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> Just don't ever give it the wifi password This works for now but Amazon is already working on a way to share messages from devices through echo dots etc in t

> Just don't ever give it the wifi password This works for now but Amazon is already working on a way to share messages from devices through echo dots etc in the area. Even your neighbors'. It's intended precisely for this purpose :( To capture days from those trying to stay under the radar. It's called sidewalk.

Scoundreller 4y ago
I wouldn’t be surprised if the next iteration of TVs will take ads over a data signal over OTA deals with TV stations and display localized ads in programming and in their apps.
- GekkePrutser 4y ago
  It's possible but it would be one way in most locations. But yeah I'm sure it'll be possible. I have it on my list to look for ways to block Amazon sidewalk by the way. Personally I don't even have cable TV. I never watch live TV anymore. I get all my news from the web (I never liked watching TV for it) and shows I just download or stream.
- vineyardmike 4y ago
  > take ads over a data signal over OTA deals with TV stations Isn't that just regular OTA linear tv? But really, I'm not sure how legal it would be for the stations to mess with what they use that band for and what is distributed.
barrysteve 4y ago
It's going to come to hardware hacks and Faraday caging our houses to maintain personal control over the devices we purchase. Houses will have to behave like firewalls and you whitelist the device types you want to communicate with by explicitly piping them in, rather than the poor attempt at managing networks in software we have at the moment.
- lsaferite 4y ago
  Honestly, a Faraday caged house doesn't sound like a bad idea. Sure, you'll have to install a solution for mobile phone coverage (assuming you want it), but it would help solve a lot of issues like congestion and unwanted parties attacking to your wifi. Even if it's not a perfect cage, if it damped the majority of wireless signals it would probably be enough.
bradknowles 4y ago
They're going to get more aggressive about putting LTE/5G SIMs into the devices, maybe as eSIMs. That will make it a lot harder to disable their remote monitoring functions.
- monkeybutton 4y ago
  As a Canadian, I'm wondering what would happen if I popped across the border and bought a TV in the US. Would it still connect? Are they paying roaming charges or do they have a plan that covers all of NA?
  - walrus01 4y ago
    All the Vancouver Canadians buying stuff at the Bellingham Costco may be the first to find out.
  - ornornor 4y ago
    IoT type data plans are not super expensive and they can include roaming. I’d expect manufacturers to split it by continents so their NA model has roaming in Can, US, Mex. And their EU model has roaming all over the EU because otherwise it’s a stocking nightmare if you can only sell one device in one country.
- walrus01 4y ago
  the equipment will be glued shut too, so if you want to remove the antenna you'll have to take a dremel to the back of the casing and cut out a rectangle in a specific spot so you can snip the small 50 ohm coax going to the LTE antenna too... it'll happen.
  - bradknowles 4y ago
    We will have to depend on iFixit to tell us what components are where on the motherboard so that we can adequately disable them.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
anothernewdude 4y ago
If it ever connects, then return it. It stopped working.
indrora 4y ago
That's a gross misunderstanding of Sidewalk. If you read the paper, the goal of Sidewalk is to handle "how do I unlock my smart door" when your power/internet has gone sideways. It's intended for super low bandwidth "please pass this note to this device" type situations.
- walrus01 4y ago
  thinking that amazon and its partners won't inevitably abuse having a backdoor network path for low data rate/telemetry in and out of consumer electronics without your consent (possibly feeding off a neighbor's sidewalk-enabled AP or similar) is a very naive view.
- GekkePrutser 4y ago
  The paper is written by Amazon. Of course they're going to present it as a benefit to the end user. But I'm personally sure that "keeping visibility on a device the user doesn't want to be connected" is also a goal. I could be wrong but Amazon is just as focused on data collection everywhere as Google. Perhaps Amazon simply doesn't understand some of us want all our devices to not be connected to their hive all the time. But I'm sure the reason they want this is for their benefit, not ours.
vineyardmike 4y ago
> It's intended precisely for this purpose Its literally not. Sidewalk is based off LoRa, which has serious bandwidth and duty cycle constraints. Its effectively limited to sub-dialup speeds, which will heavily limit its ability to get OTAs over it, never mind download 4k video ads. It probably could be used for very limited telemetry, however.
- GekkePrutser 4y ago
  Not ads no, but for tracking consumers it would be more than sufficient. What channel are you watching at what time? That data is extremely valuable.

Scoundreller 4y ago

I wouldn’t be surprised if the next iteration of TVs will take ads over a data signal over OTA deals with TV stations and display localized ads in programming and in their apps.

GekkePrutser 4y ago
It's possible but it would be one way in most locations. But yeah I'm sure it'll be possible. I have it on my list to look for ways to block Amazon sidewalk by the way. Personally I don't even have cable TV. I never watch live TV anymore. I get all my news from the web (I never liked watching TV for it) and shows I just download or stream.
vineyardmike 4y ago
> take ads over a data signal over OTA deals with TV stations Isn't that just regular OTA linear tv? But really, I'm not sure how legal it would be for the stations to mess with what they use that band for and what is distributed.

barrysteve 4y ago

It's going to come to hardware hacks and Faraday caging our houses to maintain personal control over the devices we purchase. Houses will have to behave like firewalls and you whitelist the device types you want to communicate with by explicitly piping them in, rather than the poor attempt at managing networks in software we have at the moment.

lsaferite 4y ago
Honestly, a Faraday caged house doesn't sound like a bad idea. Sure, you'll have to install a solution for mobile phone coverage (assuming you want it), but it would help solve a lot of issues like congestion and unwanted parties attacking to your wifi. Even if it's not a perfect cage, if it damped the majority of wireless signals it would probably be enough.

bradknowles 4y ago

They're going to get more aggressive about putting LTE/5G SIMs into the devices, maybe as eSIMs. That will make it a lot harder to disable their remote monitoring functions.

monkeybutton 4y ago
As a Canadian, I'm wondering what would happen if I popped across the border and bought a TV in the US. Would it still connect? Are they paying roaming charges or do they have a plan that covers all of NA?
- walrus01 4y ago
  All the Vancouver Canadians buying stuff at the Bellingham Costco may be the first to find out.
- ornornor 4y ago
  IoT type data plans are not super expensive and they can include roaming. I’d expect manufacturers to split it by continents so their NA model has roaming in Can, US, Mex. And their EU model has roaming all over the EU because otherwise it’s a stocking nightmare if you can only sell one device in one country.
walrus01 4y ago
the equipment will be glued shut too, so if you want to remove the antenna you'll have to take a dremel to the back of the casing and cut out a rectangle in a specific spot so you can snip the small 50 ohm coax going to the LTE antenna too... it'll happen.
- bradknowles 4y ago
  We will have to depend on iFixit to tell us what components are where on the motherboard so that we can adequately disable them.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]

anothernewdude 4y ago

If it ever connects, then return it. It stopped working.

indrora 4y ago

That's a gross misunderstanding of Sidewalk. If you read the paper, the goal of Sidewalk is to handle "how do I unlock my smart door" when your power/internet has gone sideways. It's intended for super low bandwidth "please pass this note to this device" type situations.

walrus01 4y ago
thinking that amazon and its partners won't inevitably abuse having a backdoor network path for low data rate/telemetry in and out of consumer electronics without your consent (possibly feeding off a neighbor's sidewalk-enabled AP or similar) is a very naive view.
GekkePrutser 4y ago
The paper is written by Amazon. Of course they're going to present it as a benefit to the end user. But I'm personally sure that "keeping visibility on a device the user doesn't want to be connected" is also a goal. I could be wrong but Amazon is just as focused on data collection everywhere as Google. Perhaps Amazon simply doesn't understand some of us want all our devices to not be connected to their hive all the time. But I'm sure the reason they want this is for their benefit, not ours.

vineyardmike 4y ago

> It's intended precisely for this purpose Its literally not. Sidewalk is based off LoRa, which has serious bandwidth and duty cycle constraints. Its effectively limited to sub-dialup speeds, which will heavily limit its ability to get OTAs over it, never mind download 4k video ads. It probably could be used for very limited telemetry, however.

GekkePrutser 4y ago
Not ads no, but for tracking consumers it would be more than sufficient. What channel are you watching at what time? That data is extremely valuable.