3 ms·

“Cloud isn't an entry-level job”

anovikov 4y ago
There is an absurdly easy explanation to that. Junior level jobs are outsourced to Indian bodyshops, where they are done better because they are done by people who are "forever juniors", who will never grow and know it and OK with it (because even a junior wage provides excellent living standard in their country). Something junior level is by definition replaceable and non-critical. If a junior does something that can break production or impossible to replicate or keep running if they leave, company is doing something very wrong. But this is also a perfect role for an outsourcer. I think this is a healthy division of labor: outsource junior work, keep seniors in the office.
- wesapien 4y ago
  Healthy lol Seniors are gonna die too. What makes this era of senior experienced workers different? Why not pay it forward?
- wmf 4y ago
  That gives young people in the developed world no way to break into the industry. Is that healthy?
  - anovikov 4y ago
    Why not? Do open source, get github stars and get noticed and start working in the industry from mid-level or senior roles straight. This is something Indians will never do just because they never work alone - i think cultural issue, they need to be employed full time - for caste reasons (?) - so they work for body shops.
    - wmf 4y ago
      Needing a job isn't a "cultural issue"; people need money to live. Very few people can work for free to get started.
      - anovikov 4y ago
        This is the case only in developed countries. Idk how about India (never been there), just as in vast majority of the world, full time job is optional. Even in many places of comparatively 'civilised' Eastern Europe (even in poorest corners of EU such as rural Bulgaria or poorest parts of Northwest Romania, which are both light years ahead of India in economic development), as absurdly as it sounds, working on a full time job is a sign of poverty and lack of life skills. I mean, a full time job means getting an average salary or so which is not sufficient for survival (i know people are surprised reading about $400 wages in countries where Numbeo shows living costs being 2/3 of U.S., like how are they surviving, answer is - they don't, they live off something else). Vast majority of people there, just hustle. Which is basically nothing but freelancing. Idea of freelancing without depending on a secure permanent job is 100% acceptable in poor countries simply due to lack of alternatives - liveable wages are a rare exception there so people are much less locked into the idea of "job slavery" than they are in the rich countries.
- ID1452319 4y ago
  Where do you get your seniors from in 5-10 years time, if you've outsourced all your entry level roles?
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]

There is an absurdly easy explanation to that. Junior level jobs are outsourced to Indian bodyshops, where they are done better because they are done by people who are "forever juniors", who will never grow and know it and OK with it (because even a junior wage provides excellent living standard in their country). Something junior level is by definition replaceable and non-critical. If a junior does something that can break production or impossible to replicate or keep running if they leave, company is doing something very wrong. But this is also a perfect role for an outsourcer. I think this is a healthy division of labor: outsource junior work, keep seniors in the office.

wesapien 4y ago
Healthy lol Seniors are gonna die too. What makes this era of senior experienced workers different? Why not pay it forward?
wmf 4y ago
That gives young people in the developed world no way to break into the industry. Is that healthy?
- anovikov 4y ago
  Why not? Do open source, get github stars and get noticed and start working in the industry from mid-level or senior roles straight. This is something Indians will never do just because they never work alone - i think cultural issue, they need to be employed full time - for caste reasons (?) - so they work for body shops.
  - wmf 4y ago
    Needing a job isn't a "cultural issue"; people need money to live. Very few people can work for free to get started.
    - anovikov 4y ago
      This is the case only in developed countries. Idk how about India (never been there), just as in vast majority of the world, full time job is optional. Even in many places of comparatively 'civilised' Eastern Europe (even in poorest corners of EU such as rural Bulgaria or poorest parts of Northwest Romania, which are both light years ahead of India in economic development), as absurdly as it sounds, working on a full time job is a sign of poverty and lack of life skills. I mean, a full time job means getting an average salary or so which is not sufficient for survival (i know people are surprised reading about $400 wages in countries where Numbeo shows living costs being 2/3 of U.S., like how are they surviving, answer is - they don't, they live off something else). Vast majority of people there, just hustle. Which is basically nothing but freelancing. Idea of freelancing without depending on a secure permanent job is 100% acceptable in poor countries simply due to lack of alternatives - liveable wages are a rare exception there so people are much less locked into the idea of "job slavery" than they are in the rich countries.
ID1452319 4y ago
Where do you get your seniors from in 5-10 years time, if you've outsourced all your entry level roles?

deleted 4y ago

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