4 ms·

Going back to the office would be more palatable if employers hadn’t spent the past 15 years turning them into open-concept hellscapes full of distractions that

by orev 4y ago

Going back to the office would be more palatable if employers hadn’t spent the past 15 years turning them into open-concept hellscapes full of distractions that benefit only the extroverted political operators and actively causes problems for the people actually doing the work (always with an implied “whaddaya gonna do about it? I’m the boss here”). If the battle to remain WFH will be ultimately lost (which I think it will), we can at least get back private offices, or at least smaller rooms for teams.

tazjin 4y ago
> that benefit only the extroverted political operators and actively causes problems for the people actually doing the work "only people like me contribute! the others do nothing!" - tired argument. Anyways, I'm starting to think that skirting any lines here for a company doesn't really help. They should make a call and (mostly) stick to it, then let people figure out what environment they want to be in (and change jobs accordingly).
- orev 4y ago
  > "only people like me contribute! the others do nothing!" - tired argument. I agree, when taken to extremes. However the amount of time spent vs actually useful work produced by people jabbering on for an hour in a meeting is far less than what someone truly focused can achieve, most of the time.
  - tazjin 4y ago
    People can (and do!) jabber on in virtual meetings, too. It's only a vaguely related topic.
gnicholas 4y ago
Totally agree. I only ever worked in an office as an attorney at a large law firm. Even summer associates had their own offices. I have no idea how lawyers at tech companies are able to get their work done, with the need to have confidential calls (related to HR, securities laws, and other legally-protected matters).
- ics 4y ago
  IME legal is always on a separate floor with much less open offices. Eerily quiet like the executive floors.
- giaour 4y ago
  Lawyers without offices would have to book a conference room for anything requiring confidentiality. If they do this 8 hours a day, they essentially have a (larger and more expensive) private office without any place to store files or books.
- jedberg 4y ago
  Pretty much every company I've seen, even the ones with the "not even the CEO has an office" ethos, still have offices for the lawyers and HR. Basically they spend so much time having confidential conversations that it was cheaper to give them an office than have them always in a conference room.
queuebert 4y ago
I wish there was a word for hearing someone express a thought that so perfectly captures something you feel but had not yet realized you felt.
minsc_and_boo 4y ago
I dunno. I've been unlucky enough to have worked in a brown carpeted cube farm, and I'd take open offices over that any day. I've also worked at a specific EMR company that used to advertise, "Everyone gets an office" but they were piling us up two-three per individual office anyways, which also just made the building a cold dark maze of corridors and doors. Really, WFH is superior in all regards for jobs/roles that can do it.
helij 4y ago
It's the end of office. Prices of transport (both public and private) are going up and it's either work from home and pay rise due to rising cost of living or get into the office but 50% pay rise. Our household income is in top 5% in the UK and we are already seeing our monthly budget for extra activities and savings way down. Not sure what will be left if we spend extra £800 (that's how much the train and tube + Greggs sandwich cost for two people if you go in 20 times/month)
gffrd 4y ago
One of the biggest revelations of the pandemic: how effective I am when I work in an environment of my choosing. I know, I know … so much has been written about this. I'm 36, and every office I've worked in has been open, so that was my baseline. But I had zero idea how much more effective, stimulated, inspired I could be until I got full control of my space ant time: I've grown, done, learned more in the past 2 years than many before. I've found an entirely new gear or two. I guess this is what people mourned when doors with offices went away … Yes, some of this may be the shock & euphoria of drastic change; some of it is obviously personal makeup/psychology. As you said, if where we land is "a good chunk of companies are OK with people working wherever/however, and another good chunk that aren't at least create environments for people who thrive differently," I'm happy with that. Of course, there will also be the "chunk who aren't OK with that, and still demand no walls or door" … more power to 'em, just not for me.

by orev 4y ago

tazjin 4y ago

> that benefit only the extroverted political operators and actively causes problems for the people actually doing the work "only people like me contribute! the others do nothing!" - tired argument. Anyways, I'm starting to think that skirting any lines here for a company doesn't really help. They should make a call and (mostly) stick to it, then let people figure out what environment they want to be in (and change jobs accordingly).

orev 4y ago
> "only people like me contribute! the others do nothing!" - tired argument. I agree, when taken to extremes. However the amount of time spent vs actually useful work produced by people jabbering on for an hour in a meeting is far less than what someone truly focused can achieve, most of the time.
- tazjin 4y ago
  People can (and do!) jabber on in virtual meetings, too. It's only a vaguely related topic.

gnicholas 4y ago

Totally agree. I only ever worked in an office as an attorney at a large law firm. Even summer associates had their own offices. I have no idea how lawyers at tech companies are able to get their work done, with the need to have confidential calls (related to HR, securities laws, and other legally-protected matters).

ics 4y ago
IME legal is always on a separate floor with much less open offices. Eerily quiet like the executive floors.
giaour 4y ago
Lawyers without offices would have to book a conference room for anything requiring confidentiality. If they do this 8 hours a day, they essentially have a (larger and more expensive) private office without any place to store files or books.
jedberg 4y ago
Pretty much every company I've seen, even the ones with the "not even the CEO has an office" ethos, still have offices for the lawyers and HR. Basically they spend so much time having confidential conversations that it was cheaper to give them an office than have them always in a conference room.

queuebert 4y ago

I wish there was a word for hearing someone express a thought that so perfectly captures something you feel but had not yet realized you felt.

minsc_and_boo 4y ago

I dunno. I've been unlucky enough to have worked in a brown carpeted cube farm, and I'd take open offices over that any day. I've also worked at a specific EMR company that used to advertise, "Everyone gets an office" but they were piling us up two-three per individual office anyways, which also just made the building a cold dark maze of corridors and doors. Really, WFH is superior in all regards for jobs/roles that can do it.

helij 4y ago

It's the end of office. Prices of transport (both public and private) are going up and it's either work from home and pay rise due to rising cost of living or get into the office but 50% pay rise. Our household income is in top 5% in the UK and we are already seeing our monthly budget for extra activities and savings way down. Not sure what will be left if we spend extra £800 (that's how much the train and tube + Greggs sandwich cost for two people if you go in 20 times/month)

gffrd 4y ago

One of the biggest revelations of the pandemic: how effective I am when I work in an environment of my choosing. I know, I know … so much has been written about this. I'm 36, and every office I've worked in has been open, so that was my baseline. But I had zero idea how much more effective, stimulated, inspired I could be until I got full control of my space ant time: I've grown, done, learned more in the past 2 years than many before. I've found an entirely new gear or two. I guess this is what people mourned when doors with offices went away … Yes, some of this may be the shock & euphoria of drastic change; some of it is obviously personal makeup/psychology. As you said, if where we land is "a good chunk of companies are OK with people working wherever/however, and another good chunk that aren't at least create environments for people who thrive differently," I'm happy with that. Of course, there will also be the "chunk who aren't OK with that, and still demand no walls or door" … more power to 'em, just not for me.