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Yup, the point of the “scientific method” is that it works regardless of petty personal politics, so long as empirical evidence remains the standard. To some e

Yup, the point of the “scientific method” is that it works regardless of petty personal politics, so long as empirical evidence remains the standard. To some extent it depends on the weakness of humans for status and competition, because they are powerful motivators to drive advances.

timr 4y ago
Science continues to work, but the work of being a "scientist" really sucks because of this stuff. I personally left science because I could see it had 98% overlap with what I'd do as an engineer (or entrepreneur, in the case of a PI), with a tiny fraction of the monetary benefit. Being a winner in that system is a great life, but it rests upon a huge pyramid of people who are working their butts off at low pay and lower prestige, for a brass ring that few will ever grasp.
- cycomanic 4y ago
  I agree with you. Being a scientist has become worse (although I would argue that is true for many other jobs as well). A PI nowadays really works like the leader of a small startup constantly looking for money to keep the ship afloat without the prospect of a big payout at the end.
  - timr 4y ago
    > A PI nowadays really works like the leader of a small startup constantly looking for money to keep the ship afloat without the prospect of a big payout at the end. I said exactly the same thing when I first left academia for tech, and people would look at me suspiciously and ask why I'd ever do such a thing. I looked at every PI I knew, and saw a task essentially identical to running a startup, but with no financial upside -- and the downside risk of being jobless and adrift if you don't get tenure.
  - Fomite 4y ago
    This. I am a PI. What I spent my day doing was dealing with managerial tasks, fiddly stuff for funding applications, etc. I got to actually code for a whole day last week, and it was marvelous. It was also only possible because it was an all-hands-on-deck, everything else can wait situation.
    - killjoywashere 4y ago
      I spent like 10 total hours writing analytical code in 2020; maybe another 100 hours of analytic design. The rest was meetings, politics, coordination. I got a national award and millions in funding. I would trade it for more time playing with the puzzles. Do I feel good that my people got published and covered rent, hit major life goals (marriages, home purchases)? Yes. But, man, do I wish I got to do more science…

timr 4y ago

Science continues to work, but the work of being a "scientist" really sucks because of this stuff. I personally left science because I could see it had 98% overlap with what I'd do as an engineer (or entrepreneur, in the case of a PI), with a tiny fraction of the monetary benefit. Being a winner in that system is a great life, but it rests upon a huge pyramid of people who are working their butts off at low pay and lower prestige, for a brass ring that few will ever grasp.

cycomanic 4y ago
I agree with you. Being a scientist has become worse (although I would argue that is true for many other jobs as well). A PI nowadays really works like the leader of a small startup constantly looking for money to keep the ship afloat without the prospect of a big payout at the end.
- timr 4y ago
  > A PI nowadays really works like the leader of a small startup constantly looking for money to keep the ship afloat without the prospect of a big payout at the end. I said exactly the same thing when I first left academia for tech, and people would look at me suspiciously and ask why I'd ever do such a thing. I looked at every PI I knew, and saw a task essentially identical to running a startup, but with no financial upside -- and the downside risk of being jobless and adrift if you don't get tenure.
- Fomite 4y ago
  This. I am a PI. What I spent my day doing was dealing with managerial tasks, fiddly stuff for funding applications, etc. I got to actually code for a whole day last week, and it was marvelous. It was also only possible because it was an all-hands-on-deck, everything else can wait situation.
  - killjoywashere 4y ago
    I spent like 10 total hours writing analytical code in 2020; maybe another 100 hours of analytic design. The rest was meetings, politics, coordination. I got a national award and millions in funding. I would trade it for more time playing with the puzzles. Do I feel good that my people got published and covered rent, hit major life goals (marriages, home purchases)? Yes. But, man, do I wish I got to do more science…