5 ms·

Jesus, I just realized how amazingly clean and dense UIs really can be. Radios, checkboxes, sliders, complexity hiding tabs, help on hover (not shown), error m

Jesus, I just realized how amazingly clean and dense UIs really can be. Radios, checkboxes, sliders, complexity hiding tabs, help on hover (not shown), error messages on invalid inputs, making invalid inputs not representable in general etc. Imagine every cli tool having this kind of mock ui as playground that spits out cmd line command with args - as help tool/whatever as alternative to medium sized book text help.

sprash 4y ago
This is exactly what was done on A/UX (an obscure Apple Unix before NEXT). When you open CLI applications in Finder a GUI like this appears. (examples are here: "http://bitsavers.org/pdf/apple/mac/a_ux/aux_2.0/030-0759-A_AUX_Essentials_1990.pdf http://bitsavers.org/pdf/apple/mac/a_ux/aux_2.0/030-0759-A_A...", "chmod" page 89, "grep" page 152, "ls" page 157, "wc" page 164, ...)
- im_down_w_otp 4y ago
  The Quadra 610 I have running A/UX 3.0 is presently taking umbrage with your calling it obscure, and I don't have the heart to tell it that you're right.
  - gattilorenz 4y ago
    Bring it to its senses by asking on how many non-Quadra Macs A/UX works. Hell, it did not even run on _all_ Quadras... Then give it a pat from me and my 650.
    - im_down_w_otp 4y ago
      Oh, it knows. As it won't even run on my Quadra 840AV. :-)
- astrange 4y ago
  MPW had that in MacOS as well with Commando.
balaji1 4y ago
Posted on HN: https://github.com/chriskiehl/Gooey https://github.com/chriskiehl/Gooey I haven't tried it yet, IIUC it can generate GUIs for some Python CLI tools
puzzlingcaptcha 4y ago
There is a neat python library called Gooey which wraps command line arguments in wxWidgets with just a function decorator. Sadly the development seems to have stopped. https://github.com/chriskiehl/Gooey https://github.com/chriskiehl/Gooey
jvolkman 4y ago
Only somewhat relevant, but Google Cloud does this in their console at least for some products. E.g., go through the UI Kubernetes cluster flow, but instead of clicking the create button at the end, you can click a button to get the equivalent `gcloud` command line. Also works for VMs, VPCs, and others I'm sure.
- dpcx 4y ago
  I really wish AWS had the ability to generate this for any piece of my infrastructure. Either the `aws` command _or_ the relevant CFN script.
- jonathaneunice 4y ago
  First saw this type of "use the nicer UI, get the command line equivalent" in 1989. IBM's homegrown version of Unix, AIX, had a system management tool, SMIT, that majored on this "emit the CLI equivalent" feature.
ngetchell 4y ago
PowerShell has a Show-Command cmdlet that dynamically generates a GUI based on the cmdlet parameters. Quick and dirty GUIs https://ngetchell.com/poor-mans-gui/ https://ngetchell.com/poor-mans-gui/
- aozgaa 4y ago
  Amazing! Does anyone know of a comparable toolkit for quick UI’s (gui or tui) in the linux/bash ecosystem?
  - wheybags 4y ago
    There's zenity, but I think it's not as featureful (I may be wrong there)
    - jhgb 4y ago
      If Zenity is not featureful enough for whatever you're trying to do, there's always Gtk-server (https://www.gtk-server.org/intro.html https://www.gtk-server.org/intro.html) as well.
  - usrn 4y ago
    I'd imagine power shell has some way to pull the available parameters out of cmdlets (they probably all inherit from some cmdlet class or something.) On bash you have to get this from somewhere else.
    - behnamoh 4y ago
      I think it also helps that PowerShell treats everything as objects and can pass them in pipes.
      - usrn 4y ago
        If bash had some way to specify that a command is "pure" (doesn't mutate anything) you could do this there (among other nice things.)
idle_zealot 4y ago
> Imagine every cli tool having this kind of mock ui as playground that spits out cmd line command with args Interesting, my thought looking at this is “this is why complex tools work better in a CLI”. Discoverability is a nice ideal, but usage of this program clearly requires a manual due to inherent complexity. Showing all possible options in a window really isn’t helpful at all.
- behnamoh 4y ago
  Sometimes it is tho. Imagine if pilots had to use something akin to CLI instead of numerous buttons, handles, clutches, etc.
- crispyambulance 4y ago
  > Showing all possible options in a window really isn’t helpful at all. Well, then you shouldn't. Almost anything that's mature, evolved and complex can be represented like a nightmare with a bad UI. ffmpeg is the usual extreme example of a bonkers out-of-control parody of itself, yet there are useable UI's that wrap the most essential functionality of ffmpeg by taking some very popular use-cases and making them straightforward. Same thing with git. I think something similar could be done with OpenSSL. Does everyone who works with OpenSSL really keep all that stuff (like in the OP's article) in their head? Maybe some, but the vast majority of folks will just follow a pattern of usage that someone else "pioneered". No one has time for that kind of incidental complexity, not in a CLI, not in a GUI.
jayd16 4y ago
Its not really feasible outside of a mockup without much more work. Non-obviously, I assume this is a hand tuned layout for a fixed width window. Certainly elements are placed in arbitrary spots for aesthetic effect. The layout would look much worse if you changed the text by changing languages or if you tried to resize the window. Its a great mockup but realworld UI is very hard.
cm2187 4y ago
And what you can't communicate with a picture is that the UI should also tell you what options can be taken given the value of the other options (like depending on what kind of certificate you loaded, etc). That's the big think UI are so powerful when managing a machine, they show you the state of the system and tell you what options are available from there.
- Aeolun 4y ago
  Though the terminal doesn’t do that either, so it’s no big loss if the UI doesn’t.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]

sprash 4y ago

This is exactly what was done on A/UX (an obscure Apple Unix before NEXT). When you open CLI applications in Finder a GUI like this appears. (examples are here: "http://bitsavers.org/pdf/apple/mac/a_ux/aux_2.0/030-0759-A_AUX_Essentials_1990.pdf http://bitsavers.org/pdf/apple/mac/a_ux/aux_2.0/030-0759-A_A...", "chmod" page 89, "grep" page 152, "ls" page 157, "wc" page 164, ...)

im_down_w_otp 4y ago
The Quadra 610 I have running A/UX 3.0 is presently taking umbrage with your calling it obscure, and I don't have the heart to tell it that you're right.
- gattilorenz 4y ago
  Bring it to its senses by asking on how many non-Quadra Macs A/UX works. Hell, it did not even run on _all_ Quadras... Then give it a pat from me and my 650.
  - im_down_w_otp 4y ago
    Oh, it knows. As it won't even run on my Quadra 840AV. :-)
astrange 4y ago
MPW had that in MacOS as well with Commando.

balaji1 4y ago

Posted on HN: https://github.com/chriskiehl/Gooey https://github.com/chriskiehl/Gooey I haven't tried it yet, IIUC it can generate GUIs for some Python CLI tools

puzzlingcaptcha 4y ago

There is a neat python library called Gooey which wraps command line arguments in wxWidgets with just a function decorator. Sadly the development seems to have stopped. https://github.com/chriskiehl/Gooey https://github.com/chriskiehl/Gooey

jvolkman 4y ago

Only somewhat relevant, but Google Cloud does this in their console at least for some products. E.g., go through the UI Kubernetes cluster flow, but instead of clicking the create button at the end, you can click a button to get the equivalent `gcloud` command line. Also works for VMs, VPCs, and others I'm sure.

dpcx 4y ago
I really wish AWS had the ability to generate this for any piece of my infrastructure. Either the `aws` command _or_ the relevant CFN script.
jonathaneunice 4y ago
First saw this type of "use the nicer UI, get the command line equivalent" in 1989. IBM's homegrown version of Unix, AIX, had a system management tool, SMIT, that majored on this "emit the CLI equivalent" feature.

ngetchell 4y ago

PowerShell has a Show-Command cmdlet that dynamically generates a GUI based on the cmdlet parameters. Quick and dirty GUIs https://ngetchell.com/poor-mans-gui/ https://ngetchell.com/poor-mans-gui/

aozgaa 4y ago
Amazing! Does anyone know of a comparable toolkit for quick UI’s (gui or tui) in the linux/bash ecosystem?
- wheybags 4y ago
  There's zenity, but I think it's not as featureful (I may be wrong there)
  - jhgb 4y ago
    If Zenity is not featureful enough for whatever you're trying to do, there's always Gtk-server (https://www.gtk-server.org/intro.html https://www.gtk-server.org/intro.html) as well.
- usrn 4y ago
  I'd imagine power shell has some way to pull the available parameters out of cmdlets (they probably all inherit from some cmdlet class or something.) On bash you have to get this from somewhere else.
  - behnamoh 4y ago
    I think it also helps that PowerShell treats everything as objects and can pass them in pipes.
    - usrn 4y ago
      If bash had some way to specify that a command is "pure" (doesn't mutate anything) you could do this there (among other nice things.)

idle_zealot 4y ago

> Imagine every cli tool having this kind of mock ui as playground that spits out cmd line command with args Interesting, my thought looking at this is “this is why complex tools work better in a CLI”. Discoverability is a nice ideal, but usage of this program clearly requires a manual due to inherent complexity. Showing all possible options in a window really isn’t helpful at all.

behnamoh 4y ago
Sometimes it is tho. Imagine if pilots had to use something akin to CLI instead of numerous buttons, handles, clutches, etc.
crispyambulance 4y ago
> Showing all possible options in a window really isn’t helpful at all. Well, then you shouldn't. Almost anything that's mature, evolved and complex can be represented like a nightmare with a bad UI. ffmpeg is the usual extreme example of a bonkers out-of-control parody of itself, yet there are useable UI's that wrap the most essential functionality of ffmpeg by taking some very popular use-cases and making them straightforward. Same thing with git. I think something similar could be done with OpenSSL. Does everyone who works with OpenSSL really keep all that stuff (like in the OP's article) in their head? Maybe some, but the vast majority of folks will just follow a pattern of usage that someone else "pioneered". No one has time for that kind of incidental complexity, not in a CLI, not in a GUI.

jayd16 4y ago

Its not really feasible outside of a mockup without much more work. Non-obviously, I assume this is a hand tuned layout for a fixed width window. Certainly elements are placed in arbitrary spots for aesthetic effect. The layout would look much worse if you changed the text by changing languages or if you tried to resize the window. Its a great mockup but realworld UI is very hard.

cm2187 4y ago

And what you can't communicate with a picture is that the UI should also tell you what options can be taken given the value of the other options (like depending on what kind of certificate you loaded, etc). That's the big think UI are so powerful when managing a machine, they show you the state of the system and tell you what options are available from there.

Aeolun 4y ago
Though the terminal doesn’t do that either, so it’s no big loss if the UI doesn’t.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]