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It's very strange. Some items have a glut of inventory, others are very difficult to find. Weird substitutions are taking place in some cases, like the GE light
by ilamont 4y ago
It's very strange. Some items have a glut of inventory, others are very difficult to find. Weird substitutions are taking place in some cases, like the GE light bulbs from Mexico a friend spotted at a local retailer in Boston.
Prices seem higher regardless, which ties into higher fuel and labor costs.
- NonNefarious 4y agoOr the oligopolies that are allowed to operate unfettered in the USA.
- BbzzbB 4y agoI doubt the lightbulb cartel is still a thing. While oligopolies and monopolies exist, it's not the answer to every inflating article.
- tablespoon 4y ago>> Or the oligopolies that are allowed to operate unfettered in the USA. > I doubt the lightbulb cartel is still a thing. While oligopolies and monopolies exist, it's not the answer to every inflating article. An oligopoly doesn't have to also be a cartel, it just has to have few competitors. I think the GP is complaining about how the US as pretty much allowed any market consolidation short of outright monopoly for a long time, which means a lot of companies have too little competition and therefore too much market power.
- BbzzbB 4y agoIs an oligopoly that isn't a cartel problematic? If the lightbulb manufacturers jack up their prices, how long can that last until new incumbents come around and compete margins away? You know what people hate more than oligopolies? High prices. Consolidation is not de facto problematic. Unless said consolidation leads to cartel-like behavior or entrenching regulations (which even Adam Smith recognized as a problem and a propensity of elites, I'm not arguing in favor of laissez-faire capitalism), margins will be cyclical in a free market and colluding oligopolies will eventually face new incumbents, because high margins attracts competition and investments. There are exceptions like markets where cost is prohibitive for new participants, say telecom (hello Rogers-Bell-Telus), but I don't see how that applies to lightbulbs in the 21st century.
- minsc_and_boo 4y agoWell that shouldn't come at a surprise since U.S. antitrust law is aimed at protecting consumer interests, not protecting competition.
- tablespoon 4y ago> Well that shouldn't come at a surprise since U.S. antitrust law is aimed at protecting consumer interests, not protecting competition. And a lot of people are now questioning the wisdom and effectiveness of that approach. Also a, "that shouldn't come [as] a surprise" response doesn't really address anything in this subthread. I don't think anyone is surprised that was the approach that was taken or its result, they just disagree with it.
- deleted 4y ago[deleted]
- minsc_and_boo 4y ago> I don't think anyone is surprised that was the approach that was taken or its result, they just disagree with it. You mean you disagree with it, despite there being many markets where less competition doesn't hurt or even benefits the consumer. Also, addressing the tone or being grammar nazi doesn't add much to discussion.
- tablespoon 4y agoI'll put this as simply as possible: you didn't understand what I wrote, but chose to respond anyway.
- minsc_and_boo 4y agoA 'you didn't understand what I wrote' response doesn't really address anything in this subthread.
- midislack 4y agoOf course it’s still a thing. Why wouldn’t it be?
- BbzzbB 4y agoBecause manufacturing lightbulbs today is a well established process and basically any manufacturer can produce them if they so chose, as opposed to 1925's situation. It also quite empirically is no longer a thing as LED bulbs can last up to 100k hours [1] and are often rated for 50k [2], as opposed to the cartel's 1k [3]. 1: https://www.inlineelectric.com/lifespan https://www.inlineelectric.com/lifespan 2: https://www.bulbs.com/learning/ledfaq.aspx https://www.bulbs.com/learning/ledfaq.aspx 2: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phoebus_cartel https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phoebus_cartel
- coliveira 4y agoYou don't seem to understand how modern markets work. See for example Coca-cola. Anyone can create a drink that looks like Coca-cola. However, we know it has a near monopoly on that segment of the market. Just because a product can be manufactured, doesn't mean that companies have the capacity to create and produce it at the scale needed to become profitable.
- BbzzbB 4y agoThat's a separate subject to anti-competitive oligopolies. Let me doubt people are loyal to lightbulb manufacturers and that the situation is remotely comparable to one of the most powerful and well established consumer brands in history. But since you brought up this subject, why should I care consumer brands are exercising their pricing power for as long as I have access to the low-margin alternatives? People paying $5 for takeout coffee at Starbucks doesn't affect me in any way. It would affect me if Coke and Starbucks prohibited the existence of competitors or extinguished them, but that isn't the case (for these examples at least, such anti-competitive behaviors do exist) as you have yourself implicitly noted in your comment.
- 4y ago
- NonNefarious 4y agoI didn't say it was. But the four meat producers raking in 40% higher profits while whining about a labor shortage should be top of the docket for any politician claiming to want to "do something" about inflation. Isn't the baby-formula fiasco yet another wake-up call? While we're at it, let's stop burning our food. Growing (and subsidizing) corn for fuel is asinine.
- ffggvv 4y agosocialists in 2019: "evil oligoplies are driving down prices unfairly meaning local businesses cant compete and are forced to close" socialists in 2022: "evil oligopolies are raising prices unfairly causing inflation" havent found one that could explain why they didnt "collude" to raise prices in 2008-2019. whereas its quite clear what caused the high prices was rather insane govt spending caused by socialist policies.
- donthellbanme 4y ago1. Between 2008-2019 they just didn't realize they could. I have found the years you quote to be high priced. Competition just went done in every sector I depend on. Banks, cell phone companies, cable, energy prices went up without inflation, etc. 2. The minute we started talking about inflation, every company in my life took advantage of it--overnight. 3. I'm with you on the government spending. I understood the money thrown at Covid, but that's done, and the working poor will never see those checks ever again. And I'm no fan of the Infrastructure Bill. 4. If you don't wonder why gasoline prices fluctuate by a dollar hourly at some stations, while making record profits; I don't know what to say. 5. Every large company made record profits during Covid, and we don't know why? They didn't lower prices. Again the $300 extra per week for unemployed people affected by Covid was a one time thing. Companies might get free money as usual, but not the little guys. It was conservatives (Trumpy) that passed first 2 trillion stimulious package. America has just a few badly run "socialist" programs. I think we all have seen our homeless population get bigger each month. Oh yea, federal government programs. Basically (Cal-fresh, and medi-cal)have gone back to make qualifying very hard.
- AnimalMuppet 4y agoYou are spot-on about your criticism of oligopolies as an explanation. But for your theory, you have to explain the absence of inflation from 2008-2019. It's not like government spending was sane during those years...
- willcipriano 4y agoTake a look at the stock market, housing, education and medical from 2008 to 2019 and tell me there wasn't inflation.
- bombcar 4y agoPricing and supply can cause strange results during shortages - if bulbs from China are even a fraction of a penny cheaper in normal times they’ll be picked, but if they’re not available the closest could be mexico or even the US. I’ve noticed the local “free range fancy chicken eggs” have remained $4 since two years ago but the cheap eggs have gone from a Buck (sometimes 50 cents on sale) to almost the same $4.
- cwkoss 4y agoSingle data point: a rural egg seller on the washington peninsula just raised their prices from $4->$5 per dozen because their feed costs recently doubled.
- bombcar 4y agoYep, lots of price changes will happen and apparently random intervals as contracts and prices expire. Some farms will be almost entirely isolated from much of it (if they grow their own feed corn for the chickens it could be a year or two) others will be affected immediately.
- Frost1x 4y ago>I’ve noticed the local “free range fancy chicken eggs” have remained $4 since two years ago but the cheap eggs have gone from a Buck (sometimes 50 cents on sale) to almost the same $4. I noticed this too and stared buying the free range eggs again (used to get these all the time for my ramen eggs). There's definitely a difference but I don't go through enough eggs or cook them in a way that I typically care (no time to prep ramen and therefor nitamgo anymore).
- spaceman_2020 4y agoI don’t think we’re going to a regime of low prices and suppressed wages. That phase of the world’s economic cycle is on its last legs. Demographics are collapsing across the world and the most prosperous, numerically largest baby boomer generation are entering their non-productive, fiscally conservative retirement years. This just might be the “new normal”. The lack of readily available products might be a problem, but there’s also a good chance we see much higher wages across the board
- BirAdam 4y agoWell, all of that is true. There’s also the printing of many trillions of dollars to raise all prices on all things.
- willcipriano 4y agoNot if the fed has anything to say about it. The plan now is to let it crash since hourly workers have gotten uppity and are refusing to work terrible jobs for even worse pay. All the talk of "wage price spiral" and all that shows their hand.
- zaptheimpaler 4y agoIts incredible to me how more people don't revolt just watching Powell talk. He flat out does not acknowledge the possibility that wages should rise due to increased productivity. Any wage increase is just a sign of inflation.
- coliveira 4y agoThe whole goal of the Fed is to keep salaries down. The reason is that inflation is measured only on household items that can be bought by low income families. You don't see the Fed worrying about inflation in housing, in stocks, and investments in general. That inflation they consider to be good.
- FredPret 4y agoActually there are more millenials than baby boomers. If we see significant wage increases and Real Estate decreases, the millenial generation might start to procreate to a reasonable extent.
- at-fates-hands 4y agoTarget just announced they're going to start reducing prices on a lot of their inventory and signaled their profits are going to drop for this year. Target Corp. will cut prices, cancel orders and take other steps to cut its bloated inventory, moves that will lower its profit in the current quarter more than executives thought just three weeks ago. Demand softened for home products, like furniture, that were popular during the height of the pandemic. In addition to presenting a financial cost, a lot of those items are bulky and take up considerable space in stores and warehouses. "We got more of that product than we want to have, and we think dealing with that head-on by being aggressive now positions us with the right flexibility for the back half of the year," he said. But it will come at a cost. . While its excess inventory will be marked down, Target may see its overall price level rise this summer as it grapples with transportation and other costs that are being affected by inflation. "Price is the last lever that we pull. … But price increases are unavoidable given the inflationary pressures that we've seen in many categories," Fiddelke said. https://www.startribune.com/target-will-slash-prices-to-get-rid-of-inventory-warns-profit-will-shrink-this-summer/600179915/ https://www.startribune.com/target-will-slash-prices-to-get-...
- tootie 4y agoWell, silver lining is that seems like a really strong signal that we're heading towards disinflation.
- AnimalMuppet 4y agoNo, it's a signal that we're heading for lower demand, at least partly because of inflation.
- jeromegv 4y agoThe point is this might stop inflation in its track.
- somenameforme 4y agoI am not saying that this is the scenario but it's worth considering that the start of economic collapse from inflation tends to happen when companies have products to sell, but they can't afford to sell them for prices that people can afford to pay. This does not end inflation, but tends to exasperate it. The company goes out of business and you now have fewer things in the economy, but the same amount of money. The result is further inflation.
- rootsudo 4y agoMexico makes sense, there's NAFTA, just pay transport, tariffs/customs are waived. Not really weird, take a look at cars and manufacturing and it's been that way for the over the past two decades.
- TedDoesntTalk 4y agoI thought Trump got rid of NAFTA?
- jacobolus 4y agoThere were some slight changes in a few areas but it’s essentially the same. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States–Mexico–Canada_Agreement https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States–Mexico–Canada_Ag... What Trump sank was the US joining the Trans Pacific Partnership.
- minsc_and_boo 4y agoNo, he 're-negotiated' NAFTA as the United States-Mexico-Canada Agreement, or USMCA. There weren't that many changes, but he did implement the TPP's intellectual property rules.
- reaperducer 4y agoWeird substitutions are taking place in some cases, like the GE light bulbs from Mexico a friend spotted at a local retailer in Boston. People in border states have seen this since the start of the pandemic. I remember the first time that the only toilet paper available in Kroger was all Mexican brands. I suspect that Mexican companies can make more money shipping goods to the U.S. than selling them locally. I also wonder if the demand from the north had made shortages in Mexico worse.
- denimnerd42 4y agoThe GE light bulbs I find in big box stores are GE as a licensed brand name. They are made all over by someone licensing the name.