6 ms·

People don't want to believe. I try to explain to my friends why I won't watch anything with children as prominent characters, but they generally don't want to

People don't want to believe. I try to explain to my friends why I won't watch anything with children as prominent characters, but they generally don't want to hear it, because "Stranger Things is so good" or something. Hollywood is the land of depravity and abuse. It's no place for children.

mavhc 4y ago
And Stranger Things isn't good, it's just a mashup of 80s films that are at least twice as old as the actors, no original ideas at all. The problem is more celebrity rather than the filming process. Make it illegal to report any "news", ie gossip, about anyone under 18 for a start.
- belval 4y ago
  Just to push that thought a bit further, it's fine if you don't like stranger things but a mashup of 80s ideas is "original" for more than half the US population (median age is 38 y/o). I'm in my twenties, my parents watched movies in the 80s, and even then they were young. Discounting a TV show because it rips off ideas from things that are 40 years old seems like a harsh stance to take.
  - Gordonjcp 4y ago
    Yeah, maybe watch something original and not totally derived from something else, like the Marvel movies, or Sonic the Hedgehog 2, or Fantastic Beasts...
    - bil7 4y ago
      pretty hard when about 80% of new films these days are a sequel, remake, or tie into an existing universe[1]. Yes, just watch old films you say, but they're not on the front page of netflix and disney+, where the average person goes for entertainment recommendations. [1] https://experimentalhistory.substack.com/p/pop-culture-has-become-an-oligopoly?s=r https://experimentalhistory.substack.com/p/pop-culture-has-b...
      - Der_Einzige 4y ago
        Aren't there only like 7 actual stories? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Seven_Basic_Plots https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Seven_Basic_Plots
        bil7 4y ago
        Doesn't really matter, directors and screenwriters keep finding new implementations of old interfaces that feel fresh and are thoroughly enjoyable. The problem comes when implementations are near identical.
      - Gordonjcp 4y ago
        That was rather the point I was making...
    - kelnos 4y ago
      Arguably everything these days must be derived from something else, at least to some extent. Not sure there are really that many viable story ideas out there, and I wouldn't be surprised if the last several thousand years of stories have covered most of them.
      - Gordonjcp 4y ago
        There are only something like a dozen basic story plots, but for the love of all that is sprocket-holey just stop remaking and remaking and remaking the same film over and over again. Or, if you do, stop whining about pirates stealing your content.
    - tinco 4y ago
      Fantastic Beasts is a great movie. It's an original plot and not a sequel to anything so I don't get why you throw it in with those other movies. With as much bland repetitiveness there is in the average Hollywood movie Fantastic Beasts definitely is the wrong one to rip on.
  - mavhc 4y ago
    It's not that it's ripping off the ideas, it's that that's what it's supposed to be doing. I watched the entire first season waiting for the bit when it got good, nothing happened. If you want to take reference to old films and do something original with them, like Everything Everywhere All At Once, great.
- prox 4y ago
  There are definitely kids who like it and whose parents adopt a healthy attitude towards it as well. I think the problem lies more with the media as you say.
- tinco 4y ago
  Something doesn't have to have original ideas to be good. Stranger Things is specifically great at being unoriginal. The show is brilliantly shot, well paced, engrossing and thrilling and the (child) actors were amazing. Just the 80s feeling it evokes is something I've not and I think the industry has not experienced at that scale in decades. You put it exactly right that it's the celebrity that's the problem. I'm not sure if your proposed solution is it though. Remember what Star Wars "fans" did to those the prequel actors. Those people weren't reading any gossip magazines, they were doing it on forums and gatherings, if it had existed they would do it on Twitter. How could we have protected the kids that played Anakin?
  - mavhc 4y ago
    We don't even need to know their names for starters, we can retroactively edit credits once they become adults now. Fan is short for fanatic after all. Should there be a right to be forgotten for all children by default?
- kzrdude 4y ago
  Now look at all the superhero movies etc. I agree with you, it's just that the whole entertainment industry now is filled with this - unoriginal recycling in high-volume production.
- pjc50 4y ago
  The media coverage of child stars is a large part of the harm, and social media makes this worse.
  - pbhjpbhj 4y ago
    Which media? Is there a sex divide, country divide, some other large scale segmentation ... I can't recall ever seeing anything about child stars when they are/were children but I consume mass-media every day.
    - pjc50 4y ago
      "Tabloid". This kind of thing: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-7194723/Millie-Bobby-Brown-looks-like-beautiful-ballerina-steps-Stranger-Things-premiere.html https://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-7194723/Millie... "Stranger Things' Millie Bobby Brown, 15, opts for an Eighties-inspired prom dress as she joins her fellow teen stars in unveiling much-anticipated third season of the Netflix hit" (somewhat randomly selected, she's the most recent child star that came to mind; the Mail is notorious for various levels of creepiness towards young female stars) Not a great overlap with HN, but this stuff sells newspapers in their millions.
- OJFord 4y ago
  I don't know specifically which 80s films you mean, but there were plenty made in the 80s that rehashed things that came before. Isn't that true of all art, ever?
- watwut 4y ago
  Why would something being mashup for 80s films imply it is not good? Stranger Things are truly fun to watch. That makes it good.
- rbanffy 4y ago
  > it's just a mashup of 80s films That’s precisely what I enjoy about the show. But, then, kids working in such a competitive (and often depraved) environment is a major concern. Directing kids is a huge responsibility many directors shouldn’t be allowed to have.
kzrdude 4y ago
Is it so bad though? Our world has shown capability - still - for improving living conditions. Optimism would say that the child actors of today have a better and fairer shot at a good life than they had 50 (for example) years ago. Now Harry Potter is pretty old already, and outside Hollywood, but those seemed to fare pretty well.
- BarryMilo 4y ago
  These children will never have a chance at a normal life. They have careers, certainly, but they'll never know what it's like to date or even shop for groceries without their celebrity status warping it somehow. Every single facet of their lives is public, forever. Adults choose this life willingly. Kids have this life chosen for them, or at the very least they're too young to truly understand what they are consenting to.
  - gamblor956 4y ago
    Counterpoint: Brook Shields

mavhc 4y ago

And Stranger Things isn't good, it's just a mashup of 80s films that are at least twice as old as the actors, no original ideas at all. The problem is more celebrity rather than the filming process. Make it illegal to report any "news", ie gossip, about anyone under 18 for a start.

belval 4y ago
Just to push that thought a bit further, it's fine if you don't like stranger things but a mashup of 80s ideas is "original" for more than half the US population (median age is 38 y/o). I'm in my twenties, my parents watched movies in the 80s, and even then they were young. Discounting a TV show because it rips off ideas from things that are 40 years old seems like a harsh stance to take.
- Gordonjcp 4y ago
  Yeah, maybe watch something original and not totally derived from something else, like the Marvel movies, or Sonic the Hedgehog 2, or Fantastic Beasts...
  - bil7 4y ago
    pretty hard when about 80% of new films these days are a sequel, remake, or tie into an existing universe[1]. Yes, just watch old films you say, but they're not on the front page of netflix and disney+, where the average person goes for entertainment recommendations. [1] https://experimentalhistory.substack.com/p/pop-culture-has-become-an-oligopoly?s=r https://experimentalhistory.substack.com/p/pop-culture-has-b...
    - Der_Einzige 4y ago
      Aren't there only like 7 actual stories? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Seven_Basic_Plots https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Seven_Basic_Plots
      - bil7 4y ago
        Doesn't really matter, directors and screenwriters keep finding new implementations of old interfaces that feel fresh and are thoroughly enjoyable. The problem comes when implementations are near identical.
    - Gordonjcp 4y ago
      That was rather the point I was making...
  - kelnos 4y ago
    Arguably everything these days must be derived from something else, at least to some extent. Not sure there are really that many viable story ideas out there, and I wouldn't be surprised if the last several thousand years of stories have covered most of them.
    - Gordonjcp 4y ago
      There are only something like a dozen basic story plots, but for the love of all that is sprocket-holey just stop remaking and remaking and remaking the same film over and over again. Or, if you do, stop whining about pirates stealing your content.
  - tinco 4y ago
    Fantastic Beasts is a great movie. It's an original plot and not a sequel to anything so I don't get why you throw it in with those other movies. With as much bland repetitiveness there is in the average Hollywood movie Fantastic Beasts definitely is the wrong one to rip on.
- mavhc 4y ago
  It's not that it's ripping off the ideas, it's that that's what it's supposed to be doing. I watched the entire first season waiting for the bit when it got good, nothing happened. If you want to take reference to old films and do something original with them, like Everything Everywhere All At Once, great.
prox 4y ago
There are definitely kids who like it and whose parents adopt a healthy attitude towards it as well. I think the problem lies more with the media as you say.
tinco 4y ago
Something doesn't have to have original ideas to be good. Stranger Things is specifically great at being unoriginal. The show is brilliantly shot, well paced, engrossing and thrilling and the (child) actors were amazing. Just the 80s feeling it evokes is something I've not and I think the industry has not experienced at that scale in decades. You put it exactly right that it's the celebrity that's the problem. I'm not sure if your proposed solution is it though. Remember what Star Wars "fans" did to those the prequel actors. Those people weren't reading any gossip magazines, they were doing it on forums and gatherings, if it had existed they would do it on Twitter. How could we have protected the kids that played Anakin?
- mavhc 4y ago
  We don't even need to know their names for starters, we can retroactively edit credits once they become adults now. Fan is short for fanatic after all. Should there be a right to be forgotten for all children by default?
kzrdude 4y ago
Now look at all the superhero movies etc. I agree with you, it's just that the whole entertainment industry now is filled with this - unoriginal recycling in high-volume production.
pjc50 4y ago
The media coverage of child stars is a large part of the harm, and social media makes this worse.
- pbhjpbhj 4y ago
  Which media? Is there a sex divide, country divide, some other large scale segmentation ... I can't recall ever seeing anything about child stars when they are/were children but I consume mass-media every day.
  - pjc50 4y ago
    "Tabloid". This kind of thing: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-7194723/Millie-Bobby-Brown-looks-like-beautiful-ballerina-steps-Stranger-Things-premiere.html https://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-7194723/Millie... "Stranger Things' Millie Bobby Brown, 15, opts for an Eighties-inspired prom dress as she joins her fellow teen stars in unveiling much-anticipated third season of the Netflix hit" (somewhat randomly selected, she's the most recent child star that came to mind; the Mail is notorious for various levels of creepiness towards young female stars) Not a great overlap with HN, but this stuff sells newspapers in their millions.
OJFord 4y ago
I don't know specifically which 80s films you mean, but there were plenty made in the 80s that rehashed things that came before. Isn't that true of all art, ever?
watwut 4y ago
Why would something being mashup for 80s films imply it is not good? Stranger Things are truly fun to watch. That makes it good.
rbanffy 4y ago
> it's just a mashup of 80s films That’s precisely what I enjoy about the show. But, then, kids working in such a competitive (and often depraved) environment is a major concern. Directing kids is a huge responsibility many directors shouldn’t be allowed to have.

kzrdude 4y ago

Is it so bad though? Our world has shown capability - still - for improving living conditions. Optimism would say that the child actors of today have a better and fairer shot at a good life than they had 50 (for example) years ago. Now Harry Potter is pretty old already, and outside Hollywood, but those seemed to fare pretty well.

BarryMilo 4y ago
These children will never have a chance at a normal life. They have careers, certainly, but they'll never know what it's like to date or even shop for groceries without their celebrity status warping it somehow. Every single facet of their lives is public, forever. Adults choose this life willingly. Kids have this life chosen for them, or at the very least they're too young to truly understand what they are consenting to.
- gamblor956 4y ago
  Counterpoint: Brook Shields