combination as fairly mild (normal summer temps for June/July) and easily survivable since I personally have known many people of all ages who manage to go about their business with no ill effects in conditions more extreme than that here in Texas. Current conditions here today were 103F (>39C) with heat index due to humidity making it feel like 106F (>41C). I worked outside all day and I am over 60 years old. Humidity is a _large_ part of what makes it uncomfortable and dangerous, and you don't appear to be mentioning much about humidity here. Heat index is a function of both, but I don't know the formula (and +3 degrees F can't be very high humidity I don't think). I live in Phoenix, and it gets to be near 120 quite a few summer days. It's basically just annoying, as long as the humidity is low. When it gets high, it's _way_ past just annoying, and high humidity I think is more like 50% during those times, typically.
  - doodlebugging 4y ago
    Thanks for poking me about the humidity. I looked it up and the the humidity at the hottest part of the day (103F, 39C) was 23% so you are correct that it was relatively low. That is likely the reason that the heat index was only 106F (41C). Most mornings we start off around 70% humidity and 80*F (27C). The humidity drops as the sun rises higher until it is only about 30% during the hottest part of the day and then it begins rising again as the sun falls out of the sky. I live in N Texas but have been to Phoenix during July and found Flagstaff a lot more hospitable. I've lived and worked all over this state, most of the western US from the canyon country of the Four Corners area, to Oregon's mountains to Louisiana's swamps, and eastern Montana to Laredo. I spent all of my early years working outside from sunrise to sunset doing manual labor jobs before I went to college. I lived in high humidity in Houston for 10 years and, like USA Today's weather summary page described it one time, it was oppressive in summer. High humidity is a problem but humans live in extremely hot and humid areas and they live in extremely hot deserts and cold tundra as they have for thousands of years. It isn't that I'm not seeing the problem raised by the article, it is that I think that people who spend a lot of their time outside during the year will have fewer issues with high heat and humidity than those who spend most of their time indoors during the temperature extremes. We know that our environment will be hotter, that some places will be drier while others will be wetter, and so we should be trying to adapt ourselves to those conditions instead of fighting them. Use the skills that people who currently live in these environments employ to help us all adapt. In addition, we should focus our knowledge and skills on changing our own lifestyles and expectations so that we can make the changes necessary in our developed societies to bring these climate changes under control as swiftly as possible. Sorry if all this sound incoherent. I've been up all day and spent most of the day in the sun. Maybe I'm dehydrated and my brain is taking out the mental trash.

doodlebugging 4y ago

Thank you for your personal story. I had to do the math to discover that 34C is actually only 93F. I have to respectfully disagree that those conditions are near the limits of human endurance. My own experience working outside in all kinds of weather causes me to see that temperature/humidity combination as fairly mild (normal summer temps for June/July) and easily survivable since I personally have known many people of all ages who manage to go about their business with no ill effects in conditions more extreme than that here in Texas. Current conditions here today were 103F (>39C) with heat index due to humidity making it feel like 106F (>41C). I worked outside all day and I am over 60 years old. I know that our world is facing extreme conditions due to human-caused climate change and I see the effects here locally even this summer as we are firmly in an extreme drought with no rain in the forecast for at least the next 10 days. Overall though I think humans are quite resilient and smart and that we will find a way to mitigate the damage that is already built in and to minimize consequences of further damage. I have to believe that as an organism, we will find a way to adapt to whatever we manage to create or destroy. I believe it is probably more accurate to frame the problem as one where vulnerable members of a population will be much closer to their endurance limits over the next few decades. The human race though will adapt. Vulnerable members could be defined as those who have medical issues or those who have spent large parts of their lives indoors where the range of temperatures that they normally see is very small. They have not hardened their constitutions to the actual physical conditions of temperature and humidity where they live and work because they shelter inside year round instead of going outside to take it all in. I think we can see examples globally of populations that have lived in what many of us in the developed world would consider extreme conditions with no hardships. They manage their limited resources to take fullest advantage of whatever meager resources their local environment provides. They will serve as a lesson to the rest of the world as to how to adapt as everything changes.

kadoban 4y ago
> I have to respectfully disagree that those conditions are near the limits of human endurance. My own experience working outside in all kinds of weather causes me to see that temperature/humidity combination as fairly mild (normal summer temps for June/July) and easily survivable since I personally have known many people of all ages who manage to go about their business with no ill effects in conditions more extreme than that here in Texas. Current conditions here today were 103F (>39C) with heat index due to humidity making it feel like 106F (>41C). I worked outside all day and I am over 60 years old. Humidity is a _large_ part of what makes it uncomfortable and dangerous, and you don't appear to be mentioning much about humidity here. Heat index is a function of both, but I don't know the formula (and +3 degrees F can't be very high humidity I don't think). I live in Phoenix, and it gets to be near 120 quite a few summer days. It's basically just annoying, as long as the humidity is low. When it gets high, it's _way_ past just annoying, and high humidity I think is more like 50% during those times, typically.
- doodlebugging 4y ago
  Thanks for poking me about the humidity. I looked it up and the the humidity at the hottest part of the day (103F, 39C) was 23% so you are correct that it was relatively low. That is likely the reason that the heat index was only 106F (41C). Most mornings we start off around 70% humidity and 80*F (27C). The humidity drops as the sun rises higher until it is only about 30% during the hottest part of the day and then it begins rising again as the sun falls out of the sky. I live in N Texas but have been to Phoenix during July and found Flagstaff a lot more hospitable. I've lived and worked all over this state, most of the western US from the canyon country of the Four Corners area, to Oregon's mountains to Louisiana's swamps, and eastern Montana to Laredo. I spent all of my early years working outside from sunrise to sunset doing manual labor jobs before I went to college. I lived in high humidity in Houston for 10 years and, like USA Today's weather summary page described it one time, it was oppressive in summer. High humidity is a problem but humans live in extremely hot and humid areas and they live in extremely hot deserts and cold tundra as they have for thousands of years. It isn't that I'm not seeing the problem raised by the article, it is that I think that people who spend a lot of their time outside during the year will have fewer issues with high heat and humidity than those who spend most of their time indoors during the temperature extremes. We know that our environment will be hotter, that some places will be drier while others will be wetter, and so we should be trying to adapt ourselves to those conditions instead of fighting them. Use the skills that people who currently live in these environments employ to help us all adapt. In addition, we should focus our knowledge and skills on changing our own lifestyles and expectations so that we can make the changes necessary in our developed societies to bring these climate changes under control as swiftly as possible. Sorry if all this sound incoherent. I've been up all day and spent most of the day in the sun. Maybe I'm dehydrated and my brain is taking out the mental trash.