6 ms·

Not accurate. If you read the original research study this recommendation is based on, it prevents the bullseye rash, which they used as a proxy measure. It's u

Not accurate. If you read the original research study this recommendation is based on, it prevents the bullseye rash, which they used as a proxy measure. It's unclear whether or not it actually prevents lyme. I personally got bitten by a tick, did the prophylaxis dose, and then developed joint pain which continued until I did a full 21 day course. Yeah it sucks not being able to go in the sun for an entire month and having acid reflux, but imho the evidence in favor of the prophylaxis is extremely dubious. source: https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJM200107123450201 https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJM200107123450201 "A theoretical risk associated with prophylactic antimicrobial treatment is that it might alter the disease presentation so that the characteristic erythema migrans rash might not be manifested in treated subjects, in whom a more subtle, nonspecific illness might develop or asymptomatic seroconversion might occur. In such circumstances, an unrecognized latent infection might eventually result in arthritis or neurologic disease. We believe that this is unlikely for several reasons. [...]"

Melatonic 4y ago
As an outdoorsy person I just want that damn vaccine to come back. Even if its the weird one that is very similar to what you can currently give to your dog it would be a lot better than nothing. Thankfully apparently Lyme either has not or is not common yet in the western US. I'm crossing my fingers we get a new vaccine before it does.
- Alex3917 4y ago
  At this point there are so many common tickborne illnesses, plus many that haven't even been discovered, that I don't see having a vaccine against only lyme as being a huge game changer. I mean don't get me wrong, it would be great, but I don't think it would suddenly make it safe to go morel hunting or whatever while wearing shorts. That said, tick bites are mostly avoidable by following the various best practices that have been established.
  - cakeface 4y ago
    Tick bites are not mostly avoidable. It is mostly avoidable to have one on you for > 24 hours by checking constantly. Numbers of ticks have increased the past 2 years in my area of NH. I have gotten them walking from my car to the house. Also if you have animals that are treated with tick medicine they bring the ticks inside and then the tick drops off so you can get them in your house.
    - Vecr 4y ago
      Can you wear a Tyvek suit (the kind with the attached booties) under a Nomex flight suit with packing tape wrapped around the joints where your suit meets your boots and gloves? Spray Nomex rated permethrin on the flight suit, boots, and gloves, of course.
      - kurthr 4y ago
        Yes, but it won't keep you from getting COVID.
    - Alex3917 4y ago
      You should be able to get rid of them near your house though. E.g. by keeping grass trimmed, removing any plants they like, planting persimmon trees to attract opossums, etc.
  - Auracle 4y ago
    I can't do my job without risk of tick bites, and even if I did my dog would bring them inside anyways. I took three of them off of me on my car ride home today, though none were attached yet. That said, I've had plenty of deer ticks attached to me over the years and have never had Lyme disease. I kind of get a kick out of hearing about people bringing ticks in to the doctor when they get bit to see if they should be worried. I'm pretty sure my insurance would find a way to kick me off if I did that.
- ghaff 4y ago
  Pfizer and Valneva are working on one: https://www.pfizer.com/news/press-release/press-release-detail/valneva-and-pfizer-report-positive-phase-2-pediatric-data https://www.pfizer.com/news/press-release/press-release-deta... While the backlash against Lymerix wasn't really deserved, the story around it is somewhat complicated and it wasn't really a great vaccine. (And Lyme seemed to be less of a significant health risk at the time.) https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2870557/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2870557/
russiasux 4y ago
I am right there with you. Took one week Doxy after being bit and got a rash anyway. About two years later mental fog and all our hell took over, tested positive but doc wouldn't give me antibiotics because I took the initial one week "and it's not possible that I have Lyme". Years later I have lost a business I founded and countless months where I couldn't even think let alone function. One day IS ABSOLUTELY not enough and if I had my way I would now take at least one month. As further reference your insurance won't cover your treatment once it gets bad, mine ended up being about $3000 per month for years just to get back to working 25-30 hours per week.
- Wowfunhappy 4y ago
  > As further reference your insurance won't cover your treatment once it gets bad Wait, what? Based on what reasoning? Was this before or after the Affordable Care Act?
  - pcthrowaway 4y ago
    My understanding is that Lyme disease treatment is basically not covered by anything, beyond initial treatment. The suggestion of the possibility for Lyme to have long-term effects that need a much longer course of treatment is not scientifically accepted, but lots of people have reported symptoms of Lyme disease long after an initial infection.
    - jaegerpicker 4y ago
      My wife has long term Lyme and in fact very little is covered by insurance. Our experience has been that the majority of Dr's throw up their hands and say they don't know how to treat it so it's either not real or it must be something else causing it. Once you find a Dr to treat it insurance rarely covers much of it. All of this despite many many cases existing.
  - drc500free 4y ago
    Welcome to the world of rare (or at least not common) chronic diseases. Private companies work by firing their least profitable customers. If you have a less common disease, the insurance company can simply claim that your preferred treatment is insufficiently backed by data. With a small patient population, there is no incentive for for-profit companies to fund a study. And because few can afford the treatment, you can't get real world data to use in place of a study.
xhkkffbf 4y ago
It didn't work for one woman I know. She took the single dose and still ended up getting a fever and Lyme several weeks later.
GordonS 4y ago
I was bitten by a tic when I was a kid, maybe 30 years back, got the target rash, went to the doctor and got some antibiotics - no idea which ones, and IIRC I didn't take the full course. Around 5 years later I got reactive hypoglycemia, an autoimmune condition. Though thinking back, it may have started developing shortly after the tic bite. Around 10 years after that, I got 2 separate skin conditions, also autoimmune in nature. Around 10 years later, I developed more autoimmune issues, small fibre neuropathy and CFS (chronic fatigue syndrome) - so I have constant neuropathic pain, constant muscular pain, bad brain fog, chronic fatigue and PEM (post-exertional fatigue). I have no proof that the tic bite is the root cause, and Lyme tests at the time the symptoms came on were negative; still, I can't help but wonder if the actions of that tiny tic, 25 years back, were the cause of ruining my life.
- Madmallard 4y ago
  if you've taken antibiotics this is a more likely cause our food is toxic and everyone is developing stomach and autoimmune conditions so this is also more likely
  - GordonS 4y ago
    I don't understand; are you claiming that anyone who ever takes antibiotics is putting themselves at risk of developing autoimmune conditions?
    - Madmallard 4y ago
      yes of course. altering the gut microbiome is well established at this point to create deleterious outcomes potentially years down the line. But I'm saying our food in general is pretty toxic compared to what it was a hundred years ago. It i s drastically more processed and has much higher concentrations of unregulated and regulated chemical contaminants compared to ever before, and our physiology has not evolved to tolerate these things, so there is again higher potential for problems.

Melatonic 4y ago

As an outdoorsy person I just want that damn vaccine to come back. Even if its the weird one that is very similar to what you can currently give to your dog it would be a lot better than nothing. Thankfully apparently Lyme either has not or is not common yet in the western US. I'm crossing my fingers we get a new vaccine before it does.

Alex3917 4y ago
At this point there are so many common tickborne illnesses, plus many that haven't even been discovered, that I don't see having a vaccine against only lyme as being a huge game changer. I mean don't get me wrong, it would be great, but I don't think it would suddenly make it safe to go morel hunting or whatever while wearing shorts. That said, tick bites are mostly avoidable by following the various best practices that have been established.
- cakeface 4y ago
  Tick bites are not mostly avoidable. It is mostly avoidable to have one on you for > 24 hours by checking constantly. Numbers of ticks have increased the past 2 years in my area of NH. I have gotten them walking from my car to the house. Also if you have animals that are treated with tick medicine they bring the ticks inside and then the tick drops off so you can get them in your house.
  - Vecr 4y ago
    Can you wear a Tyvek suit (the kind with the attached booties) under a Nomex flight suit with packing tape wrapped around the joints where your suit meets your boots and gloves? Spray Nomex rated permethrin on the flight suit, boots, and gloves, of course.
    - kurthr 4y ago
      Yes, but it won't keep you from getting COVID.
  - Alex3917 4y ago
    You should be able to get rid of them near your house though. E.g. by keeping grass trimmed, removing any plants they like, planting persimmon trees to attract opossums, etc.
- Auracle 4y ago
  I can't do my job without risk of tick bites, and even if I did my dog would bring them inside anyways. I took three of them off of me on my car ride home today, though none were attached yet. That said, I've had plenty of deer ticks attached to me over the years and have never had Lyme disease. I kind of get a kick out of hearing about people bringing ticks in to the doctor when they get bit to see if they should be worried. I'm pretty sure my insurance would find a way to kick me off if I did that.
ghaff 4y ago
Pfizer and Valneva are working on one: https://www.pfizer.com/news/press-release/press-release-detail/valneva-and-pfizer-report-positive-phase-2-pediatric-data https://www.pfizer.com/news/press-release/press-release-deta... While the backlash against Lymerix wasn't really deserved, the story around it is somewhat complicated and it wasn't really a great vaccine. (And Lyme seemed to be less of a significant health risk at the time.) https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2870557/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2870557/

russiasux 4y ago

I am right there with you. Took one week Doxy after being bit and got a rash anyway. About two years later mental fog and all our hell took over, tested positive but doc wouldn't give me antibiotics because I took the initial one week "and it's not possible that I have Lyme". Years later I have lost a business I founded and countless months where I couldn't even think let alone function. One day IS ABSOLUTELY not enough and if I had my way I would now take at least one month. As further reference your insurance won't cover your treatment once it gets bad, mine ended up being about $3000 per month for years just to get back to working 25-30 hours per week.

Wowfunhappy 4y ago
> As further reference your insurance won't cover your treatment once it gets bad Wait, what? Based on what reasoning? Was this before or after the Affordable Care Act?
- pcthrowaway 4y ago
  My understanding is that Lyme disease treatment is basically not covered by anything, beyond initial treatment. The suggestion of the possibility for Lyme to have long-term effects that need a much longer course of treatment is not scientifically accepted, but lots of people have reported symptoms of Lyme disease long after an initial infection.
  - jaegerpicker 4y ago
    My wife has long term Lyme and in fact very little is covered by insurance. Our experience has been that the majority of Dr's throw up their hands and say they don't know how to treat it so it's either not real or it must be something else causing it. Once you find a Dr to treat it insurance rarely covers much of it. All of this despite many many cases existing.
- drc500free 4y ago
  Welcome to the world of rare (or at least not common) chronic diseases. Private companies work by firing their least profitable customers. If you have a less common disease, the insurance company can simply claim that your preferred treatment is insufficiently backed by data. With a small patient population, there is no incentive for for-profit companies to fund a study. And because few can afford the treatment, you can't get real world data to use in place of a study.

xhkkffbf 4y ago

It didn't work for one woman I know. She took the single dose and still ended up getting a fever and Lyme several weeks later.

GordonS 4y ago

I was bitten by a tic when I was a kid, maybe 30 years back, got the target rash, went to the doctor and got some antibiotics - no idea which ones, and IIRC I didn't take the full course. Around 5 years later I got reactive hypoglycemia, an autoimmune condition. Though thinking back, it may have started developing shortly after the tic bite. Around 10 years after that, I got 2 separate skin conditions, also autoimmune in nature. Around 10 years later, I developed more autoimmune issues, small fibre neuropathy and CFS (chronic fatigue syndrome) - so I have constant neuropathic pain, constant muscular pain, bad brain fog, chronic fatigue and PEM (post-exertional fatigue). I have no proof that the tic bite is the root cause, and Lyme tests at the time the symptoms came on were negative; still, I can't help but wonder if the actions of that tiny tic, 25 years back, were the cause of ruining my life.

Madmallard 4y ago
if you've taken antibiotics this is a more likely cause our food is toxic and everyone is developing stomach and autoimmune conditions so this is also more likely
- GordonS 4y ago
  I don't understand; are you claiming that anyone who ever takes antibiotics is putting themselves at risk of developing autoimmune conditions?
  - Madmallard 4y ago
    yes of course. altering the gut microbiome is well established at this point to create deleterious outcomes potentially years down the line. But I'm saying our food in general is pretty toxic compared to what it was a hundred years ago. It i s drastically more processed and has much higher concentrations of unregulated and regulated chemical contaminants compared to ever before, and our physiology has not evolved to tolerate these things, so there is again higher potential for problems.