11 ms·

Early Access to Chrome OS Flex: The Upgrade PCs and Macs

127 points by type0 4y ago

leejoramo 4y ago
Love how Google is advocating this for cost savings and sustainability. If only my School District could use Chrome OS Flex to get some more life out of the fleet 4 year old Chromebook's that can no longer get updates
- wmf 4y ago
  Replacing an EOL version of Chrome OS with a different version of Chrome OS makes no sense.
  - robertlagrant 4y ago
    Whoosh.
  - rufugee 4y ago
    I think their point is that Google is forcing perfectly good hardware into obsolescence unnecessarily.
    - wmf 4y ago
      Exactly. It makes no sense that Chrome OS gets 6 years of updates but Chrome OS Flex gets 10+ years.
      - wffurr 4y ago
        ChromeOS Flex doesn't include the bios, firmware, or secure boot system of standard ChromeOS. It relies on an HAL that limits what can be updated. See https://support.google.com/chromeosflex/answer/11542901?hl=en https://support.google.com/chromeosflex/answer/11542901?hl=e... for more on the difference.
        Wowfunhappy 4y ago
        So say I have a Chromebook and I'd like to not throw it in the trash. Can I give up those things to keep getting security updates?
        wffurr 4y ago
        Yes, but you will need to install an alternative firmware, eg https://mrchromebox.tech/ https://mrchromebox.tech/
- vorpalhex 4y ago
  It's very possible those chromebooks were underpowered to begin with. At some point the hardware really is dead.
  - pjmlp 4y ago
    My 2009 netbook is still doing great with latest Ubuntu LTS.
- tlhunter 4y ago
  > Love how Google is advocating this for cost savings and sustainability. I wish they followed this philosophy with their phones.
PascLeRasc 4y ago
This looks really great. Here's the installation guide that they make you put in an email to get to: https://support.google.com/chromeosflex/answer/11552529 https://support.google.com/chromeosflex/answer/11552529
- jeroenhd 4y ago
  You don't actually need to provide an email address if you have Google Chrome installed. You can use the Chromebook recovery tool (a browser extension) to write an installer image to a flash drive. I'm pretty sure you need 8GB of space or more. Others have intercepted and extracted the downloaded image, but I never cared enough to use that approach. This process doesn't work with all Chromium derived browsers, though, probably because they added extra permissions to the extension because I wouldn't normally want a browser extension to have raw disk access. https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/chromebook-recovery-utili/pocpnlppkickgojjlmhdmidojbmbodfm https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/chromebook-recover...
nixcraft 4y ago
I wonder if my older "Samsung Chromebook 2 (2014)" model will work with this? Google removed support for that model a long time ago.
- jeroenhd 4y ago
  ChromeOS Flex is for amd64 chips as far as I can tell and your Chromebook actually runs on an ARM chip, so I doubt it'll work (for now, at least). You never know, maybe they'll release an ARM version in the future, but I sort of doubt it.
  - roseway4 4y ago
    It would be fun, and possibly quite useful, to run Flex on the Raspberry Pi.
- wffurr 4y ago
  I wish they'd make Flex available to out of date Chromebooks. You lose secure boot, but you could still get updated Chrome versions.
- sboomer 4y ago
  It may work if any of the mainstream Linux distros run on your pc.
- mdaniel 4y ago
  Is there a community of "ChromeOS distros" like how LineageOS does with open source Android for older phones? My only experience trying to build ChromeOS was for "Container-Optimized OS" which doesn't have nearly the same "random binary blobs" problem as trying to build for a piece of consumer hardware
  - LordDragonfang 4y ago
    The ChromeOS equivalent of LineageOS is usually just installing a normal linux desktop distro, sometimes one that's been been tweaked to have drivers specific to chromebook hardware like GalliumOS (https://galliumos.org/ https://galliumos.org/)
jeroenhd 4y ago
I wanted to try this in a VM but the install image seems to lack decent drivers for libvirt/kvm/virt-manager/whatever caused issues. The cursor was invisible, the system was slow, and the system didn't boot after I finally got it to install. This may say nothing about ChromeOS Flex's actual performance on real hardware, but open source virtualisation tech seems like an obvious point to start at when you're developing an OS for general purpose use. Hopefully support will be better in time, this could be an excellent balance between Windows 11 growing ever more resource hungry and Linux being difficult to maintain by novices.
SoftTalker 4y ago
With Google's track record for discontinuing products, would you commit to moving your school or business to this OS? Yes, schools and businesses often replace technology on a schedule, but standardizing on an OS is a longer-term decision than desktop replacement.
- e-clinton 4y ago
  Agreed. This is def good for the industry as it’ll push Microsoft to be more competitive
- minerva23 4y ago
  You shouldn’t be getting downvoted for that. It’s a fair question for those educated in Google’s history of cancelling products and uneducated in Chrome OS. A lot of people are unaware that Google is deeply committed in the OS space. Apart from Android, which they saw/see as an existential need for their business, Chrome OS fills a similar space on the desktop (especially as MS ramps up their anticompetitive efforts with their own browser again). Google also uses a chromium build internally in GCP/GKE, so the OS is being maintained for servers as well. Lastly, Chrome OS has been around for a long time and is based off an open source project with passionate maintainers.
  - Closi 4y ago
    Lol at the comment around Microsoft's "anti-competitive efforts" which were making IE a core part of Windows, in a thread about Chrome OS which makes Chrome core to the OS, and in a world where Chrome has the dominant market share and is solidifying it by building it into their products.
    - yjftsjthsd-h 4y ago
      I'm not sure that those are really the same; Google already had Chrome and then made an OS to run it, while MS had OS dominance and used that to force everyone to have IE. The analog would be if Google made Chrome automatically add a ChromeOS dual-boot option to every Windows PC it was installed on.
raggi 4y ago
I was really excited about Flex when I first heard about it. I then heard it didn't have Widevine or Android or Linux features. I don't know if that changed, but I wouldn't be surprised if not. If it did ship those it would be a great distro for a lot of people.
- andrewmutz 4y ago
  > Linux features Not sure what you are referring to, but I am writing this post from Chrome OS flex and the linux features work perfectly.
  - AdmiralAsshat 4y ago
    What are the "Linux features" exactly? Can you install packages? What distro or packaging format are they based off?
    - andrewmutz 4y ago
      It's debian. Yes you can install packages. You get a built in terminal running bash but you can install a terminal program or she'll just fine. Linux app support is extremely good. Everything works with the window manager quite well. Even steam is available for games. Only limits I've hit are when interacting with hardware devices, but I havent done it enough to tell you exactly what the limits are
      - elkos 4y ago
        can you install Firefox on it?
        andrewmutz 4y ago
        Yes
    - LordDragonfang 4y ago
      Assuming it's the same as normal ChromeOS, it's a containerized full linux shell that will run most GUI apps in the native window manager. It defaults to Debian, so uses standard apt, but you can make a container with any distro if you have the know-how.
dagmx 4y ago
Title on HN seems cut off. Missing "have been waiting for" as of right now
- DoctorOW 4y ago
  Personally I would cut off more. "Early access to Chrome OS Flex" is the factual statement about the topic of the post and "The upgrade PCs and Macs have been waiting for" isn't
  - dagmx 4y ago
    Agreed. The latter half is marketing speak and doesn't add much of value in providing information
sboomer 4y ago
I would have loved to have this as my secondary os. It's shame that one cannot multi boot this. I'm looking for a way to multi boot this.
timnetworks 4y ago
I don't want to downvote the post, just the subject, and I wonder if it should have been 'downgrade' instead.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
Wowfunhappy 4y ago
Meanwhile, the Chromebooks we use at an after-school program where I teach are no longer receiving security updates. I'm not sure how old the machines are, but they're quite speedy compared to other Chromebooks I've used, and perfectly capable of browsing the modern web. I love the idea of Chrome OS Flex, but I wish Google extended the same support to hardware designed for Chrome OS...
- car_analogy 4y ago
  Meanwhile 20 year old machines running linux still get updates. How is it that software support became tied to specific hardware? This used to be a solved problem, but with a lot of effort and ingenuity, a few corporations un-solved it, first for smartphones, tablets, and now for whatever Chromebooks count as.
  - kevin_thibedeau 4y ago
    Nobody makes money off of a 20 year old machine. This is planned obsolescence to maintain demand.
  - realce 4y ago
    I feel like "unsolving" problems is becoming the only way to make a good buck in IT anymore.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - sieabahlpark 4y ago
- boddhi 4y ago
  I suspect Google will eventually use Chrome OS Flex as a subscription service to provide extended Hardware/Software support for Education and Enterprise. They came up with Chrome OS Flex after buying Neverware in 2020, which already provided Chrome OS support for Education and Enterprise.
andrewmutz 4y ago
I am writing this comment on Chrome OS Flex and can not say enough good things about Chrome OS Flex. I installed it on my wife's old macbook air (~2013) and it brought new life to a machine that we had written off as useless. The OS does a great job of exactly two things: web browsing and linux stuff. It won't do more than that, but if that's all you need it is great. I honestly think you could make some decent cash just by buying 9 year old laptops off the internet, installing chrome OS flex, and selling them as perfectly usable chromebooks. Any questions about what the OS can do? AMA
- dijit 4y ago
  Last time I ran chromeOS it was those unofficial builds by a guy called “Lex”, needless to say it was a long time ago. Back then it wasn’t possible to run anything other than Chrome itself outside of dev mode, but I’ve seen people running/installing VSCode on chromeOS (not in the web browser). Is that feasible? At the same time as I was seeing this, it appeared that the OS actually has a windowing system now, so you can move windows around and have one on top of the other, is that the case? Any quirks with that?
  - andrewmutz 4y ago
    By default, there is only web browsers and no Linux. Which is nice because by default there can be no malware and it's a good OS for non technical users. But with one click it installs and makes available Linux. It appears to the user as a debain variant. You can install anything and when you run apps they seamlessly work with the window manager. I've used VScode for software development and it works great. Steam is even available for games, but I haven't tried it. Window manager is the right balance of powerful and simple. Great at manipulating web browser windows (has virtual desktops if you want them), but works fine interacting with Linux apps as well.
    - 5d8767c68926 4y ago
      Is it Google in name only or does it send telemetry of my every click to the mother ship? Would be interested in trying it as a VSCode remote development + minimal Linux utilities platform.
merwanedr 4y ago
Ha, for a minute I thought Google actually built a Cloud-native OS. Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't really see the use-case for this. Sounds like it could be an orchestration solution for schools or bootcamps at best. What's incredible about real cloud-native operating systems is that "OS" is merely an acronym. The reality is that companies like Mighty are working on cloud-native computers, where even hardware upgradability is handled without you having to pay attention. The endgame is that you don't have upgrade your laptop anymore, not just install apps fast.
- dijit 4y ago
  What would a cloud native OS look like to you?
- csouza-f 4y ago
  Maybe I had the same perception as you. Seems like, removing the marketing thing of the Google's website, this is just the Chrome OS but with support for devices that are not designed for run Chrome OS, that's why "Flex" appended in the name. This is super nice, by the way. My first thought, not knowing very much about Chrome OS history, was that the OS is just a ground to run the system that will connect with some machine in the cloud that will do all complicated-processing things and you'll just visualize that, like a VNC. But, seems not like it.
- yjftsjthsd-h 4y ago
  > for a minute I thought Google actually built a Cloud-native OS I'm curious how you would define a cloud-native OS that doesn't include Chrome OS. > The endgame is that you don't have upgrade your laptop anymore, not just install apps fast. How are Chromebooks not already this? The whole thing is just a way to run a browser that connects to the real workloads in the cloud, and hardware is only obsolete when it stops getting updates (which is very "cloud native" behavior - the device lives and dies at the will of some remote company that manages it for you).
kennywinker 4y ago
In the 1990s Microsoft was heavily criticized, and litigated against, for the deep integration of internet explorer with windows, and their monopoly on operating systems and web browsing. Stunning to think that people are willingly installing chrome the browsers, and chrome the os in 2022.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- LoveMortuus 4y ago
  It is actually possible to install non-chrome browsers on ChromeOS either through the App store or just via the console. But I totally understand your point and the options I've listed aren't either user friendly or straight up require you to be able to use a console.
  - kennywinker 4y ago
    It was always possible to install netscape navigator over top of windows. The crux of the issue was that it was "unreasonably difficult".
    - scarface74 4y ago
      It was never difficult to install Navigator on Windows. You downloaded it from the internet and installed it.
- shadowgovt 4y ago
  As history has unfolded, it seems to have become increasingly clear that the antitrust lawsuit against Microsoft in the 90s was ill-conceived. At the very least, it doesn't appear to have been based upon any underlying philosophy of monopoly that shows any consistency, for the very reasons you've indicated.
  - kennywinker 4y ago
    I mean that case was in 1998. Less than three years later bush jr was in power, and we haven’t seen significant antitrust since. It’s not for lack of there being a philosophy where that case makes sense - but it is for lack of cross-administration will to enact this kind of antitrust - and a lack of good object-permanence in the minds of the public. We forgot, the legislators and legal system forgot. Everybody forgot.
LoveMortuus 4y ago
Sorry if this is a stupid question, but what does "cloud first" mean in the context of an operating system, does it mean that you need to always be connected to the internet to use it, like can you use the computer offline?
- fartcannon 4y ago
  It means you're renting it and they're using your data for profit.
- vorpalhex 4y ago
  It uses Google Drive (or similar) to store all your files. There is a local drive used for caching so you can work offline entirely but the idea is that the workstation is "cattle" - you can throw it into a shredder, log into a new chromebook and have all your apps/files/etc installed and ready to go. The selling point for these are light computer users.
  - LoveMortuus 4y ago
    That sounds pretty cool, having access to all of your file from any computer that you login. But would guess that you'd have to pay quite a lot for such a luxury especially if you store more then just text files and such. Thanks for the explanation! ^o^
    - e63f67dd-065b 4y ago
      Storage is actually not that expensive in enterprise settings. One of the schools around where I lived ran some kind of google education enterprise solution (they rebranded it to something else now but it’s the same thing) and for something like $5/mo/person (probably more now) the institution had several hundred TB of common storage and each person had an additional hundred GB, along with a complete IT package with a LMS, enterprise level fleet deployment and management systems, etc. Yeah licensing cost was a significant line item in the IT budget but not as much as you’d think. I mean, think about it, a 1k student school will have pay probably 100k to google (staff costs money too and price has probably gone up since I last looked at it), which is the salary+benefits of like 1 and a half IT guys. You’ll need way more than that for 1k students, plus enterprise internet, servers, hardware maintenance, laptops for everybody, etc. So if you add everything up it’s a small part of the IT budget to achieve this.
alexnewman 4y ago
I love my new flex machines. My favorite Linux distro is that VM. Wish it had android going
- vorpalhex 4y ago
  Does Flex not have that android-on-chromebook feature?
  - AndroidKitKat 4y ago
    Unfortunately, no. If they made that available I'd probably switch full time to Flex from Ubuntu.
sorenjan 4y ago
I've had two Google Nexus phones and one Android Wear watch, and all three became e-waste before their time purely because Google stopped updating them. In the case of the watch Google actually started sending out "updates" to their own apps that removed functionality from watches with older Android wear, with no possibility to update. It had less features when I threw it away than it had when I bought it. I'm using Android on my phone not because I want to use a Google made OS, but because it's unfortunately the best option available, since I have other issues with Apple. A Google OS will never be the best option for my real computer, at least I certainly hope so. I find it slightly hypocritical that the company that deliberately stops updating their own phones and computers based on dates can claim to want to reduce e-waste. "Each device has an Auto Update Expiration (AUE) date." https://support.google.com/chromebook/answer/9367166?hl=en https://support.google.com/chromebook/answer/9367166?hl=en "Reduce e-waste and extend the life of your existing devices by transforming them with a modern OS." https://chromeenterprise.google/os/chromeosflex/ https://chromeenterprise.google/os/chromeosflex/
- Zhenya 4y ago
  Not defending Google’s actions but it worth noting that not updating devices usually has to do with the SoC supplier ceasing support for the chip by not shipping BSPs which support new OS features. Yes google should have negotiated better support but it’s lack of support has to do more with inability to do so within reasonable means. They have projects ongoing to decouple OS functionality from the base firmware (project treble and project keystone). https://www.googblogs.com/tag/keystone/ https://www.googblogs.com/tag/keystone/ This whole issue is probably one reason that Google went through all the trouble to first develop their own support silicon and then the main SoC (pixel 6).
  - my123 4y ago
    For Chrome OS not the problem a lot of the time, they drop support for devices using commodity SoCs that are still supported elsewhere... it's a quite hardcoded expiry date. And they don't even drop support for all machines using a given SoC at the same time. For Chrome OS updates are wholly owned by Google too.
fartcannon 4y ago
Schools should be using Linux (or a BSD) exclusively. And preferably, open format alternatives to anything locked down. Proprietary software is fine if the data is easily exported to another format. Transforming a perfectly good Linux machine into a Google data pipeline is a horrible thing to do to children.
- vorpalhex 4y ago
  I'd love to see you maintain 800 linux laptops kept in the hands of kids. "What do you mean you recompiled ALSA and now you can't join Zoom little Timmy? Did you try invoking modprobe again?"
  - zizee 4y ago
    If it is anything like my kids school, the maintenance would be exactly the same regardless of the OS. The students are instructed to keep everything in their synced drive, and they reimage machines at the drop of a hat.
  - fartcannon 4y ago
    "Timmy, you recompiled alsa? That's kind of impressive. I'm going to give you some more challenging work to try and help develop your computer skills. We sure are lucky that we have open computers that let you do things besides consume YouTube and be spied on."
    - sokoloff 4y ago
moondev 4y ago
If Chrome OS Flex supported running android apps and google play like upstream it would be a game changer.
shadowgovt 4y ago
For those maintaining a machine for older relatives: I found that switching them to Chrome OS has really taken the burden off me as their sole tech support. No installable applications means no vector for adware to convince them to fall into a cycle of installing other adware until the machine is bloated beyond functionality.
jpalomaki 4y ago
Is there more detailed information about supported hardware? I'm especially interested if this supports proper sleep on Intel/Lenovo hardware (instant on, not draining battery too quickly).
- boddhi 4y ago
  Here are the certified models list: https://support.google.com/chromeosflex/answer/11513094 https://support.google.com/chromeosflex/answer/11513094 Google collects hardware data from users when they install Chrome OS Flex. You can opt out of it, but Google will continue to collect data anyways as stated in the agreement.
killjoywashere 4y ago
Welcome to governance: no machines are currently certified. Many are "verified to work" though. So probably some number of those will become certified eventually.
pabs3 4y ago
I wonder why Google uses gLinux (a Debian derivative) internally instead of ChromeOS and if Flex is part of them working towards switching.
dinvlad 4y ago
As an interesting alternative, Fedora Silverblue is another experiment with immutable OSes for the masses. Haven't played with it myself, but heard good things. The DevEx might not be a solved problem with it though - chaining multiple dev tools with Flatpaks might not provide quite the same experience as having an entire isolated LXD container, as in Chrome OS. Also, it's too bad Nvidia remains a second-class citizen, even on Chrome OS.
u8 4y ago
This comment section reads like an ad for Flex.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]

127 points by type0 4y ago

Love how Google is advocating this for cost savings and sustainability. If only my School District could use Chrome OS Flex to get some more life out of the fleet 4 year old Chromebook's that can no longer get updates

wmf 4y ago
Replacing an EOL version of Chrome OS with a different version of Chrome OS makes no sense.
- robertlagrant 4y ago
  Whoosh.
- rufugee 4y ago
  I think their point is that Google is forcing perfectly good hardware into obsolescence unnecessarily.
  - wmf 4y ago
    Exactly. It makes no sense that Chrome OS gets 6 years of updates but Chrome OS Flex gets 10+ years.
    - wffurr 4y ago
      ChromeOS Flex doesn't include the bios, firmware, or secure boot system of standard ChromeOS. It relies on an HAL that limits what can be updated. See https://support.google.com/chromeosflex/answer/11542901?hl=en https://support.google.com/chromeosflex/answer/11542901?hl=e... for more on the difference.
      - Wowfunhappy 4y ago
        So say I have a Chromebook and I'd like to not throw it in the trash. Can I give up those things to keep getting security updates?
        wffurr 4y ago
        Yes, but you will need to install an alternative firmware, eg https://mrchromebox.tech/ https://mrchromebox.tech/
vorpalhex 4y ago
It's very possible those chromebooks were underpowered to begin with. At some point the hardware really is dead.
- pjmlp 4y ago
  My 2009 netbook is still doing great with latest Ubuntu LTS.
tlhunter 4y ago
> Love how Google is advocating this for cost savings and sustainability. I wish they followed this philosophy with their phones.

PascLeRasc 4y ago

This looks really great. Here's the installation guide that they make you put in an email to get to: https://support.google.com/chromeosflex/answer/11552529 https://support.google.com/chromeosflex/answer/11552529

jeroenhd 4y ago
You don't actually need to provide an email address if you have Google Chrome installed. You can use the Chromebook recovery tool (a browser extension) to write an installer image to a flash drive. I'm pretty sure you need 8GB of space or more. Others have intercepted and extracted the downloaded image, but I never cared enough to use that approach. This process doesn't work with all Chromium derived browsers, though, probably because they added extra permissions to the extension because I wouldn't normally want a browser extension to have raw disk access. https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/chromebook-recovery-utili/pocpnlppkickgojjlmhdmidojbmbodfm https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/chromebook-recover...

nixcraft 4y ago

I wonder if my older "Samsung Chromebook 2 (2014)" model will work with this? Google removed support for that model a long time ago.

jeroenhd 4y ago
ChromeOS Flex is for amd64 chips as far as I can tell and your Chromebook actually runs on an ARM chip, so I doubt it'll work (for now, at least). You never know, maybe they'll release an ARM version in the future, but I sort of doubt it.
- roseway4 4y ago
  It would be fun, and possibly quite useful, to run Flex on the Raspberry Pi.
wffurr 4y ago
I wish they'd make Flex available to out of date Chromebooks. You lose secure boot, but you could still get updated Chrome versions.
sboomer 4y ago
It may work if any of the mainstream Linux distros run on your pc.
mdaniel 4y ago
Is there a community of "ChromeOS distros" like how LineageOS does with open source Android for older phones? My only experience trying to build ChromeOS was for "Container-Optimized OS" which doesn't have nearly the same "random binary blobs" problem as trying to build for a piece of consumer hardware
- LordDragonfang 4y ago
  The ChromeOS equivalent of LineageOS is usually just installing a normal linux desktop distro, sometimes one that's been been tweaked to have drivers specific to chromebook hardware like GalliumOS (https://galliumos.org/ https://galliumos.org/)

jeroenhd 4y ago

I wanted to try this in a VM but the install image seems to lack decent drivers for libvirt/kvm/virt-manager/whatever caused issues. The cursor was invisible, the system was slow, and the system didn't boot after I finally got it to install. This may say nothing about ChromeOS Flex's actual performance on real hardware, but open source virtualisation tech seems like an obvious point to start at when you're developing an OS for general purpose use. Hopefully support will be better in time, this could be an excellent balance between Windows 11 growing ever more resource hungry and Linux being difficult to maintain by novices.

SoftTalker 4y ago

With Google's track record for discontinuing products, would you commit to moving your school or business to this OS? Yes, schools and businesses often replace technology on a schedule, but standardizing on an OS is a longer-term decision than desktop replacement.

e-clinton 4y ago
Agreed. This is def good for the industry as it’ll push Microsoft to be more competitive
minerva23 4y ago
You shouldn’t be getting downvoted for that. It’s a fair question for those educated in Google’s history of cancelling products and uneducated in Chrome OS. A lot of people are unaware that Google is deeply committed in the OS space. Apart from Android, which they saw/see as an existential need for their business, Chrome OS fills a similar space on the desktop (especially as MS ramps up their anticompetitive efforts with their own browser again). Google also uses a chromium build internally in GCP/GKE, so the OS is being maintained for servers as well. Lastly, Chrome OS has been around for a long time and is based off an open source project with passionate maintainers.
- Closi 4y ago
  Lol at the comment around Microsoft's "anti-competitive efforts" which were making IE a core part of Windows, in a thread about Chrome OS which makes Chrome core to the OS, and in a world where Chrome has the dominant market share and is solidifying it by building it into their products.
  - yjftsjthsd-h 4y ago
    I'm not sure that those are really the same; Google already had Chrome and then made an OS to run it, while MS had OS dominance and used that to force everyone to have IE. The analog would be if Google made Chrome automatically add a ChromeOS dual-boot option to every Windows PC it was installed on.

raggi 4y ago

I was really excited about Flex when I first heard about it. I then heard it didn't have Widevine or Android or Linux features. I don't know if that changed, but I wouldn't be surprised if not. If it did ship those it would be a great distro for a lot of people.

andrewmutz 4y ago
> Linux features Not sure what you are referring to, but I am writing this post from Chrome OS flex and the linux features work perfectly.
- AdmiralAsshat 4y ago
  What are the "Linux features" exactly? Can you install packages? What distro or packaging format are they based off?
  - andrewmutz 4y ago
    It's debian. Yes you can install packages. You get a built in terminal running bash but you can install a terminal program or she'll just fine. Linux app support is extremely good. Everything works with the window manager quite well. Even steam is available for games. Only limits I've hit are when interacting with hardware devices, but I havent done it enough to tell you exactly what the limits are
    - elkos 4y ago
      can you install Firefox on it?
      - andrewmutz 4y ago
        Yes
  - LordDragonfang 4y ago
    Assuming it's the same as normal ChromeOS, it's a containerized full linux shell that will run most GUI apps in the native window manager. It defaults to Debian, so uses standard apt, but you can make a container with any distro if you have the know-how.

dagmx 4y ago

Title on HN seems cut off. Missing "have been waiting for" as of right now

DoctorOW 4y ago
Personally I would cut off more. "Early access to Chrome OS Flex" is the factual statement about the topic of the post and "The upgrade PCs and Macs have been waiting for" isn't
- dagmx 4y ago
  Agreed. The latter half is marketing speak and doesn't add much of value in providing information

sboomer 4y ago

I would have loved to have this as my secondary os. It's shame that one cannot multi boot this. I'm looking for a way to multi boot this.

timnetworks 4y ago

I don't want to downvote the post, just the subject, and I wonder if it should have been 'downgrade' instead.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

Wowfunhappy 4y ago

Meanwhile, the Chromebooks we use at an after-school program where I teach are no longer receiving security updates. I'm not sure how old the machines are, but they're quite speedy compared to other Chromebooks I've used, and perfectly capable of browsing the modern web. I love the idea of Chrome OS Flex, but I wish Google extended the same support to hardware designed for Chrome OS...

car_analogy 4y ago
Meanwhile 20 year old machines running linux still get updates. How is it that software support became tied to specific hardware? This used to be a solved problem, but with a lot of effort and ingenuity, a few corporations un-solved it, first for smartphones, tablets, and now for whatever Chromebooks count as.
- kevin_thibedeau 4y ago
  Nobody makes money off of a 20 year old machine. This is planned obsolescence to maintain demand.
- realce 4y ago
  I feel like "unsolving" problems is becoming the only way to make a good buck in IT anymore.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- sieabahlpark 4y ago
boddhi 4y ago
I suspect Google will eventually use Chrome OS Flex as a subscription service to provide extended Hardware/Software support for Education and Enterprise. They came up with Chrome OS Flex after buying Neverware in 2020, which already provided Chrome OS support for Education and Enterprise.

andrewmutz 4y ago

I am writing this comment on Chrome OS Flex and can not say enough good things about Chrome OS Flex. I installed it on my wife's old macbook air (~2013) and it brought new life to a machine that we had written off as useless. The OS does a great job of exactly two things: web browsing and linux stuff. It won't do more than that, but if that's all you need it is great. I honestly think you could make some decent cash just by buying 9 year old laptops off the internet, installing chrome OS flex, and selling them as perfectly usable chromebooks. Any questions about what the OS can do? AMA

dijit 4y ago
Last time I ran chromeOS it was those unofficial builds by a guy called “Lex”, needless to say it was a long time ago. Back then it wasn’t possible to run anything other than Chrome itself outside of dev mode, but I’ve seen people running/installing VSCode on chromeOS (not in the web browser). Is that feasible? At the same time as I was seeing this, it appeared that the OS actually has a windowing system now, so you can move windows around and have one on top of the other, is that the case? Any quirks with that?
- andrewmutz 4y ago
  By default, there is only web browsers and no Linux. Which is nice because by default there can be no malware and it's a good OS for non technical users. But with one click it installs and makes available Linux. It appears to the user as a debain variant. You can install anything and when you run apps they seamlessly work with the window manager. I've used VScode for software development and it works great. Steam is even available for games, but I haven't tried it. Window manager is the right balance of powerful and simple. Great at manipulating web browser windows (has virtual desktops if you want them), but works fine interacting with Linux apps as well.
  - 5d8767c68926 4y ago
    Is it Google in name only or does it send telemetry of my every click to the mother ship? Would be interested in trying it as a VSCode remote development + minimal Linux utilities platform.

merwanedr 4y ago

Ha, for a minute I thought Google actually built a Cloud-native OS. Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't really see the use-case for this. Sounds like it could be an orchestration solution for schools or bootcamps at best. What's incredible about real cloud-native operating systems is that "OS" is merely an acronym. The reality is that companies like Mighty are working on cloud-native computers, where even hardware upgradability is handled without you having to pay attention. The endgame is that you don't have upgrade your laptop anymore, not just install apps fast.

dijit 4y ago
What would a cloud native OS look like to you?
csouza-f 4y ago
Maybe I had the same perception as you. Seems like, removing the marketing thing of the Google's website, this is just the Chrome OS but with support for devices that are not designed for run Chrome OS, that's why "Flex" appended in the name. This is super nice, by the way. My first thought, not knowing very much about Chrome OS history, was that the OS is just a ground to run the system that will connect with some machine in the cloud that will do all complicated-processing things and you'll just visualize that, like a VNC. But, seems not like it.
yjftsjthsd-h 4y ago
> for a minute I thought Google actually built a Cloud-native OS I'm curious how you would define a cloud-native OS that doesn't include Chrome OS. > The endgame is that you don't have upgrade your laptop anymore, not just install apps fast. How are Chromebooks not already this? The whole thing is just a way to run a browser that connects to the real workloads in the cloud, and hardware is only obsolete when it stops getting updates (which is very "cloud native" behavior - the device lives and dies at the will of some remote company that manages it for you).

kennywinker 4y ago

In the 1990s Microsoft was heavily criticized, and litigated against, for the deep integration of internet explorer with windows, and their monopoly on operating systems and web browsing. Stunning to think that people are willingly installing chrome the browsers, and chrome the os in 2022.

deleted 4y ago
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LoveMortuus 4y ago
It is actually possible to install non-chrome browsers on ChromeOS either through the App store or just via the console. But I totally understand your point and the options I've listed aren't either user friendly or straight up require you to be able to use a console.
- kennywinker 4y ago
  It was always possible to install netscape navigator over top of windows. The crux of the issue was that it was "unreasonably difficult".
  - scarface74 4y ago
    It was never difficult to install Navigator on Windows. You downloaded it from the internet and installed it.
shadowgovt 4y ago
As history has unfolded, it seems to have become increasingly clear that the antitrust lawsuit against Microsoft in the 90s was ill-conceived. At the very least, it doesn't appear to have been based upon any underlying philosophy of monopoly that shows any consistency, for the very reasons you've indicated.
- kennywinker 4y ago
  I mean that case was in 1998. Less than three years later bush jr was in power, and we haven’t seen significant antitrust since. It’s not for lack of there being a philosophy where that case makes sense - but it is for lack of cross-administration will to enact this kind of antitrust - and a lack of good object-permanence in the minds of the public. We forgot, the legislators and legal system forgot. Everybody forgot.

LoveMortuus 4y ago

Sorry if this is a stupid question, but what does "cloud first" mean in the context of an operating system, does it mean that you need to always be connected to the internet to use it, like can you use the computer offline?

fartcannon 4y ago
It means you're renting it and they're using your data for profit.
vorpalhex 4y ago
It uses Google Drive (or similar) to store all your files. There is a local drive used for caching so you can work offline entirely but the idea is that the workstation is "cattle" - you can throw it into a shredder, log into a new chromebook and have all your apps/files/etc installed and ready to go. The selling point for these are light computer users.
- LoveMortuus 4y ago
  That sounds pretty cool, having access to all of your file from any computer that you login. But would guess that you'd have to pay quite a lot for such a luxury especially if you store more then just text files and such. Thanks for the explanation! ^o^
  - e63f67dd-065b 4y ago
    Storage is actually not that expensive in enterprise settings. One of the schools around where I lived ran some kind of google education enterprise solution (they rebranded it to something else now but it’s the same thing) and for something like $5/mo/person (probably more now) the institution had several hundred TB of common storage and each person had an additional hundred GB, along with a complete IT package with a LMS, enterprise level fleet deployment and management systems, etc. Yeah licensing cost was a significant line item in the IT budget but not as much as you’d think. I mean, think about it, a 1k student school will have pay probably 100k to google (staff costs money too and price has probably gone up since I last looked at it), which is the salary+benefits of like 1 and a half IT guys. You’ll need way more than that for 1k students, plus enterprise internet, servers, hardware maintenance, laptops for everybody, etc. So if you add everything up it’s a small part of the IT budget to achieve this.

alexnewman 4y ago

I love my new flex machines. My favorite Linux distro is that VM. Wish it had android going

vorpalhex 4y ago
Does Flex not have that android-on-chromebook feature?
- AndroidKitKat 4y ago
  Unfortunately, no. If they made that available I'd probably switch full time to Flex from Ubuntu.

sorenjan 4y ago

I've had two Google Nexus phones and one Android Wear watch, and all three became e-waste before their time purely because Google stopped updating them. In the case of the watch Google actually started sending out "updates" to their own apps that removed functionality from watches with older Android wear, with no possibility to update. It had less features when I threw it away than it had when I bought it. I'm using Android on my phone not because I want to use a Google made OS, but because it's unfortunately the best option available, since I have other issues with Apple. A Google OS will never be the best option for my real computer, at least I certainly hope so. I find it slightly hypocritical that the company that deliberately stops updating their own phones and computers based on dates can claim to want to reduce e-waste. "Each device has an Auto Update Expiration (AUE) date." https://support.google.com/chromebook/answer/9367166?hl=en https://support.google.com/chromebook/answer/9367166?hl=en "Reduce e-waste and extend the life of your existing devices by transforming them with a modern OS." https://chromeenterprise.google/os/chromeosflex/ https://chromeenterprise.google/os/chromeosflex/

Zhenya 4y ago
Not defending Google’s actions but it worth noting that not updating devices usually has to do with the SoC supplier ceasing support for the chip by not shipping BSPs which support new OS features. Yes google should have negotiated better support but it’s lack of support has to do more with inability to do so within reasonable means. They have projects ongoing to decouple OS functionality from the base firmware (project treble and project keystone). https://www.googblogs.com/tag/keystone/ https://www.googblogs.com/tag/keystone/ This whole issue is probably one reason that Google went through all the trouble to first develop their own support silicon and then the main SoC (pixel 6).
- my123 4y ago
  For Chrome OS not the problem a lot of the time, they drop support for devices using commodity SoCs that are still supported elsewhere... it's a quite hardcoded expiry date. And they don't even drop support for all machines using a given SoC at the same time. For Chrome OS updates are wholly owned by Google too.

fartcannon 4y ago

Schools should be using Linux (or a BSD) exclusively. And preferably, open format alternatives to anything locked down. Proprietary software is fine if the data is easily exported to another format. Transforming a perfectly good Linux machine into a Google data pipeline is a horrible thing to do to children.

vorpalhex 4y ago
I'd love to see you maintain 800 linux laptops kept in the hands of kids. "What do you mean you recompiled ALSA and now you can't join Zoom little Timmy? Did you try invoking modprobe again?"
- zizee 4y ago
  If it is anything like my kids school, the maintenance would be exactly the same regardless of the OS. The students are instructed to keep everything in their synced drive, and they reimage machines at the drop of a hat.
- fartcannon 4y ago
  "Timmy, you recompiled alsa? That's kind of impressive. I'm going to give you some more challenging work to try and help develop your computer skills. We sure are lucky that we have open computers that let you do things besides consume YouTube and be spied on."
  - sokoloff 4y ago

moondev 4y ago

If Chrome OS Flex supported running android apps and google play like upstream it would be a game changer.

shadowgovt 4y ago

For those maintaining a machine for older relatives: I found that switching them to Chrome OS has really taken the burden off me as their sole tech support. No installable applications means no vector for adware to convince them to fall into a cycle of installing other adware until the machine is bloated beyond functionality.

jpalomaki 4y ago

Is there more detailed information about supported hardware? I'm especially interested if this supports proper sleep on Intel/Lenovo hardware (instant on, not draining battery too quickly).

boddhi 4y ago
Here are the certified models list: https://support.google.com/chromeosflex/answer/11513094 https://support.google.com/chromeosflex/answer/11513094 Google collects hardware data from users when they install Chrome OS Flex. You can opt out of it, but Google will continue to collect data anyways as stated in the agreement.

killjoywashere 4y ago

Welcome to governance: no machines are currently certified. Many are "verified to work" though. So probably some number of those will become certified eventually.

pabs3 4y ago

I wonder why Google uses gLinux (a Debian derivative) internally instead of ChromeOS and if Flex is part of them working towards switching.

dinvlad 4y ago

As an interesting alternative, Fedora Silverblue is another experiment with immutable OSes for the masses. Haven't played with it myself, but heard good things. The DevEx might not be a solved problem with it though - chaining multiple dev tools with Flatpaks might not provide quite the same experience as having an entire isolated LXD container, as in Chrome OS. Also, it's too bad Nvidia remains a second-class citizen, even on Chrome OS.

u8 4y ago

This comment section reads like an ad for Flex.

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