4 ms·

Can you clarify?

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
iqkznnft 4y ago
HIV was originally associated with gay men. Some people argue that society only started seeing it as a public health issue (as opposed to a disease that those evil people get) when it became clear that it was spreading from gay men to everyone else.
- partiallypro 4y ago
  But we know that this doesn't just effect gay men and it's an older disease...it is just prominent in gay men. HIV is still to this day far more prevalent in the gay community than any other. You can speak about relevant facts on the ground without being a "bigot," it just means people need to be careful. There is no stigma here.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - Perenti 4y ago
    I'm pretty sure that HIV is more prevalent amongst heterosexual people than gay men. Unless you are saying that most Africans are gay, that most SE Asians are gay, and that most Papuans are gay (hint - they're not). In most 1st world nations your assertion _may_ be true, but in Australia at least HIV is most prevalent in the needle sharing community.
    - Perenti 4y ago
      My post was downvoted. Here's where the numbers are: https://www.unaids.org/en/resources/fact-sheet https://www.unaids.org/en/resources/fact-sheet It says: New HIV infections have been reduced by 52% since the peak in 1997. In 2020, around 1.5 million [1.0 million–2.0 million] people were newly infected with HIV, compared to 3.0 million [2.1 million–4.2 million] people in 1997. Women and girls accounted for 50% of all new infections in 2020. The assertion that 86% of new infections are in the gay community is false
      - hn_throwaway_99 4y ago
        I'm gay, and I downvoted you. Obviously transmission rates are very different around the world, but I'll just speak for the US: in the US the majority of new HIV infections are still men who have sex with men, with 66% of all cases and 81% of all men (and gay men make up 5-10% of men): https://www.hiv.gov/hiv-basics/overview/data-and-trends/statistics https://www.hiv.gov/hiv-basics/overview/data-and-trends/stat... Heck, the reason I'm on PrEP, and the reason virtually every other sexually active, non-long-term-monogamous gay man I know is also on PrEP, is because I know my risk of HIV infection is an order of magnitude more than straight men.
      - ummonk 4y ago
        Gay and bisexual men account for 66% of new HIV infections in the US, according to the CDC. It's obviously different globally, where homophobia and prostitution mean different groups are vulnerable to HIV.
      - jimmybob97 4y ago
    - partiallypro 4y ago
      There are more heterosexuals than homosexuals. I am saying per capita it is very very disproportionate and that is backed up by the facts of the matter. There's no arguing against it. That doesn't mean being gay is wrong or anything of the sort, just that people in that community have to be more careful. The news reporting on that or on the monkeypox thing doesn't mean it's perpetuating some sort of bigotry, it is informing that community to be on the lookout and to be safe. Arguing against informing our gay counterparts/friends of a virus to be PC or whatever is detrimental to the health of people we care about.
- Consultant32452 4y ago
  Statistically speaking HIV isn't spreading through everyone else. It's still almost entirely a gay men and intravenous drug user disease. The idea that it's spread to everyone else is part of the mythology that was spread with the intent of getting the attention of the general public to help with funding/research/etc. A quick search found that 86% of new HIV cases are among men who have sex with men. I couldn't find what % of the population is gay men, but all of LGBT makes up only 3-4% of the population. There is practically zero risk of HIV to straight people who do not use iv drugs.
  - Perenti 4y ago
    I'm pretty sure the vast majority of new HIV cases are in Africa, amongst heterosexual clients of sex workers. Maybe your 86% figure might apply in countries like the US where health care is a privilege and not a right. Your last sentence reminds me that COVID was going to be over by Christmas 2020...
    - Consultant32452 4y ago
      How about the UK? https://www.gov.uk/government/news/new-hiv-diagnoses-in-gay-and-bisexual-men-at-their-lowest-in-20-years https://www.gov.uk/government/news/new-hiv-diagnoses-in-gay-... >A new report by Public Health England shows that for the first time the number of new HIV diagnoses in gay and bisexual men outnumber new diagnoses in heterosexual adults by only 100 cases. So there's as many new HIV diagnoses among gay men as straight people, except gay men are only around 2% of the population. Notice you have to include all heterosexual people, not just the men, and it doesn't get up to just the cases among gay/bi men. The difference is staggering. I'm sorry, but the real world data doesn't match the mythology around HIV. You are right about prostitutes though, I should've included that as a risk factor.
      - Consultant32452 4y ago
      - bastawhiz 4y ago
Shank 4y ago
I’m assuming this is a reference to the fact that AIDS was, initially, called “GRID” and well, stigmatizing disease or downplaying it as something that won’t happen to someone due to lifestyle differences does little but divide people and ignore the problem. Intercourse happens between people, and the emphasis that a certain type occurs more frequently with a specific demographic shouldn’t change anything. > The cause of the disorder is unknown. Researchers call it A.I.D., for acquired immunodeficiency disease, or GRID, for gay-related immunodeficiency. It has been reported in 20 states and seven countries. [0] [0]: https://www.nytimes.com/1982/05/11/science/new-homosexual-disorder-worries-health-officials.html https://www.nytimes.com/1982/05/11/science/new-homosexual-di...
- pyuser583 4y ago
  Before “GRID” it was called “gay pneumonia.” It took about two years to figure out it was being spread sexually.
- hankman86 4y ago
  Doesn’t change the fact that promiscuous sexual activity among gay men is how monkey pox currently spreads. Of course that could change once there are more cases. Makes you wonder why there are no lockdowns for the types of gay venues and events that have been identified as ground zero for the disease.
  - Barrin92 4y ago
    because lockdowns discriminating on the basis of sexual orientation are likely going to be challenged legally in almost all democratic countries, and rightfully so by the way. Reminds me of calls to 'intern' gay men in the 80s here in Germany during the AIDS panic by some politicians.
    - hankman86 4y ago
      Draconian, but might have saved quite a few lifes. Don’t remember anyone panicking though. People quickly realised that attracting HIV is highly unlikely outside of high-risk groups, ie sexually active gays and needle sharing drug addicts. Apparently, nobody in the gay scene was panicking either. Why else did HIV continue to spread to a point where a large proportion of gay men carry the virus nowadays?
prvc 4y ago
HIV is also thought to have originated via zoonotic transmission from non-human primates. Or it could be a reference to the claim that such diseases are used to create unfair stigma for the communities via which they are promulgated.

Can you clarify?

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

HIV was originally associated with gay men. Some people argue that society only started seeing it as a public health issue (as opposed to a disease that those evil people get) when it became clear that it was spreading from gay men to everyone else.

partiallypro 4y ago
But we know that this doesn't just effect gay men and it's an older disease...it is just prominent in gay men. HIV is still to this day far more prevalent in the gay community than any other. You can speak about relevant facts on the ground without being a "bigot," it just means people need to be careful. There is no stigma here.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- Perenti 4y ago
  I'm pretty sure that HIV is more prevalent amongst heterosexual people than gay men. Unless you are saying that most Africans are gay, that most SE Asians are gay, and that most Papuans are gay (hint - they're not). In most 1st world nations your assertion _may_ be true, but in Australia at least HIV is most prevalent in the needle sharing community.
  - Perenti 4y ago
    My post was downvoted. Here's where the numbers are: https://www.unaids.org/en/resources/fact-sheet https://www.unaids.org/en/resources/fact-sheet It says: New HIV infections have been reduced by 52% since the peak in 1997. In 2020, around 1.5 million [1.0 million–2.0 million] people were newly infected with HIV, compared to 3.0 million [2.1 million–4.2 million] people in 1997. Women and girls accounted for 50% of all new infections in 2020. The assertion that 86% of new infections are in the gay community is false
    - hn_throwaway_99 4y ago
      I'm gay, and I downvoted you. Obviously transmission rates are very different around the world, but I'll just speak for the US: in the US the majority of new HIV infections are still men who have sex with men, with 66% of all cases and 81% of all men (and gay men make up 5-10% of men): https://www.hiv.gov/hiv-basics/overview/data-and-trends/statistics https://www.hiv.gov/hiv-basics/overview/data-and-trends/stat... Heck, the reason I'm on PrEP, and the reason virtually every other sexually active, non-long-term-monogamous gay man I know is also on PrEP, is because I know my risk of HIV infection is an order of magnitude more than straight men.
    - ummonk 4y ago
      Gay and bisexual men account for 66% of new HIV infections in the US, according to the CDC. It's obviously different globally, where homophobia and prostitution mean different groups are vulnerable to HIV.
    - jimmybob97 4y ago
  - partiallypro 4y ago
    There are more heterosexuals than homosexuals. I am saying per capita it is very very disproportionate and that is backed up by the facts of the matter. There's no arguing against it. That doesn't mean being gay is wrong or anything of the sort, just that people in that community have to be more careful. The news reporting on that or on the monkeypox thing doesn't mean it's perpetuating some sort of bigotry, it is informing that community to be on the lookout and to be safe. Arguing against informing our gay counterparts/friends of a virus to be PC or whatever is detrimental to the health of people we care about.
Consultant32452 4y ago
Statistically speaking HIV isn't spreading through everyone else. It's still almost entirely a gay men and intravenous drug user disease. The idea that it's spread to everyone else is part of the mythology that was spread with the intent of getting the attention of the general public to help with funding/research/etc. A quick search found that 86% of new HIV cases are among men who have sex with men. I couldn't find what % of the population is gay men, but all of LGBT makes up only 3-4% of the population. There is practically zero risk of HIV to straight people who do not use iv drugs.
- Perenti 4y ago
  I'm pretty sure the vast majority of new HIV cases are in Africa, amongst heterosexual clients of sex workers. Maybe your 86% figure might apply in countries like the US where health care is a privilege and not a right. Your last sentence reminds me that COVID was going to be over by Christmas 2020...
  - Consultant32452 4y ago
    How about the UK? https://www.gov.uk/government/news/new-hiv-diagnoses-in-gay-and-bisexual-men-at-their-lowest-in-20-years https://www.gov.uk/government/news/new-hiv-diagnoses-in-gay-... >A new report by Public Health England shows that for the first time the number of new HIV diagnoses in gay and bisexual men outnumber new diagnoses in heterosexual adults by only 100 cases. So there's as many new HIV diagnoses among gay men as straight people, except gay men are only around 2% of the population. Notice you have to include all heterosexual people, not just the men, and it doesn't get up to just the cases among gay/bi men. The difference is staggering. I'm sorry, but the real world data doesn't match the mythology around HIV. You are right about prostitutes though, I should've included that as a risk factor.
    - Consultant32452 4y ago
    - bastawhiz 4y ago

Shank 4y ago

I’m assuming this is a reference to the fact that AIDS was, initially, called “GRID” and well, stigmatizing disease or downplaying it as something that won’t happen to someone due to lifestyle differences does little but divide people and ignore the problem. Intercourse happens between people, and the emphasis that a certain type occurs more frequently with a specific demographic shouldn’t change anything. > The cause of the disorder is unknown. Researchers call it A.I.D., for acquired immunodeficiency disease, or GRID, for gay-related immunodeficiency. It has been reported in 20 states and seven countries. [0] [0]: https://www.nytimes.com/1982/05/11/science/new-homosexual-disorder-worries-health-officials.html https://www.nytimes.com/1982/05/11/science/new-homosexual-di...

pyuser583 4y ago
Before “GRID” it was called “gay pneumonia.” It took about two years to figure out it was being spread sexually.
hankman86 4y ago
Doesn’t change the fact that promiscuous sexual activity among gay men is how monkey pox currently spreads. Of course that could change once there are more cases. Makes you wonder why there are no lockdowns for the types of gay venues and events that have been identified as ground zero for the disease.
- Barrin92 4y ago
  because lockdowns discriminating on the basis of sexual orientation are likely going to be challenged legally in almost all democratic countries, and rightfully so by the way. Reminds me of calls to 'intern' gay men in the 80s here in Germany during the AIDS panic by some politicians.
  - hankman86 4y ago
    Draconian, but might have saved quite a few lifes. Don’t remember anyone panicking though. People quickly realised that attracting HIV is highly unlikely outside of high-risk groups, ie sexually active gays and needle sharing drug addicts. Apparently, nobody in the gay scene was panicking either. Why else did HIV continue to spread to a point where a large proportion of gay men carry the virus nowadays?

prvc 4y ago

HIV is also thought to have originated via zoonotic transmission from non-human primates. Or it could be a reference to the claim that such diseases are used to create unfair stigma for the communities via which they are promulgated.