6 ms·

ah, the ad hominem, never a good sign for the proceeding argument. there are a number of other office suites that are entirely adequate for bureaucratic organi

ah, the ad hominem, never a good sign for the proceeding argument. there are a number of other office suites that are entirely adequate for bureaucratic organizations to build methodical processes around (which is what bureaucracies do). the capabilities of the underlying tools don’t matter much in this regard. also, audits aren’t meant to prove anything (like security), but instead to shift liability.

Jcowell 4y ago
> ah, the ad hominem, never a good sign for the proceeding argument. GP never says that you’re naive, but the comment was.
- clairity 4y ago
  either way (intent can also be multi-modal), it signals a triggered response and is entirely superfluous and distracting. it's worth setting that aside, even after writing it, and examining the emotional underpinnings that led to the response in the first place. we learn a lot about our own subconsciousness that way.
  - ska 4y ago
    >, ... it signals a triggered response This is, at best, a stretch.
  - simonswords82 4y ago
    I have no idea what it is you're trying to say but I did laugh that your username is clarity! :)
    - clairity 4y ago
      excellent, my diabolical plan to rule the world via dry humor is working as designed.
scarface74 4y ago
The average large organization uses over 100 SaaS products https://www.statista.com/statistics/1233538/average-number-saas-apps-yearly/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/1233538/average-number-s... I would love to see you replace all 100 of those with open source software. Have you ever dealt with large technology migrations?
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- clairity 4y ago
  not sure that it's relevant and 'large' is subjective, but yes, i stewarded the technology migration of a core product suite for a prior employer, which incidentally had government agencies as a prominent customer segment. i'm not suggesting that governments can only use internally developed or open-source software, i'm saying corporate interests should be firewalled away from goverment. so a locally-installed office suite incorporating no surveillance tech doesn't have the ancillary corporate interests attached to qualify it for being firewalled.
  - scarface74 4y ago
    You migrated a product. Were you involved in migrating the entire infrastructure of an entire state? Yes, I speak from experience, migrations and modernizations are kind of my job.
    - deleted 4y ago
      [deleted]
- quantum_magpie 4y ago
  And if no one does anything, in 5 years it will be a 1000, in 10 years 5000. As it is right now, the only voice governments hear is that of corpos, and corpos want to preserve the influence of corpos. That's why we need to force the ban on corpo influence. I'd rather pay 1% gdp for a one-time migration to open and free software than pay .01% gdp per corp per year.
mmanfrin 4y ago
> ah, the ad hominem, never a good sign for the proceeding argument. An ad hominem means using an insult as the basis for rejecting an argument, e.g. 'that is wrong because you are [attack]'. Saying an argument is naive and then explaining why is not an ad hominem.
- clairity 4y ago
  arguments can have multiple lines of reasoning, one of which can be an ad hominem all by itself.
  - lovich 4y ago
    A car has multiple parts, but it’s still difficult to use if you only use/look at each one separately
    - clairity 4y ago
      if you look carefully, the 3 sentences are disconnected. they don’t form a line of reasoning. if it had been starter, engine, and transmission, maybe you’d have a point, but instead it’s corroded battery, door handle, and tailpipe.
      - lovich 4y ago
        I looked at it carefully, and I’m not seeing what you’re seeing unfortunately. I interpreted the naive comment as a separate summary of their opinion, and then the rest of the paragraph was the supporting explanation. He didn’t dismiss the idea because it was naive, it’s the reason it is naive is why he was saying it wouldn’t work
      - jasonlotito 4y ago
        Ah, the ad hominem, never a good sign for the proceeding argument.
  - robertlagrant 4y ago
    None of it was ad hominem.

Jcowell 4y ago

> ah, the ad hominem, never a good sign for the proceeding argument. GP never says that you’re naive, but the comment was.

clairity 4y ago
either way (intent can also be multi-modal), it signals a triggered response and is entirely superfluous and distracting. it's worth setting that aside, even after writing it, and examining the emotional underpinnings that led to the response in the first place. we learn a lot about our own subconsciousness that way.
- ska 4y ago
  >, ... it signals a triggered response This is, at best, a stretch.
- simonswords82 4y ago
  I have no idea what it is you're trying to say but I did laugh that your username is clarity! :)
  - clairity 4y ago
    excellent, my diabolical plan to rule the world via dry humor is working as designed.

scarface74 4y ago

The average large organization uses over 100 SaaS products https://www.statista.com/statistics/1233538/average-number-saas-apps-yearly/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/1233538/average-number-s... I would love to see you replace all 100 of those with open source software. Have you ever dealt with large technology migrations?

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
clairity 4y ago
not sure that it's relevant and 'large' is subjective, but yes, i stewarded the technology migration of a core product suite for a prior employer, which incidentally had government agencies as a prominent customer segment. i'm not suggesting that governments can only use internally developed or open-source software, i'm saying corporate interests should be firewalled away from goverment. so a locally-installed office suite incorporating no surveillance tech doesn't have the ancillary corporate interests attached to qualify it for being firewalled.
- scarface74 4y ago
  You migrated a product. Were you involved in migrating the entire infrastructure of an entire state? Yes, I speak from experience, migrations and modernizations are kind of my job.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
quantum_magpie 4y ago
And if no one does anything, in 5 years it will be a 1000, in 10 years 5000. As it is right now, the only voice governments hear is that of corpos, and corpos want to preserve the influence of corpos. That's why we need to force the ban on corpo influence. I'd rather pay 1% gdp for a one-time migration to open and free software than pay .01% gdp per corp per year.

mmanfrin 4y ago

> ah, the ad hominem, never a good sign for the proceeding argument. An ad hominem means using an insult as the basis for rejecting an argument, e.g. 'that is wrong because you are [attack]'. Saying an argument is naive and then explaining why is not an ad hominem.

clairity 4y ago
arguments can have multiple lines of reasoning, one of which can be an ad hominem all by itself.
- lovich 4y ago
  A car has multiple parts, but it’s still difficult to use if you only use/look at each one separately
  - clairity 4y ago
    if you look carefully, the 3 sentences are disconnected. they don’t form a line of reasoning. if it had been starter, engine, and transmission, maybe you’d have a point, but instead it’s corroded battery, door handle, and tailpipe.
    - lovich 4y ago
      I looked at it carefully, and I’m not seeing what you’re seeing unfortunately. I interpreted the naive comment as a separate summary of their opinion, and then the rest of the paragraph was the supporting explanation. He didn’t dismiss the idea because it was naive, it’s the reason it is naive is why he was saying it wouldn’t work
    - jasonlotito 4y ago
      Ah, the ad hominem, never a good sign for the proceeding argument.
- robertlagrant 4y ago
  None of it was ad hominem.