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> The thing that has nagged at you as it has me, is the simple fact that not only was “economics” conjured and molded by and for the interests of the upper eche

> The thing that has nagged at you as it has me, is the simple fact that not only was “economics” conjured and molded by and for the interests of the upper echelon of society, to control the language and thoughts about its terms; but that at the core of it, it’s nothing more than fraud, deception, con artistry. Yeah this true, but I wonder if it's as straightforwardly sinister as that. I'm sure there are a lot of economists, esp in the mid 20th century, who would have liked to turn economics into physics. Some of those ideas are of no real merit after further inspection, but are kept alive by political interests. You do come across a lot of thought pieces by think tanks, which seem to be more political than science. > You are given currency coupons in exchange for your work, and then more of those coupons are just forged than correspond to actual work having been done, thereby defrauding you out of the value of your work, also commonly called theft of service. The problem with that is there are legitimate reasons for printing more coupons, they're just mixed in with less legit reasons. If people want to exchange more, they need more coupons. Otherwise everyone would have to wait for their income to arrive before sending it on, and while they wait some of the opportunities will vanish. A little bit of creation isn't so bad.

flybrand 4y ago
> straightforwardly sinister If the impact is sinister, then debating the motive just extends the duration of the pain experienced. Motives matter at the time of trial - when the action and pain are over. Until then, debating motive is just a distraction from stopping the unjust activity.
ekianjo 4y ago
> f people want to exchange more, they need more coupons. thats a fallacy. nothing prevents you from exchanging more even if you had a fixed number of coupons. you would just have to consider that the value of each coupon becomes more, not less, over time, so you need to use subdivisions of coupons more. Inflation, even at low levels, is ultimately value destruction over time.
- klipt 4y ago
  > the value of each coupon becomes more, not less, over time Deflation has historically been a bad thing every time it's happened.
  - ibeckermayer 4y ago
    Nonsense. Sure, deflationary shocks can be calamitous, like the Great Depression or the GFC. But steady deflation over time is logically the natural and good outcome of improvement over time—as technology advances and we get better at producing things, they should get cheaper, on average. Instead, our savings are buying us LESS over time, so that government can buy votes, fund wars, bail out defense contractors, pharma companies, financial institutions, and other cronies, etc. Inflation via the printing press, which is now just considered by many a normal phenomenon, is actually legalized wealth transfer from the savings of ordinary citizens into the coffers of giant government bureaucracies and the large corporations that feed off them.
    - mrow84 4y ago
      Goods getting cheaper broadly means that supply is going up relative to demand - we call this deflation. If the supply of money goes up relative to demand then we call that inflation. It seems like you are conflating the two categories.
    - simonh 4y ago
      Devaluing in-the-mattress savings is a good thing, hence all the many government schemes to incentivise small scale productive investment. Here in the UK that's through tax free consumer savings accounts like ISAs, but also pensions. Savings that are invested do work in the economy fund businesses, promote economic activity and aid job and wealth creation. Stuffed mattresses are a boat anchor on the economy. Having said that, deflation isn't always the awful spectre of doom it's sometimes made out do be, especially if it's due to technological improvements or increased supply. As the article we're all notionally discussing explains, inflation in a reasonably well managed economy is generally differential and reflects shifts in the structure of the economy.

flybrand 4y ago

> straightforwardly sinister If the impact is sinister, then debating the motive just extends the duration of the pain experienced. Motives matter at the time of trial - when the action and pain are over. Until then, debating motive is just a distraction from stopping the unjust activity.

ekianjo 4y ago

> f people want to exchange more, they need more coupons. thats a fallacy. nothing prevents you from exchanging more even if you had a fixed number of coupons. you would just have to consider that the value of each coupon becomes more, not less, over time, so you need to use subdivisions of coupons more. Inflation, even at low levels, is ultimately value destruction over time.

klipt 4y ago
> the value of each coupon becomes more, not less, over time Deflation has historically been a bad thing every time it's happened.
- ibeckermayer 4y ago
  Nonsense. Sure, deflationary shocks can be calamitous, like the Great Depression or the GFC. But steady deflation over time is logically the natural and good outcome of improvement over time—as technology advances and we get better at producing things, they should get cheaper, on average. Instead, our savings are buying us LESS over time, so that government can buy votes, fund wars, bail out defense contractors, pharma companies, financial institutions, and other cronies, etc. Inflation via the printing press, which is now just considered by many a normal phenomenon, is actually legalized wealth transfer from the savings of ordinary citizens into the coffers of giant government bureaucracies and the large corporations that feed off them.
  - mrow84 4y ago
    Goods getting cheaper broadly means that supply is going up relative to demand - we call this deflation. If the supply of money goes up relative to demand then we call that inflation. It seems like you are conflating the two categories.
  - simonh 4y ago
    Devaluing in-the-mattress savings is a good thing, hence all the many government schemes to incentivise small scale productive investment. Here in the UK that's through tax free consumer savings accounts like ISAs, but also pensions. Savings that are invested do work in the economy fund businesses, promote economic activity and aid job and wealth creation. Stuffed mattresses are a boat anchor on the economy. Having said that, deflation isn't always the awful spectre of doom it's sometimes made out do be, especially if it's due to technological improvements or increased supply. As the article we're all notionally discussing explains, inflation in a reasonably well managed economy is generally differential and reflects shifts in the structure of the economy.