4 ms·

finance is huge on secrecy, because the moats are often non-existent and often strategies can be replicated trivially. ask your own pension fund to show terms

finance is huge on secrecy, because the moats are often non-existent and often strategies can be replicated trivially. ask your own pension fund to show terms of every deal they make with your own money. they'll tell you to take a hike, and tether isn't any different here.

lotsofpulp 4y ago
They will tell you to take a hike because you will see that pension fund managers have been obviated by broad market index funds with 0.03% expense ratios and there is no reason to pay a pension fund manager anymore.
WJW 4y ago
Are you sure? Because my pension fund (ABP) has this page: https://www.abp.nl/over-abp/duurzaam-en-verantwoord-beleggen/waarin-belegt-abp/ https://www.abp.nl/over-abp/duurzaam-en-verantwoord-beleggen... I found it as result #1 when googling ABP investments. As you can see there are several PDFs listing investments of each category: - External fund managers - Engagements with companies - Overview corporate bonds - Overview nation-state bonds - Stocks - Overview top 100 largest investments All contain detailed lists about the country, instrument invested in, sector and how large the stake is rounded to the nearest million euro. All these lists are updated regularly as changes occur. Nobody is asking Tether to disclose every term of every single deal they make, but making disclosures about the composition of your underlying assets is not a very big deal at all. You can find similar documents for almost every pension fund out there.
- forum_ghost 4y ago
  >External fund managers full legal agreement of their mandate publicly available to the entire world, Y/N? >Engagements with companies full legal terms of engagement public and available to the entire world, Y/N? You are just listing some public information. Actual source of alpha is a very closely guarded trade secret, and will never be made available to you, or anyone not involved directly. Tether is literally being asked to openly disclose confidential business information to the entire world. They've revealed composition a number of times, they have done an attestation, and none of the other stablecoins have produced an audit either. It's just a witch hunt. composition: https://static.seekingalpha.com/uploads/2021/5/19/254888-16214228104575725_origin.png https://static.seekingalpha.com/uploads/2021/5/19/254888-162... full report: https://seekingalpha.com/instablog/254888-sunil-shah/5593034-tether-assurance-moore-cayman-accountants-marminus-2021minus-2 https://seekingalpha.com/instablog/254888-sunil-shah/5593034... for comparison, report from USDC/Circle: https://www.centre.io/hubfs/pdfs/attestation/2021%20Circle%20Internet%20Examination%20Report%20January%202021%20FINAL.pdf?hsLang=en https://www.centre.io/hubfs/pdfs/attestation/2021%20Circle%2... what is the big issue? money market funds your pension invests in have the same composition as Tether.
  - kasey_junk 4y ago
    Compare your one page graph to the calpers annual report: https://www.calpers.ca.gov/docs/forms-publications/annual-investment-report-2021.pdf https://www.calpers.ca.gov/docs/forms-publications/annual-in... That report lists every single bond they have down to the dollar and maturity rating. It lists every hedge fund, vc and other private equity they have on their books. That’s what is normal (and in the us required) for pensions. That you have a different expectation for reporting than other market participants doesn’t make it a witch hunt, quite the opposite your standard is much much lower than average.
    - forum_ghost 4y ago
      Can you provide the precise internal composition of the item "COUNTRYWIDE ASSET BACKED CERTI" on page 66 that has book value of 0? Would be also nice to know how "AP ALTERNATIVE ASSETS (AAA), LP" got wiped out, do you have details on that? These are the funds your pension invested in, and lost everything. Looking forward to you finding out the composition of those funds.
      - kasey_junk 4y ago
        The first one is CWABC asset backed security trust 2004. You can find the SEC filing here https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1021913/000102191315000007/h05_cwabsabs1q15.htm https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1021913/000102191315... It’s a MBS that went to zero as part of the 2008 troubles. The underlying mortgages for it are no longer available because it and the company that sold it are gone. Before the default mbs prospectuses listed the mortgages in each tranche along with metadata like type, credit rating, etc. Your turn. Can you find a single bond trader who has sold “commercial paper” backing tether? I’ll take a journalist who has talked to one as well. PS: I’m not a beneficiary of calpers, this is public information available to anyone. My private retirement funds and money markets all offer at least this much information in their documentation if not more.
  - jcranmer 4y ago
    > Tether is literally being asked to openly disclose confidential business information to the entire world. If what you are invested in is confidential business information, you're doing something wrong. This is all the more true because Tether's claimed value to its customers isn't "you're going to make bucketloads of money if you invest in my fund" but "invest $1 in my fund and you can get $1 (no more and no less) out at any time." Given the latter goal, the fact that it took an awful lot of teeth pulling to get Tether to reveal as much detail as it has should be a massive red flag of risk. > what is the big issue? money market funds your pension invests in have the same composition as Tether. We're asking for the same transparency as every money market fund in existence. Why should that be so hard for Tether?
s_Hogg 4y ago
I have a financial advisor who does all this for me so as it happens I have 100% clarity regarding what my retirement funds are invested in. Asking a financial services provider to prove they've got the assets they say they have is absolutely table stakes and even required by law in a lot of cases. But not for crypto scams, of course.
jcranmer 4y ago
Go to https://www.fidelity.com/mutual-funds/mutual-fund-spotlights/money-market-funds https://www.fidelity.com/mutual-funds/mutual-fund-spotlights.... Pick any fund. Look at the prospectus. Note that there is a link to the "Monthly Holdings Report." [1] Which is a list of every single investment the fund makes, including the CUSIP (basically serial ID) of every bond. If people aren't willing to tell details on what you're invested in, that is considered one of the red flags that you're investing in a Ponzi scheme. [1] I'd link directly, but the final link is a downloaded PDF, so it's not as easy to copy the link.
kasey_junk 4y ago
Your pension fund (in the us) must outline their holdings at a minimum yearly and also on demand of a beneficiary.

lotsofpulp 4y ago

They will tell you to take a hike because you will see that pension fund managers have been obviated by broad market index funds with 0.03% expense ratios and there is no reason to pay a pension fund manager anymore.

WJW 4y ago

Are you sure? Because my pension fund (ABP) has this page: https://www.abp.nl/over-abp/duurzaam-en-verantwoord-beleggen/waarin-belegt-abp/ https://www.abp.nl/over-abp/duurzaam-en-verantwoord-beleggen... I found it as result #1 when googling ABP investments. As you can see there are several PDFs listing investments of each category: - External fund managers - Engagements with companies - Overview corporate bonds - Overview nation-state bonds - Stocks - Overview top 100 largest investments All contain detailed lists about the country, instrument invested in, sector and how large the stake is rounded to the nearest million euro. All these lists are updated regularly as changes occur. Nobody is asking Tether to disclose every term of every single deal they make, but making disclosures about the composition of your underlying assets is not a very big deal at all. You can find similar documents for almost every pension fund out there.

forum_ghost 4y ago
>External fund managers full legal agreement of their mandate publicly available to the entire world, Y/N? >Engagements with companies full legal terms of engagement public and available to the entire world, Y/N? You are just listing some public information. Actual source of alpha is a very closely guarded trade secret, and will never be made available to you, or anyone not involved directly. Tether is literally being asked to openly disclose confidential business information to the entire world. They've revealed composition a number of times, they have done an attestation, and none of the other stablecoins have produced an audit either. It's just a witch hunt. composition: https://static.seekingalpha.com/uploads/2021/5/19/254888-16214228104575725_origin.png https://static.seekingalpha.com/uploads/2021/5/19/254888-162... full report: https://seekingalpha.com/instablog/254888-sunil-shah/5593034-tether-assurance-moore-cayman-accountants-marminus-2021minus-2 https://seekingalpha.com/instablog/254888-sunil-shah/5593034... for comparison, report from USDC/Circle: https://www.centre.io/hubfs/pdfs/attestation/2021%20Circle%20Internet%20Examination%20Report%20January%202021%20FINAL.pdf?hsLang=en https://www.centre.io/hubfs/pdfs/attestation/2021%20Circle%2... what is the big issue? money market funds your pension invests in have the same composition as Tether.
- kasey_junk 4y ago
  Compare your one page graph to the calpers annual report: https://www.calpers.ca.gov/docs/forms-publications/annual-investment-report-2021.pdf https://www.calpers.ca.gov/docs/forms-publications/annual-in... That report lists every single bond they have down to the dollar and maturity rating. It lists every hedge fund, vc and other private equity they have on their books. That’s what is normal (and in the us required) for pensions. That you have a different expectation for reporting than other market participants doesn’t make it a witch hunt, quite the opposite your standard is much much lower than average.
  - forum_ghost 4y ago
    Can you provide the precise internal composition of the item "COUNTRYWIDE ASSET BACKED CERTI" on page 66 that has book value of 0? Would be also nice to know how "AP ALTERNATIVE ASSETS (AAA), LP" got wiped out, do you have details on that? These are the funds your pension invested in, and lost everything. Looking forward to you finding out the composition of those funds.
    - kasey_junk 4y ago
      The first one is CWABC asset backed security trust 2004. You can find the SEC filing here https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1021913/000102191315000007/h05_cwabsabs1q15.htm https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1021913/000102191315... It’s a MBS that went to zero as part of the 2008 troubles. The underlying mortgages for it are no longer available because it and the company that sold it are gone. Before the default mbs prospectuses listed the mortgages in each tranche along with metadata like type, credit rating, etc. Your turn. Can you find a single bond trader who has sold “commercial paper” backing tether? I’ll take a journalist who has talked to one as well. PS: I’m not a beneficiary of calpers, this is public information available to anyone. My private retirement funds and money markets all offer at least this much information in their documentation if not more.
- jcranmer 4y ago
  > Tether is literally being asked to openly disclose confidential business information to the entire world. If what you are invested in is confidential business information, you're doing something wrong. This is all the more true because Tether's claimed value to its customers isn't "you're going to make bucketloads of money if you invest in my fund" but "invest $1 in my fund and you can get $1 (no more and no less) out at any time." Given the latter goal, the fact that it took an awful lot of teeth pulling to get Tether to reveal as much detail as it has should be a massive red flag of risk. > what is the big issue? money market funds your pension invests in have the same composition as Tether. We're asking for the same transparency as every money market fund in existence. Why should that be so hard for Tether?

s_Hogg 4y ago

I have a financial advisor who does all this for me so as it happens I have 100% clarity regarding what my retirement funds are invested in. Asking a financial services provider to prove they've got the assets they say they have is absolutely table stakes and even required by law in a lot of cases. But not for crypto scams, of course.

jcranmer 4y ago

Go to https://www.fidelity.com/mutual-funds/mutual-fund-spotlights/money-market-funds https://www.fidelity.com/mutual-funds/mutual-fund-spotlights.... Pick any fund. Look at the prospectus. Note that there is a link to the "Monthly Holdings Report." [1] Which is a list of every single investment the fund makes, including the CUSIP (basically serial ID) of every bond. If people aren't willing to tell details on what you're invested in, that is considered one of the red flags that you're investing in a Ponzi scheme. [1] I'd link directly, but the final link is a downloaded PDF, so it's not as easy to copy the link.

kasey_junk 4y ago

Your pension fund (in the us) must outline their holdings at a minimum yearly and also on demand of a beneficiary.