6 ms·

I dislike this trope of a single person having nothing better to do than work. Single people have responsibilities too and have quality lives. They don't need t

I dislike this trope of a single person having nothing better to do than work. Single people have responsibilities too and have quality lives. They don't need to work themselves to death

sgt 4y ago
Sure, but if the alternative (for you) is to waste time in front of the TV or gaming, it may be a valid point.
- wrren 4y ago
  I wouldn’t consider those things to be a waste of time at all…
- leetrout 4y ago
  Careful there -- relaxing or enjoying something mundane is not wasting time. We have been conditioned to call things like this a waste of time but it doesnt mean it is. Not for everyone. Capitalism would have us believe we must constantly be delivering value that is defined by external standards but that is a dangerous game. 4000 Weeks is a pretty good book with more on this topic.
  - brokenkebab2 4y ago
    Gaming, and watching TV sometimes may not be complete waste of time. But both are addictive, and can easyly make your life miserable.
    - mathgeek 4y ago
      This isn’t really relevant to the current discussion about how much extra time is spent on “work” beyond normal working hours. Working ~40 hours a week and choosing to spend most of your other conscious hours consuming media is a different situation from spending most/all of your hours on the latter.
      - mmmpop 4y ago
        https://i.redd.it/3hn1jb4p3ih41.jpg https://i.redd.it/3hn1jb4p3ih41.jpg
      - brokenkebab2 4y ago
        Not sure I see your point. "Choosing to spend most of your other conscious hours consuming media" is certainly choosing to waste a significant part of one's lifetime. Doing it all the time is wasting most of it, and likely being broke (with exception of rare edge cases). The question we touched in this particular branch: whether extra work constitutes a better alternative to more gaming/media in the absence of other obligations/fields of activity (such as family)
        mathgeek 4y ago
        Please see your comment I was replying to for context on this thread. Addiction is what I was referring to, which is a different issue than whether one is wasting time to any degree. I have no real issue with folks debating on the latter.
  - Aeolun 4y ago
    You are not necessarily producing value, you are ensuring you are capable of producing value in the future.
  - tjs8rj 4y ago
    “Capitalism would have us believe that…” if you were lazy in a hunter gatherer tribe they’d just no give you food, otherwise punish, or exile you. Some things are more fundamental than capitalism
rtpg 4y ago
I think it’s not that single people have nothing better to do. It’s that you would need to be single and have basically no life to do this kind of 70h work week (or be prepared to end up single, cuz you sure won’t be tending to your relationships/responsibilities )
- wruza 4y ago
  As a consciously single I disagree along the lines of this argument (not with the argument itself). You’re seeing lost relationships as something destructive, and sure it is, but also disregard what others do as something that you can get rid of without any harm (“no life anyway”). I like my life, who’s anyone to judge what is important in it or not. Our world-wide society has this trope. “Hey, these people have kids(!), and these are in relationships, etc etc. And you are single nolifer, your rights and opportunities can wait”. As if a kid or a partner were some kind of a universal voucher.
  - RHSeeger 4y ago
    It seems like you're reading the argument incorrectly. The argument being made is > If you have a family, then there's no way you have time for 70hr weeks The argument is _not_ > If you do not have a family, then you _do_ have time for 70hr weeks
  - nend 4y ago
    Seems like you're projecting a bit. I didn't see the person your responding to make any judgement about a life with a partner/kids vs one without.
    - wruza 4y ago
      You’re right on projection, and I shouldn’t have written “you” and “disregard” in the same sentence. I meant some part of normal-life folks, addressing them via that line. My mistake, sorry all for confusion.
  - rtpg 4y ago
    I’m not judging people who are single w/o kids. just saying if you’re in a relationship or have kids that is a commitment and time needs to be spent on there. I don’t think you should overwork yourself cuz you don’t have kids. Do what you want with your life.
Kiro 4y ago
And I dislike the trope of working being orthogonal to quality of life. Sitting in front of the computer working on my own thing is the ultimate enjoyment. That's what's giving me a quality life.
- corobo 4y ago
  Yeah there's work (activity) and there's work (job) I love working (activity) -- coding is a hobby I long ago made the mistake of monetising haha. My stuff? I'll spend a weekend chasing a dead end without a second thought. General sort of cog in the machine day to day work? You're paying me to be a bit bored a lot of the time. Not a complaint or anything, just the routine stuff that can't be automated yet. Fun comes from learning new things, money comes from being paid for what you already learned. Of course this is just me, if everyone was like me the world would suck. Absolutely no judgement if you get your fun outside of an IDE! E: bit of context I'm currently single and have no dependents, I would imagine (hope) my priorities would change if that changed
  - kfajdsl 4y ago
    Yep, this so much. Working for somebody else, where I have little stake in the company? I won't just put in the bare minimum to not get fired, but I also won't work absurd hours, especially on a salary. My own stuff? I'm ready for the 40 (job) + 60 (my own projects) work week! For reference, I'm very young and no where close to having a family.
    - ZephyrBlu 4y ago
      > My own stuff? I'm ready for the 40 (job) + 60 (my own projects) work week! Since you said you're very young I assume you're still at school/university and haven't had a tech job yet. This doesn't work. Time is not the biggest factor, energy and focus are. You can only put in 40hrs and be extremely drained. It's very unlikely you're going to be able to perform well at work and then be productive for another 60hrs on personal projects, especially not at your first job when you're learning a very large amount of new stuff. Even just 60hrs of personal projects is probably way too much time relative to energy and focus (Your energy and focus will likely be drained before the 60hr mark).
throwawayacc2 4y ago
It depends on what point in your life you are. I was at one point single and fully committed to work. I worked sometimes even 12 hours per day, every day, pulling in weekends too and I had a payoff for that. I’m single now too, but I’m not doing that. I’m focusing on dating. Different people, at different times have different priorities. It’s not any one individual thing that’s bad, it’s elevating one above the rest.
Aeolun 4y ago
I’m not trying to speak for everyone. I’m saying that I personally can absolutely see myself doing it in these situations. Not trying to imply anything about anyone else.
tshaddox 4y ago
There’s not really a “trope” beyond it being necessary but not sufficient to be able to work 70+ hour weeks.
briandear 4y ago
They don’t have to. They could take a normal job and don’t have to do the extraordinary job of founding a company.
Petersipoi 4y ago
How is that a trope? Everybody here who has kids used to not have kids, and all would agree that before they had kids they had significantly more time to dedicate to non-kid-raising activities. Nobody is saying single people have "nothing better to do". Just that they very often have more flexibility with what they can reasonably choose to do.

I dislike this trope of a single person having nothing better to do than work. Single people have responsibilities too and have quality lives. They don't need to work themselves to death

sgt 4y ago

Sure, but if the alternative (for you) is to waste time in front of the TV or gaming, it may be a valid point.

wrren 4y ago
I wouldn’t consider those things to be a waste of time at all…
leetrout 4y ago
Careful there -- relaxing or enjoying something mundane is not wasting time. We have been conditioned to call things like this a waste of time but it doesnt mean it is. Not for everyone. Capitalism would have us believe we must constantly be delivering value that is defined by external standards but that is a dangerous game. 4000 Weeks is a pretty good book with more on this topic.
- brokenkebab2 4y ago
  Gaming, and watching TV sometimes may not be complete waste of time. But both are addictive, and can easyly make your life miserable.
  - mathgeek 4y ago
    This isn’t really relevant to the current discussion about how much extra time is spent on “work” beyond normal working hours. Working ~40 hours a week and choosing to spend most of your other conscious hours consuming media is a different situation from spending most/all of your hours on the latter.
    - mmmpop 4y ago
      https://i.redd.it/3hn1jb4p3ih41.jpg https://i.redd.it/3hn1jb4p3ih41.jpg
    - brokenkebab2 4y ago
      Not sure I see your point. "Choosing to spend most of your other conscious hours consuming media" is certainly choosing to waste a significant part of one's lifetime. Doing it all the time is wasting most of it, and likely being broke (with exception of rare edge cases). The question we touched in this particular branch: whether extra work constitutes a better alternative to more gaming/media in the absence of other obligations/fields of activity (such as family)
      - mathgeek 4y ago
        Please see your comment I was replying to for context on this thread. Addiction is what I was referring to, which is a different issue than whether one is wasting time to any degree. I have no real issue with folks debating on the latter.
- Aeolun 4y ago
  You are not necessarily producing value, you are ensuring you are capable of producing value in the future.
- tjs8rj 4y ago
  “Capitalism would have us believe that…” if you were lazy in a hunter gatherer tribe they’d just no give you food, otherwise punish, or exile you. Some things are more fundamental than capitalism

rtpg 4y ago

I think it’s not that single people have nothing better to do. It’s that you would need to be single and have basically no life to do this kind of 70h work week (or be prepared to end up single, cuz you sure won’t be tending to your relationships/responsibilities )

wruza 4y ago
As a consciously single I disagree along the lines of this argument (not with the argument itself). You’re seeing lost relationships as something destructive, and sure it is, but also disregard what others do as something that you can get rid of without any harm (“no life anyway”). I like my life, who’s anyone to judge what is important in it or not. Our world-wide society has this trope. “Hey, these people have kids(!), and these are in relationships, etc etc. And you are single nolifer, your rights and opportunities can wait”. As if a kid or a partner were some kind of a universal voucher.
- RHSeeger 4y ago
  It seems like you're reading the argument incorrectly. The argument being made is > If you have a family, then there's no way you have time for 70hr weeks The argument is _not_ > If you do not have a family, then you _do_ have time for 70hr weeks
- nend 4y ago
  Seems like you're projecting a bit. I didn't see the person your responding to make any judgement about a life with a partner/kids vs one without.
  - wruza 4y ago
    You’re right on projection, and I shouldn’t have written “you” and “disregard” in the same sentence. I meant some part of normal-life folks, addressing them via that line. My mistake, sorry all for confusion.
- rtpg 4y ago
  I’m not judging people who are single w/o kids. just saying if you’re in a relationship or have kids that is a commitment and time needs to be spent on there. I don’t think you should overwork yourself cuz you don’t have kids. Do what you want with your life.

Kiro 4y ago

And I dislike the trope of working being orthogonal to quality of life. Sitting in front of the computer working on my own thing is the ultimate enjoyment. That's what's giving me a quality life.

corobo 4y ago
Yeah there's work (activity) and there's work (job) I love working (activity) -- coding is a hobby I long ago made the mistake of monetising haha. My stuff? I'll spend a weekend chasing a dead end without a second thought. General sort of cog in the machine day to day work? You're paying me to be a bit bored a lot of the time. Not a complaint or anything, just the routine stuff that can't be automated yet. Fun comes from learning new things, money comes from being paid for what you already learned. Of course this is just me, if everyone was like me the world would suck. Absolutely no judgement if you get your fun outside of an IDE! E: bit of context I'm currently single and have no dependents, I would imagine (hope) my priorities would change if that changed
- kfajdsl 4y ago
  Yep, this so much. Working for somebody else, where I have little stake in the company? I won't just put in the bare minimum to not get fired, but I also won't work absurd hours, especially on a salary. My own stuff? I'm ready for the 40 (job) + 60 (my own projects) work week! For reference, I'm very young and no where close to having a family.
  - ZephyrBlu 4y ago
    > My own stuff? I'm ready for the 40 (job) + 60 (my own projects) work week! Since you said you're very young I assume you're still at school/university and haven't had a tech job yet. This doesn't work. Time is not the biggest factor, energy and focus are. You can only put in 40hrs and be extremely drained. It's very unlikely you're going to be able to perform well at work and then be productive for another 60hrs on personal projects, especially not at your first job when you're learning a very large amount of new stuff. Even just 60hrs of personal projects is probably way too much time relative to energy and focus (Your energy and focus will likely be drained before the 60hr mark).

throwawayacc2 4y ago

It depends on what point in your life you are. I was at one point single and fully committed to work. I worked sometimes even 12 hours per day, every day, pulling in weekends too and I had a payoff for that. I’m single now too, but I’m not doing that. I’m focusing on dating. Different people, at different times have different priorities. It’s not any one individual thing that’s bad, it’s elevating one above the rest.

Aeolun 4y ago

I’m not trying to speak for everyone. I’m saying that I personally can absolutely see myself doing it in these situations. Not trying to imply anything about anyone else.

tshaddox 4y ago

There’s not really a “trope” beyond it being necessary but not sufficient to be able to work 70+ hour weeks.

briandear 4y ago

They don’t have to. They could take a normal job and don’t have to do the extraordinary job of founding a company.

Petersipoi 4y ago

How is that a trope? Everybody here who has kids used to not have kids, and all would agree that before they had kids they had significantly more time to dedicate to non-kid-raising activities. Nobody is saying single people have "nothing better to do". Just that they very often have more flexibility with what they can reasonably choose to do.