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I'm 22 and have never been on a date or anything resembling one. I'm not too worried about it, though the potential "skill gap" (for lack of a better word) with

I'm 22 and have never been on a date or anything resembling one. I'm not too worried about it, though the potential "skill gap" (for lack of a better word) with future partners does concern me a bit I have to admit.

ip26 4y ago
The thought of finding the one I want while still lacking the skills to make it work (& losing them) drove me to find many dates simply for the learning experience- which lowered the stakes of a date & helped me relax.
_fat_santa 4y ago
FWIW I was very bad at getting dates when I was your age. It's really a skill you develop, the more you do it the better you will get. From age 20-25 I think I went on maybe 7 dates. So far this year I've gone on >20
- Noelkd 4y ago
  20 dates with 20 different people?
  - marcyb5st 4y ago
    I don't see the number as that high. I'm at around 10 different people and considering I stopped around 2 months ago because I found one interesting enough that we decided to be mutually exclusive going forward. I use dating apps or met a couple of them at the bouldering gym where I boulder.
    - GameOfFrowns 4y ago
      >met a couple of them at the bouldering gym where I boulder. That's why I stopped going to the local boulder gyms. Too many cookie-cutter "non-conformist dudes" who see the gym as their personal hunting grounds, creeping on the girls like a sleazy tennis instructor and bullying beginner guys because they don't like the competition.
- PheonixPharts 4y ago
  To each their own of course, but this seems like a, slightly humorous, example of Goodhart's Law. Most people I know dating aren't trying to optimize for the number of dates they go one with different people but ideally trying to find that one person they can be with for awhile. So the common definition of "getting better at dates" implies you eventually date less. I have a few friends in their mid-30s that have become quite the experts at getting dates, but all of them seem fairly unhappy that they are still working on dating rather than in a steady relationship and focusing on other things.
necessary 4y ago
Honestly there's not much to worry about a "skill-gap" either. It's cliche but being the true and authentic version of yourself (and being self-aware if you need to make improvements on that version of yourself - your authentic self can't be a jerk) is the best way to make both friends and romantic partners. Maybe it's different for hookups, but IMHO romantic relationships don't work like they do in the movies.
- annyeonghada 4y ago
  >and being self-aware if you need to make improvements on that version of yourself - your authentic self can't be a jerk So, you need to be yourself... but you actually don't.
  - kbelder 4y ago
    No, you need to be yourself, and recognize that sometimes you need to make yourself better. Not lie about being better, but actually get better.
- LeanderK 4y ago
  I think the skill-gap is not really in being in a romantic relationship but getting one. The skills of being in a successful relationship are similar to the skills of having close friends imo, just more intense. You need to handle conflicts and keep the relationship going. But relationships usually don't last forever, they tend to end. The skill to develop a romantic relationship, from start to finish, is quite important and hard to learn. I think this is where a lot of the skill-gap is located.
- oneoff786 4y ago
  I think there’s an enormous skill gap. Not the dumb hookup artist skill tree, but the basic social skills and empathy one.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
willcipriano 4y ago
Mens value in the dating marketplace goes up over time. If you are relatively sane, sober and employed around 28, mother nature helps you out with her biological alarm clock. Keep your head up, it's going to get easier from here on out.
- IE6 4y ago
  To be honest this reply smells like "man-o-sphere" logic... PSA: To anyone struggling with this please try and ignore any advice online that focuses on the opposite sex and their inherent value (or lack thereof). Actually talking to the opposite sex even in a casual way is a really good way to get over this type of thinking.
  - anon291 4y ago
    I'm not part of the 'man-o-sphere' (got married at 22, so no time for 'dating'), but I'm not sure what exactly you're saying. No one marries another for 'inherent value' You marry for looks, money, reproductive capacity, etc. By its nature monogamy means looking for more than the inherent value, because if we just considered inherent value, all prospects would be equal, and clearly they are not.
    - IE6 4y ago
      I don't know OP nor do I know their intent with their comment but taking it at face value the idea that men's value will gradually increase so long as they are successful and by inference women's value will either stagnate or decline and eventually women will have no choice but to give a man his chance is at best man-o-sphere adjacent ideology. Perhaps it's just a mixing of words and that was not the intent of the OP. I don't think we're talking about the same concept though. You're touching on preferences and in general attraction which is just a normal part of being and doesn't represent some kind of value system where you have high-value and low-value people.
  - Johanx64 4y ago
    Eh, instead of poking holes in so called "man-o-sphere" logic, you just reject it outright as a matter of principle. Why would anyone reject logic, especially if it makes sense? Unfortunately, this kind of logic and thinking has already entered mainstream internet consciousness via memes and such, and the only way to address it is to face it head on. And if you can't then what does it mean?
delecti 4y ago
Assuming there aren't any "deal-breakers" about you (mainly that you're not a jerk in some way), I agree you don't have anything to worry about. I was in a similar situation at 21, and am now very happily married at 35. As for any potential "skill gap", I'm just as socially awkward as I was at 21, but my wife doesn't mind. I think conscientious people can usually recognize attempts at conscientiousness.
- curiousllama 4y ago
  > I think conscientious people can usually recognize attempts at conscientiousness FWIW, most of conscientiousness is the intent anyway
aquadoggy 4y ago
- lolinder 4y ago
  I'm happily married with a great sex life, and neither of us had any sexual relationships before our marriage. I know that sounds quaint and antiquated on this forum, but some traditions really do exist for a reason. :-) Point being: It's not a foregone conclusion that your future wife is having sex right now. There are still people out there who wait.
  - aquadoggy 4y ago
    Yes, I am completely onboard with this tradition. I think of it as the 'tape' analogy. If you stick tape many times, each subsequent stick is less firm. Same with relationships. You bring increasing amounts of baggage, all of your "firsts" have already been done, and you have a loose bond to your partner.
    - lolinder 4y ago
      Agreed! And I think you'll find that with girls who have similar values your perspective will be a huge selling point. They're out there, and they're the ones that you'll be most happy with anyway. Hang in there!
    - otterley 4y ago
      This is a bullshit theory with zero evidence or science behind it. I’m on my second marriage now, am about as far from a virgin as the earth is from the sun, and I’m as happy as can be and utterly devoted to and blissfully in love with my wife. Listen, I know you’re probably having difficulty finding a romantic relationship and I know how demoralizing and depressing that can be. I’ve been there - my teens and twenties were just awful for my self-esteem. But it can, and usually does, get better, as your hormones settle down and you learn to make friends with prospective romantic partners and can take the time to form a strong bond. The world is a big place and I believe there is someone for everyone, although that “someone” can be difficult to find. If I were to give you one piece of advice, it would be for you to figure out what the best part of you is, and to feel great about that. Having a sense of confidence in something you are or do is infectious and is very attractive to people, and can lead to great success down the line. And last, but not least, don’t settle! Just because someone is attracted to you doesn’t mean they’re right for you. I’ve made that mistake with disastrous consequences. As a late bloomer I only really came to terms with that in my early 40s. Good luck!
tarboreus 4y ago
You should go on a date, just for kicks. Buck the trend.
baskethead 4y ago
Why? Are you afraid of rejection? Do you have problem making relationships with people you want to date?
stjohnswarts 4y ago
THose skills will never come if you don't put yourself out there. It doesn't have to be a dating/hookup app like bumble/tender/etc just go to the library, get a dog and go to the park (how I met my wife), take dance lessons. It'll take a while but will happen. I was in a similar boat to you. Be honest with yourself. Shyness isn't necessarily a turn off to women (or any gender), nor is being rotund. However, if you have bad hygiene or stare at boobs a lot, break those habits.
globular-toast 4y ago
Don't worry about it. The social skills take a few months to pick up. The physical aspect of sex takes a few weeks, if that. It's not difficult. The only advice I would give to you is don't satisfy your urges with porn in the meantime. Stay far, far away.

ip26 4y ago

The thought of finding the one I want while still lacking the skills to make it work (& losing them) drove me to find many dates simply for the learning experience- which lowered the stakes of a date & helped me relax.

_fat_santa 4y ago

FWIW I was very bad at getting dates when I was your age. It's really a skill you develop, the more you do it the better you will get. From age 20-25 I think I went on maybe 7 dates. So far this year I've gone on >20

Noelkd 4y ago
20 dates with 20 different people?
- marcyb5st 4y ago
  I don't see the number as that high. I'm at around 10 different people and considering I stopped around 2 months ago because I found one interesting enough that we decided to be mutually exclusive going forward. I use dating apps or met a couple of them at the bouldering gym where I boulder.
  - GameOfFrowns 4y ago
    >met a couple of them at the bouldering gym where I boulder. That's why I stopped going to the local boulder gyms. Too many cookie-cutter "non-conformist dudes" who see the gym as their personal hunting grounds, creeping on the girls like a sleazy tennis instructor and bullying beginner guys because they don't like the competition.
PheonixPharts 4y ago
To each their own of course, but this seems like a, slightly humorous, example of Goodhart's Law. Most people I know dating aren't trying to optimize for the number of dates they go one with different people but ideally trying to find that one person they can be with for awhile. So the common definition of "getting better at dates" implies you eventually date less. I have a few friends in their mid-30s that have become quite the experts at getting dates, but all of them seem fairly unhappy that they are still working on dating rather than in a steady relationship and focusing on other things.

necessary 4y ago

Honestly there's not much to worry about a "skill-gap" either. It's cliche but being the true and authentic version of yourself (and being self-aware if you need to make improvements on that version of yourself - your authentic self can't be a jerk) is the best way to make both friends and romantic partners. Maybe it's different for hookups, but IMHO romantic relationships don't work like they do in the movies.

annyeonghada 4y ago
>and being self-aware if you need to make improvements on that version of yourself - your authentic self can't be a jerk So, you need to be yourself... but you actually don't.
- kbelder 4y ago
  No, you need to be yourself, and recognize that sometimes you need to make yourself better. Not lie about being better, but actually get better.
LeanderK 4y ago
I think the skill-gap is not really in being in a romantic relationship but getting one. The skills of being in a successful relationship are similar to the skills of having close friends imo, just more intense. You need to handle conflicts and keep the relationship going. But relationships usually don't last forever, they tend to end. The skill to develop a romantic relationship, from start to finish, is quite important and hard to learn. I think this is where a lot of the skill-gap is located.
oneoff786 4y ago
I think there’s an enormous skill gap. Not the dumb hookup artist skill tree, but the basic social skills and empathy one.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

willcipriano 4y ago

Mens value in the dating marketplace goes up over time. If you are relatively sane, sober and employed around 28, mother nature helps you out with her biological alarm clock. Keep your head up, it's going to get easier from here on out.

IE6 4y ago
To be honest this reply smells like "man-o-sphere" logic... PSA: To anyone struggling with this please try and ignore any advice online that focuses on the opposite sex and their inherent value (or lack thereof). Actually talking to the opposite sex even in a casual way is a really good way to get over this type of thinking.
- anon291 4y ago
  I'm not part of the 'man-o-sphere' (got married at 22, so no time for 'dating'), but I'm not sure what exactly you're saying. No one marries another for 'inherent value' You marry for looks, money, reproductive capacity, etc. By its nature monogamy means looking for more than the inherent value, because if we just considered inherent value, all prospects would be equal, and clearly they are not.
  - IE6 4y ago
    I don't know OP nor do I know their intent with their comment but taking it at face value the idea that men's value will gradually increase so long as they are successful and by inference women's value will either stagnate or decline and eventually women will have no choice but to give a man his chance is at best man-o-sphere adjacent ideology. Perhaps it's just a mixing of words and that was not the intent of the OP. I don't think we're talking about the same concept though. You're touching on preferences and in general attraction which is just a normal part of being and doesn't represent some kind of value system where you have high-value and low-value people.
- Johanx64 4y ago
  Eh, instead of poking holes in so called "man-o-sphere" logic, you just reject it outright as a matter of principle. Why would anyone reject logic, especially if it makes sense? Unfortunately, this kind of logic and thinking has already entered mainstream internet consciousness via memes and such, and the only way to address it is to face it head on. And if you can't then what does it mean?

delecti 4y ago

Assuming there aren't any "deal-breakers" about you (mainly that you're not a jerk in some way), I agree you don't have anything to worry about. I was in a similar situation at 21, and am now very happily married at 35. As for any potential "skill gap", I'm just as socially awkward as I was at 21, but my wife doesn't mind. I think conscientious people can usually recognize attempts at conscientiousness.

curiousllama 4y ago
> I think conscientious people can usually recognize attempts at conscientiousness FWIW, most of conscientiousness is the intent anyway

aquadoggy 4y ago

lolinder 4y ago
I'm happily married with a great sex life, and neither of us had any sexual relationships before our marriage. I know that sounds quaint and antiquated on this forum, but some traditions really do exist for a reason. :-) Point being: It's not a foregone conclusion that your future wife is having sex right now. There are still people out there who wait.
- aquadoggy 4y ago
  Yes, I am completely onboard with this tradition. I think of it as the 'tape' analogy. If you stick tape many times, each subsequent stick is less firm. Same with relationships. You bring increasing amounts of baggage, all of your "firsts" have already been done, and you have a loose bond to your partner.
  - lolinder 4y ago
    Agreed! And I think you'll find that with girls who have similar values your perspective will be a huge selling point. They're out there, and they're the ones that you'll be most happy with anyway. Hang in there!
  - otterley 4y ago
    This is a bullshit theory with zero evidence or science behind it. I’m on my second marriage now, am about as far from a virgin as the earth is from the sun, and I’m as happy as can be and utterly devoted to and blissfully in love with my wife. Listen, I know you’re probably having difficulty finding a romantic relationship and I know how demoralizing and depressing that can be. I’ve been there - my teens and twenties were just awful for my self-esteem. But it can, and usually does, get better, as your hormones settle down and you learn to make friends with prospective romantic partners and can take the time to form a strong bond. The world is a big place and I believe there is someone for everyone, although that “someone” can be difficult to find. If I were to give you one piece of advice, it would be for you to figure out what the best part of you is, and to feel great about that. Having a sense of confidence in something you are or do is infectious and is very attractive to people, and can lead to great success down the line. And last, but not least, don’t settle! Just because someone is attracted to you doesn’t mean they’re right for you. I’ve made that mistake with disastrous consequences. As a late bloomer I only really came to terms with that in my early 40s. Good luck!

tarboreus 4y ago

You should go on a date, just for kicks. Buck the trend.

baskethead 4y ago

Why? Are you afraid of rejection? Do you have problem making relationships with people you want to date?

stjohnswarts 4y ago

THose skills will never come if you don't put yourself out there. It doesn't have to be a dating/hookup app like bumble/tender/etc just go to the library, get a dog and go to the park (how I met my wife), take dance lessons. It'll take a while but will happen. I was in a similar boat to you. Be honest with yourself. Shyness isn't necessarily a turn off to women (or any gender), nor is being rotund. However, if you have bad hygiene or stare at boobs a lot, break those habits.

globular-toast 4y ago

Don't worry about it. The social skills take a few months to pick up. The physical aspect of sex takes a few weeks, if that. It's not difficult. The only advice I would give to you is don't satisfy your urges with porn in the meantime. Stay far, far away.