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There is a reason that for hundreds of years painters and (later) photographers have preferred working in spaces with North-facing windows[0], and that is becau

There is a reason that for hundreds of years painters and (later) photographers have preferred working in spaces with North-facing windows[0], and that is because it's a simple way of ensuring neutral, even light. My home office is (by design) in a room with one North-facing window. I use a Logitech C920. Many people have told me how good my webcam feed is. I don't think it's that the C920 is particularly brilliant, it's that if you know even a little about photography, you can do an awful lot to help ensure a good picture. [0] assuming they were in the Northern Hemisphere, of course

jjeaff 4y ago
Or, just turning on any bright lights will do wonders. Most people have very dim lighting.
- logifail 4y ago
  > just turning on any bright lights Umm, it really depends where those lights are relative to the camera. None of us look our best when light brightly from directly overhead, or from one side, or - if you're really after that Dracula look - from directly underneath. The sun is a unique (free!) light source, particularly if you're able to get access through a North-facing window. It's quite costly (time and money) to get anywhere close to replicating that effect using artificial lighting.
  - ec109685 4y ago
    I know what you’re getting at, but for people who can’t rearrange their house, good lighting is definitely cheaper than a north facing window :)
    - oittaa 4y ago
      Exactly. I put couple of Ikea Torsbo(? or something similar, can't remember the exact model) next to my monitor and they provide nice soft light to the face, which amazes some people. Literally spending 20€ on some cheap tabletop lamps would improve the quality dramatically for most of the people. I don't even have any fancy cameras, just a Logitech Streamcam I bought from some discount sale.
      - citruscomputing 4y ago
        Tokabo? https://www.ikea.com/us/en/p/tokabo-table-lamp-with-led-bulb-glass-opal-10358013/ https://www.ikea.com/us/en/p/tokabo-table-lamp-with-led-bulb...
  - ruined 4y ago
    if you don't have a window, you have a wall. do you have a desk lamp? point it at your wall. instant softbox
Forgeties79 4y ago
It blows people’s minds how much a few good practice suggestions change their image. I come from a film background and get requests for help by colleagues and friends constantly. I almost always just reposition their camera and move a lamp nearby to use as a key if they have no window, or as a kicker if they do. It’s really easy to teach yourself this stuff, it’s not magic. Most people just assume their gear is either too cheap or they’re too ignorant to get it. 5-10min of research and 5-10min of implementation will do wonders for most people.
- moralestapia 4y ago
  Care to share some quick tips?
  - Forgeties79 4y ago
    Sure! 1) Avoid fluorescent lighting like the plague. You’ll look sickly. 2) Find a nice warm (tungsten/more orange) lamp if your lighting is inadequate. It can be small it doesn’t matter. Place it diagonally from you at eye level. 3) Camera at eye level. 4) If you want to get fancy, get another lamp higher above you (several feet) and place it opposite your main lamp for a backlight. So if your main light is front right, this one is back left. It needs to be weaker than your main light source. This is called an “edge” or a backlight. It gives your hair a soft glow up top that separates you from the background.
    - spookthesunset 4y ago
      Camera at eye level is very hard when your giant monitor is at eye level. I almost wish there was some way to make monitors act like teleprompters.
      - Forgeties79 4y ago
        Yeah that’s always a factor. If you can’t you can’t, simple as that. It just helps make you look less distracted as well as makes you “more flattering.” Definitely don’t have it angled up if you can avoid it or you look patronizing.
shados 4y ago
Also the vast majority of people using these web cams don't have nearly enough lighting. When there isn't enough, the software cranks up the ISO to ridiculous level which gives that distinctive "webcam grain" look thats awful.
- m463 4y ago
  Phone cameras seem to be extremely sensitive - even an old iphone 8 camera can see well in near-dark conditions. Don't see why webcams can't do this.
- dx034 4y ago
  And working under insufficient light conditions is also likely worse for your eyes. So people would do themselves a favor working in brighter environments and also wouldn't have to worry as much from their webcam setup. For me, in bright and evenly lit rooms (so no sunshine but artificial light), most dedicated webcams tend to produce pretty good images.
  - shados 4y ago
    But I'm a l33t haxxor working in the dark because I'm edgy!
hwbehrens 4y ago
> I don't think it's that the C920 is particularly brilliant I used to sit in a cubicle under fluorescent lights, and I often received compliments on my webcam quality when I used a C920e, which I think has the same quality as the C920. Don't underestimate absolutely horrendous laptop webcams becoming normalized, especially after stream compression.
robonerd 4y ago
I prefer to sit with my back facing a southern window. Washing out my webcam is my little petty protest against the use of video chat.
- Fnoord 4y ago
  I mean, if I was working from home and if I were to have to use such I'd need to use one of my kid's rooms.
jrk 4y ago
Lighting and composition can do a lot to compensate for a weak camera, but read the post: this isn’t saying “Zoom video looks bad [potentially because of bad lighting and composition],” it’s saying “even high-end webcams are enormously worse than even old, low-end/front-facing cell phone cameras in the same conditions, and it’s not getting better.” So yes, all things being equal, better lighting helps. But this post is showing that a better (but similarly sized or even smaller) camera helps enormously, and the webcam market is persistently unwilling/unable to give them to us.
- logifail 4y ago
  > So yes, all things being equal, better lighting helps $63 on a C920, add one window (typically ships free with your house/apartment) plus access to one truly special light source which although it's 93 million miles away you were lucky enough to get a free lifetime subscription to when you arrived on this planet. Why spent time worrying about what a cell phone camera can achieve in poor or uneven lighting if a bog-standard webcam can do a really good job if you just fix the damned lighting?
  - joe-collins 4y ago
    My current apartment has no south windows. The previous unit had none east. Before that, no north. Before that, no south or north windows. "Just" fixing some problems can be a luxury.
    - logifail 4y ago
      > "Just" fixing some problems can be a luxury It really needn't be. (Proper) photographers have been dealing with these very same issues for longer than we've all been worrying about how we look on Zoom. Window Light: The Biggest, Bestest Softbox You Already Own: "Let’s say your windows are west-facing and you want to shoot in the afternoon. And you’re really terrified of hard light. Keep thinking of your window as a softbox. You just need what they refer to in film production as a “silk”. The same material (ripstop nylon) that is found on the front of most softboxes can be placed in front of your window to turn hard, late day light into a glowing, golden, majestic light bath for your subject’s face."[0] [0] https://fstoppers.com/education/window-light-biggest-bestest-softbox-you-already-own-143498 https://fstoppers.com/education/window-light-biggest-bestest...
jotm 4y ago
Indeed, if people cared enough, they'd be able to get amazing results out of any hardware. I also have a window that faces North, I use the rule of thirds to better place myself in front of the camera, I only do video calls during the day, and I have a cat that can distract people at key moments. People always say my video looks brilliant. I only use my Panasonic X2000 as a webcam.
BugsJustFindMe 4y ago
> I use a Logitech C920. Many people have told me how good my webcam feed is. What's your secret for overcoming the C920's shitty color reproduction where the auto white balance makes everything extremely blue? I hate mine and am thinking about returning it as defective.
- nickjj 4y ago
  > What's your secret for overcoming the C920's shitty color reproduction where the auto white balance makes everything extremely blue? You can disable all automatic settings and then you can manually configure things however you want based on your environment. The only issue is every time you reboot it tends to get reset.
  - BugsJustFindMe 4y ago
    Not only do the manual settings get unset constantly, but also they need to be adjusted throughout the day. :(
wwilim 4y ago
My home office faces north and I do look alright on a webcam (T470 and now some kind of Thinkbook equivalent), but the dim light all day gives me SAD. I'm on the lookout for a few 4k lumen LED panels
modeless 4y ago
However, using a better camera is easier than remodeling your house.
altcognito 4y ago
Also, my experience with the 920 Is that it performs well (better than others I have) in low light. None of the samples from the article were low light. Most folks are in dimly lit conditions, and that’s where these tend to do better. Fundamentally, webcams suffer from the same problem as n95 masks: prior to the pandemic, everything was geared towards cheap, it just wasn’t a huge market. To invest in retooling would be a risk, there is no guarantee the market will be there. People are throwing a thousand dollars at phones with a significantly better profit margin. Webcams will NEVER catch up. He pretty much says this at the end of the article.
- nine_k 4y ago
  Taking an inexpensive used photo camera (of the regular mirrorless handheld type) and attaching it to your computer for video conferencing could be the most affordable solution.
_def 4y ago
With a North facing window, where does the camera sit to get the desired result? Asking because I have north facing windows only and I'm wondering if I could facilitate them better

jjeaff 4y ago

Or, just turning on any bright lights will do wonders. Most people have very dim lighting.

logifail 4y ago
> just turning on any bright lights Umm, it really depends where those lights are relative to the camera. None of us look our best when light brightly from directly overhead, or from one side, or - if you're really after that Dracula look - from directly underneath. The sun is a unique (free!) light source, particularly if you're able to get access through a North-facing window. It's quite costly (time and money) to get anywhere close to replicating that effect using artificial lighting.
- ec109685 4y ago
  I know what you’re getting at, but for people who can’t rearrange their house, good lighting is definitely cheaper than a north facing window :)
  - oittaa 4y ago
    Exactly. I put couple of Ikea Torsbo(? or something similar, can't remember the exact model) next to my monitor and they provide nice soft light to the face, which amazes some people. Literally spending 20€ on some cheap tabletop lamps would improve the quality dramatically for most of the people. I don't even have any fancy cameras, just a Logitech Streamcam I bought from some discount sale.
    - citruscomputing 4y ago
      Tokabo? https://www.ikea.com/us/en/p/tokabo-table-lamp-with-led-bulb-glass-opal-10358013/ https://www.ikea.com/us/en/p/tokabo-table-lamp-with-led-bulb...
- ruined 4y ago
  if you don't have a window, you have a wall. do you have a desk lamp? point it at your wall. instant softbox

Forgeties79 4y ago

It blows people’s minds how much a few good practice suggestions change their image. I come from a film background and get requests for help by colleagues and friends constantly. I almost always just reposition their camera and move a lamp nearby to use as a key if they have no window, or as a kicker if they do. It’s really easy to teach yourself this stuff, it’s not magic. Most people just assume their gear is either too cheap or they’re too ignorant to get it. 5-10min of research and 5-10min of implementation will do wonders for most people.

moralestapia 4y ago
Care to share some quick tips?
- Forgeties79 4y ago
  Sure! 1) Avoid fluorescent lighting like the plague. You’ll look sickly. 2) Find a nice warm (tungsten/more orange) lamp if your lighting is inadequate. It can be small it doesn’t matter. Place it diagonally from you at eye level. 3) Camera at eye level. 4) If you want to get fancy, get another lamp higher above you (several feet) and place it opposite your main lamp for a backlight. So if your main light is front right, this one is back left. It needs to be weaker than your main light source. This is called an “edge” or a backlight. It gives your hair a soft glow up top that separates you from the background.
  - spookthesunset 4y ago
    Camera at eye level is very hard when your giant monitor is at eye level. I almost wish there was some way to make monitors act like teleprompters.
    - Forgeties79 4y ago
      Yeah that’s always a factor. If you can’t you can’t, simple as that. It just helps make you look less distracted as well as makes you “more flattering.” Definitely don’t have it angled up if you can avoid it or you look patronizing.

shados 4y ago

Also the vast majority of people using these web cams don't have nearly enough lighting. When there isn't enough, the software cranks up the ISO to ridiculous level which gives that distinctive "webcam grain" look thats awful.

m463 4y ago
Phone cameras seem to be extremely sensitive - even an old iphone 8 camera can see well in near-dark conditions. Don't see why webcams can't do this.
dx034 4y ago
And working under insufficient light conditions is also likely worse for your eyes. So people would do themselves a favor working in brighter environments and also wouldn't have to worry as much from their webcam setup. For me, in bright and evenly lit rooms (so no sunshine but artificial light), most dedicated webcams tend to produce pretty good images.
- shados 4y ago
  But I'm a l33t haxxor working in the dark because I'm edgy!

hwbehrens 4y ago

> I don't think it's that the C920 is particularly brilliant I used to sit in a cubicle under fluorescent lights, and I often received compliments on my webcam quality when I used a C920e, which I think has the same quality as the C920. Don't underestimate absolutely horrendous laptop webcams becoming normalized, especially after stream compression.

robonerd 4y ago

I prefer to sit with my back facing a southern window. Washing out my webcam is my little petty protest against the use of video chat.

Fnoord 4y ago
I mean, if I was working from home and if I were to have to use such I'd need to use one of my kid's rooms.

jrk 4y ago

Lighting and composition can do a lot to compensate for a weak camera, but read the post: this isn’t saying “Zoom video looks bad [potentially because of bad lighting and composition],” it’s saying “even high-end webcams are enormously worse than even old, low-end/front-facing cell phone cameras in the same conditions, and it’s not getting better.” So yes, all things being equal, better lighting helps. But this post is showing that a better (but similarly sized or even smaller) camera helps enormously, and the webcam market is persistently unwilling/unable to give them to us.

logifail 4y ago
> So yes, all things being equal, better lighting helps $63 on a C920, add one window (typically ships free with your house/apartment) plus access to one truly special light source which although it's 93 million miles away you were lucky enough to get a free lifetime subscription to when you arrived on this planet. Why spent time worrying about what a cell phone camera can achieve in poor or uneven lighting if a bog-standard webcam can do a really good job if you just fix the damned lighting?
- joe-collins 4y ago
  My current apartment has no south windows. The previous unit had none east. Before that, no north. Before that, no south or north windows. "Just" fixing some problems can be a luxury.
  - logifail 4y ago
    > "Just" fixing some problems can be a luxury It really needn't be. (Proper) photographers have been dealing with these very same issues for longer than we've all been worrying about how we look on Zoom. Window Light: The Biggest, Bestest Softbox You Already Own: "Let’s say your windows are west-facing and you want to shoot in the afternoon. And you’re really terrified of hard light. Keep thinking of your window as a softbox. You just need what they refer to in film production as a “silk”. The same material (ripstop nylon) that is found on the front of most softboxes can be placed in front of your window to turn hard, late day light into a glowing, golden, majestic light bath for your subject’s face."[0] [0] https://fstoppers.com/education/window-light-biggest-bestest-softbox-you-already-own-143498 https://fstoppers.com/education/window-light-biggest-bestest...

jotm 4y ago

Indeed, if people cared enough, they'd be able to get amazing results out of any hardware. I also have a window that faces North, I use the rule of thirds to better place myself in front of the camera, I only do video calls during the day, and I have a cat that can distract people at key moments. People always say my video looks brilliant. I only use my Panasonic X2000 as a webcam.

BugsJustFindMe 4y ago

> I use a Logitech C920. Many people have told me how good my webcam feed is. What's your secret for overcoming the C920's shitty color reproduction where the auto white balance makes everything extremely blue? I hate mine and am thinking about returning it as defective.

nickjj 4y ago
> What's your secret for overcoming the C920's shitty color reproduction where the auto white balance makes everything extremely blue? You can disable all automatic settings and then you can manually configure things however you want based on your environment. The only issue is every time you reboot it tends to get reset.
- BugsJustFindMe 4y ago
  Not only do the manual settings get unset constantly, but also they need to be adjusted throughout the day. :(

wwilim 4y ago

My home office faces north and I do look alright on a webcam (T470 and now some kind of Thinkbook equivalent), but the dim light all day gives me SAD. I'm on the lookout for a few 4k lumen LED panels

modeless 4y ago

However, using a better camera is easier than remodeling your house.

altcognito 4y ago

Also, my experience with the 920 Is that it performs well (better than others I have) in low light. None of the samples from the article were low light. Most folks are in dimly lit conditions, and that’s where these tend to do better. Fundamentally, webcams suffer from the same problem as n95 masks: prior to the pandemic, everything was geared towards cheap, it just wasn’t a huge market. To invest in retooling would be a risk, there is no guarantee the market will be there. People are throwing a thousand dollars at phones with a significantly better profit margin. Webcams will NEVER catch up. He pretty much says this at the end of the article.

nine_k 4y ago
Taking an inexpensive used photo camera (of the regular mirrorless handheld type) and attaching it to your computer for video conferencing could be the most affordable solution.

_def 4y ago

With a North facing window, where does the camera sit to get the desired result? Asking because I have north facing windows only and I'm wondering if I could facilitate them better