5 ms·

Generally better ones with better demographic distribution too. But the NFT as a ticket thing is valid, even if I would not attend such a rave myself.

School-Cotton 4y ago
> But the NFT as a ticket thing is valid No it isn’t. That’s exactly my point. There is no real problem being solved here, because clearly, events (even illegal ones!) that required tickets for admission have worked fine for ages without NFTs. This is the problem with most proposed blockchain applications: they have no mechanism to compel behavior in the physical world. Someone controls access to this rave; at the end of the day, the only reason that they accept blockchain tokens instead of entries in a centralized database is because they’ve decided to arbitrarily. You could totally feasibly create a private club whose members you track yourself in a spreadsheet (allowing them to sell their membership to other people, or not, as you prefer). Someone else, or more likely yourself, could then decide to give your members access to private parties, and everything would work the same way. The only thing NFTs give you is irrevocability of the initially stated membership rules: with my example of a private club tracked in a spreadsheet, you could choose to change the rules at any time (say, charging a fee for anyone who wants to transfer ownership). You couldn’t for NFTs. But this advantage of NFTs is somewhat illusory because, again, whoever controls access to benefits in the physical world can themselves change the rules at any time, and so you haven’t really changed the number of parties you have to trust. Whatever organization is running these raves might decide tomorrow that you need a Super Duper Bored Ape that costs extra or has different transferability characteristics, and you’re back where you started.
- randomhodler84 4y ago
  You are missing some of the functionality you say you can’t do. You can. You missing permanence and open marketplaces aspects of it. I don’t own or think BAYC is a great thing, but as a membership token to some club it’s as good as a Costco card. and then someone did raves for Costco members.
  - danaris 4y ago
    If someone wanted to make a "Rave Club" and sell lifetime memberships, they'd be trivially able to do so without involving a blockchain of any kind.
    - randomhodler84 4y ago
      In such a way that records would be preserved past the dissolving of the original issuer? In a way that doesn’t touch the existing financial system? In a way that permits trust less exchange of memberships? Of course anything can be done without a blockchain, but it has trade offs. Not understanding the trade offs will drive you towards centralized solutions.
      - danaris 4y ago
        Why would Rave Club care if the Rave Club membership data doesn't survive past the dissolution of Rave Club? This seems very much like the argument that, say, Blizzard would build support for NFT-based items into WoW so that people could buy NFTs outside of WoW and transfer them into the game (or buy them inside of WoW and still be able to use them elsewhere even if they quit playing WoW). Sure, it might have some value for the customers, but there's negative incentive for the actual companies to do it.
      - nradov 4y ago
        Everyone here understands the trade offs. There is zero benefit to a blockchain for this use case.

School-Cotton 4y ago

> But the NFT as a ticket thing is valid No it isn’t. That’s exactly my point. There is no real problem being solved here, because clearly, events (even illegal ones!) that required tickets for admission have worked fine for ages without NFTs. This is the problem with most proposed blockchain applications: they have no mechanism to compel behavior in the physical world. Someone controls access to this rave; at the end of the day, the only reason that they accept blockchain tokens instead of entries in a centralized database is because they’ve decided to arbitrarily. You could totally feasibly create a private club whose members you track yourself in a spreadsheet (allowing them to sell their membership to other people, or not, as you prefer). Someone else, or more likely yourself, could then decide to give your members access to private parties, and everything would work the same way. The only thing NFTs give you is irrevocability of the initially stated membership rules: with my example of a private club tracked in a spreadsheet, you could choose to change the rules at any time (say, charging a fee for anyone who wants to transfer ownership). You couldn’t for NFTs. But this advantage of NFTs is somewhat illusory because, again, whoever controls access to benefits in the physical world can themselves change the rules at any time, and so you haven’t really changed the number of parties you have to trust. Whatever organization is running these raves might decide tomorrow that you need a Super Duper Bored Ape that costs extra or has different transferability characteristics, and you’re back where you started.

randomhodler84 4y ago
You are missing some of the functionality you say you can’t do. You can. You missing permanence and open marketplaces aspects of it. I don’t own or think BAYC is a great thing, but as a membership token to some club it’s as good as a Costco card. and then someone did raves for Costco members.
- danaris 4y ago
  If someone wanted to make a "Rave Club" and sell lifetime memberships, they'd be trivially able to do so without involving a blockchain of any kind.
  - randomhodler84 4y ago
    In such a way that records would be preserved past the dissolving of the original issuer? In a way that doesn’t touch the existing financial system? In a way that permits trust less exchange of memberships? Of course anything can be done without a blockchain, but it has trade offs. Not understanding the trade offs will drive you towards centralized solutions.
    - danaris 4y ago
      Why would Rave Club care if the Rave Club membership data doesn't survive past the dissolution of Rave Club? This seems very much like the argument that, say, Blizzard would build support for NFT-based items into WoW so that people could buy NFTs outside of WoW and transfer them into the game (or buy them inside of WoW and still be able to use them elsewhere even if they quit playing WoW). Sure, it might have some value for the customers, but there's negative incentive for the actual companies to do it.
    - nradov 4y ago
      Everyone here understands the trade offs. There is zero benefit to a blockchain for this use case.