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This doesn't ban abortion, it leaves it up to the states. IMO that's the best since people simply aren't going to agree on it. EDIT: Abortion is not in the Con
by usrn 4y ago
This doesn't ban abortion, it leaves it up to the states. IMO that's the best since people simply aren't going to agree on it.
EDIT: Abortion is not in the Constitution in any way, it's not a right.
- erellsworth 4y agoNo, best would be to leave it up to the individual.
- usrn 4y agoWe don't do that with other state laws like murder and theft. And different states have different ideas on what those laws should look like too. EDIT: I'm not sure what you mean by that. Are you upset about SCOTUS citing common law tradition? Most of our law works that way, you have to build on something. Even "reason" needs axioms and you have to find a way to pick those. EDIT2: There are a surprising number of people who want to decriminalize theft and even murder in some situations (look up "mutual combat" in Chicago.)
- jablala 4y agoIt seems utterly ridiculous that you would rather go on precedent than case by case rational decision making.
- babelfish 4y agoAbortion is not murder or theft. An appropriate comparison would be an appendectomy. If states started banning appendectomies, I would hope the fed would codify it as law.
- jasonlfunk 4y agoThis is the very core of the disagreement. Pro-life people do not agree that it’s comparable to an appendectomy.
- sparrish 4y agoAnd that is where nearly 1/2 of America disagrees. Abortion is murder.
- showerst 4y ago27% of america agrees -- https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/2022/05/06/americas-abortion-quandary/ https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/2022/05/06/americas-abo...
- thatguy0900 4y agoAbortion not being murder is clearly an opinion a great deal of people disagree on. Kind of the crux of the issue.
- erellsworth 4y agoThat framing begs the question. Virtually everyone agrees murder and theft should be crimes. There is vast philosophical disagreement on whether abortion should be a crime. You can believe it is murder, but the majority of Americans disagree. Ultimately, it should be up to the pregnant person to weigh the morality of that decision, not the government.
- josephcsible 4y ago> Virtually everyone agrees [...] theft should be crimes Wasn't there just a thread here a few days ago that had a bunch of people arguing that the decriminalization of shoplifting in San Francisco is a good thing?
- typeofhuman 4y agoI don't know why you're being downvoted. What you're saying is exactly correct. That's what this ruling affirms: it is a state issue. Abortion is not in the US Constitution and many - even left-leaning - legal scholars have said Roe v Wade was ruled incorrectly.
- duped 4y agoI downvoted it because it's hopelessly naive and incorrect. This does not return the power to the states, it gives the power to the State to prevent people from having access to reproductive healthcare. Every American just had rights stripped away. The second that Republicans have a majority in Congress and the Presidency, they will pass a federal ban on abortion in all the states.
- nostrebored 4y agoAny such law would be unconstitutional? They may want to. I’m skeptical. But it’s unconstitutional.
- sundaeofshock 4y agoYou really think this court will care? Their current judicial philosophy can best be summed up as “because we can”
- duped 4y agoSCOTUS just ruled that no, laws that ban abortion aren't unconstitutional. There is already precedent and practice of the Federal government to regulate healthcare, the power to make specific crimes against children federal, or any number of various ways they could argue the Federal government has the power to ban abortion. The members of the Court that claim to be pick and choose which material they're originalist or textualist regarding, particularly in this case. Others are just idealogues nominated and confirmed to be political tools of the Republican party. You should not have faith in them, their credibility is shot.
- fatherzine 4y ago
- showerst 4y agoIt effectively bans safe abortion for poor people in red states.
- hossbeast 4y agoThe votes of the people living in those states do that
- tobylane 4y agoAnd perhaps states will outlaw them from travelling to blue states, and outlaws anyone assisting them. Missouri tried. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/may/03/us-abortions-travel-wave-of-restrictions https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/may/03/us-abortions-t...
- JacobThreeThree 4y agoBecause the state went through a democratic process and decided to do that. Democracy doesn't mean that everyone has to vote for the policies you like.
- ClumsyPilot 4y agoHow many dictators came to power through a democratic process? i think there was this really famous one in 1930's, what was his name...
- JacobThreeThree 4y agoAhh, so any democratic process that results in a policy you don't like is 1930's Germany. While any democratic process that results in a policy you do like is... ?
- ClumsyPilot 4y agoaah, so as long as something happened though a democratic process it's fine and dandy and no examination is needed as to the possible consequences of that decision?
- jl6 4y agoYes. As I understand it, Roe vs Wade argued that a right to abortion was implied by the constitution, and thus such a right was created implicitly, rather than by the explicit passing of legislation. The next step is clearly to advocate for explicit legislation.
- avs733 4y agoExactly how our constitution is supposed to work - your rights are left up to the states to accept or reject/s
- lkxijlewlf 4y agoUnless one is talking about CCW, then it's apparently a federal thing.
- JacobThreeThree 4y agoIf the states all got together and passed an abortion rights amendment, similar to the 2nd amendment, then it would be a federal thing.
- avs733 4y agoI mean… let’s not act like the 2nd amendment is interpreted in any serious way. The Supreme Court invented a personal right to bear arms from a 250 year old amendment during my lifetime and is now not only ignoring words that are in there but adding words that aren’t Anyone trying to apply logic to this is just facilitating nonsense because these decision are based in ideology not logic. Don’t launder it for them.
- voxl 4y agoExcept for all those constitutional rights... Freedom of religion being one, and their are at least two recognized religions where abortion is a religious right. So there you go, freedom for Christian's not for anyone else, a good Christian nation! /s
- avs733 4y agoYour free to be Christian or be ruled by their beliefs
- pastor_bob 4y agoPro Life groups said they're going after residents who go out of state next, then a national ban.
- _ph_ 4y agoDo get states to decide on slavery again too? I think such fundamental, health and freedom-related questions should be decided on a national level.
- JacobThreeThree 4y agoThen elect federal politicians who are advocating legislation to decide it on a national level. The current administration had a majority in both houses, knew this decision was coming, yet did nothing.
- _ph_ 4y agoNo it practically has not, the republicans would immediately filibuster any attempt. And they will keep doing so by locking in enough states which means that the majority of the American people can vote what they want, it wouldn't change a thing.
- InTheArena 4y agoThe Supreme court enforced slavery - and virtually ensured that the civil war would occur when it expanded slavery with Dredd Scott. (On the basis of something not in the constitution). The legislative made it illegal and changed the constitution. This opens the same path to legislatures. Hopefully without the civil war that occurred because the Supreme court played a role in preserving slavery. Does nobody read history anymore?
- monocasa 4y agoIt leaves it up to the states now because there is no meaningful federal code on the matter. The underpinnings of the decision allow for a federal ban since it's just saying that there's no inherent constitutional protection.