4 ms·

So we don't even start to try? That's not a good enough reason. Given the social and financial magnitude the excuse is nearly criminal.

rscho 4y ago
We do try. But what we've got is not nearly good enough. You underestimate the messiness and overestimate the information retrieval capabilities of healthcare systems.
- chiefalchemist 4y ago
  Oh. I understand the healthcare system's systems are a shitshow. I've seen it first hand. FFS the staff isn't even aware of the importance of sleep (i.e., lights left on, TV left blasting). But. If they can identify the importance of hand sanitation and implement programs to ensure that, then there is hope. But as it is, it feels like the land of "that's how we've always done things." Note: this isn't only hospitals but extended care facilities. They're printing money on the backs of the suffering and losses of others. Do no harm?? Perhaps it once meant something. No much anymore.
nradov 4y ago
It's always disappointing to see comments like this on HN by arrogant, ignorant technologists who haven't done their homework and fail to understand the complexities of healthcare delivery. Biology is a lot harder than software or engineering. There are many researchers working in this area but outside of a few limited areas they haven't succeeded in creating models that are useful for assessing the quality of individual practitioners. And that generally wouldn't even be useful since healthcare is a team activity where systems matter more than individuals. We can do somewhat better at measuring quality for larger provider organizations across patient populations. The NCQA HEDIS measures are evidence based and reflect current consensus on best practices. https://www.ncqa.org/hedis/ https://www.ncqa.org/hedis/
- chiefalchemist 4y ago
  To clarify: We're talking about an industry that only (relatively) recently realized ubiquitous hand santizers was a good idea. And then took additional time to motivated / train staff to use them. Let's keep this in mind. Suggesting what is available be tracked isn't ignorance, it's innovation and improvement 101. It's a call to prevent waste and unlock societal value. To suggest otherwise is lazy and insanity. Or perhaps the industry is afraid of something? Fear makes for great excuses.

rscho 4y ago

We do try. But what we've got is not nearly good enough. You underestimate the messiness and overestimate the information retrieval capabilities of healthcare systems.

chiefalchemist 4y ago
Oh. I understand the healthcare system's systems are a shitshow. I've seen it first hand. FFS the staff isn't even aware of the importance of sleep (i.e., lights left on, TV left blasting). But. If they can identify the importance of hand sanitation and implement programs to ensure that, then there is hope. But as it is, it feels like the land of "that's how we've always done things." Note: this isn't only hospitals but extended care facilities. They're printing money on the backs of the suffering and losses of others. Do no harm?? Perhaps it once meant something. No much anymore.

nradov 4y ago

It's always disappointing to see comments like this on HN by arrogant, ignorant technologists who haven't done their homework and fail to understand the complexities of healthcare delivery. Biology is a lot harder than software or engineering. There are many researchers working in this area but outside of a few limited areas they haven't succeeded in creating models that are useful for assessing the quality of individual practitioners. And that generally wouldn't even be useful since healthcare is a team activity where systems matter more than individuals. We can do somewhat better at measuring quality for larger provider organizations across patient populations. The NCQA HEDIS measures are evidence based and reflect current consensus on best practices. https://www.ncqa.org/hedis/ https://www.ncqa.org/hedis/

chiefalchemist 4y ago
To clarify: We're talking about an industry that only (relatively) recently realized ubiquitous hand santizers was a good idea. And then took additional time to motivated / train staff to use them. Let's keep this in mind. Suggesting what is available be tracked isn't ignorance, it's innovation and improvement 101. It's a call to prevent waste and unlock societal value. To suggest otherwise is lazy and insanity. Or perhaps the industry is afraid of something? Fear makes for great excuses.