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Something that carries say 1kg for any distance, is a pretty significant drone. The Dji Mavic pro can carry 1kg and is around $1k. > I think the only reason w

Something that carries say 1kg for any distance, is a pretty significant drone. The Dji Mavic pro can carry 1kg and is around $1k. > I think the only reason we haven't seen this on the battlefield yet is that we haven't yet had a war between the right countries. But we will. There are videos every day of Ukrainian drones dropping shaped charges like the Russian RKG-3/1600 from drones. Ukraine even has special troops specialized in it, the Aerorozvidka (Google for the videos). The reason they apparently aren’t bothered by anti drone efforts is because the Russian forces don’t seem to have the training and equipment for it, so regular drones work well enough (with selection bias of course - we don’t see the videos of the failed attacks). It’s clear from that footage what an advantage it is to be able to drop 2 or 3 munitions since you can correct for wind if you miss the first, something you can’t do with a single drop. The larger octocopters that can carry 5kg or more is probably what you want for the job. Some range, and at least 2 charges to drop.

dragontamer 4y ago
1kg is similar to smaller warheads in the AT4 anti-tank weapon. But AT4 is not reliable, only 400mm of penetration and tanks can have 500mm or 600mm of armor. (Or really, equivalent to 500+mm once special materials or geometry is factored in). To reliably kill a main battle tank requires a larger munition. Javelin is a 8kg warhead IIRC. This is because Javelin is tandem: two warheads. First warhead destroys reactive armor, 2nd warhead actually kills the tank with 900mm of penetration. --------- For drones to be optimized on the battlefield will require specially designed drones and special warheads designed to fit in the cargo-capacity of drones. Switchblade 300 is nice for example but is too small to reliably kill a tank. Switchblade 600 can kill a tank, but no longer has the small and lightweight form factor that I'm sure the soldiers who have to carry this crap care about.
- AdrianB1 4y ago
  You ignore that AT4 is fired at the main armor, while drone dropped munitions hit the top armor that is just a few centimeters. The impact point makes all the difference.
  - dragontamer 4y ago
    Sure, but Javelins (considered a very reliable weapon), is top-down AND 8kg of tandem charge of 900mm+ penetration. I think NLAW is ~500mm of penetration and top-down. Its not too hard to make a top-down weapon these days, but it does add weight to the device. -------- EDIT: I'm pretty sure that you can't just "drop" a mortar or AT4 warhead reliably either. You'd want to make it into the shape of... well... a bomb. So that the "shape" of the shape-charge points in the correct direction.
    - nradov 4y ago
      Mortar rounds are already the correct shape with fins to stabilize the flight path. Various irregular and insurgent forces have already weaponized the larger consumer drones with a rack that can release a single mortar round straight down. If the drone is hovering and there isn't much wind then the mortar round will fall straight down and detonate on impact. In some cases they may also have made minor modifications to the fuse mechanism in order to ensure reliable detonation when used in that mode. These weapons are very effective against lightly armored targets which lack effective air defenses or electronic countermeasures.
      - dragontamer 4y ago
        > If the drone is hovering and there isn't much wind then the mortar round will fall straight down and detonate on impact. Dive bombing. These drones should be dive bombing. WW2 strategy to increase precision and placement of the bomb. Only lesser-trained pilots glide-bombed or otherwise avoided dive-bombing in WW2. I don't think the let-go at height maneuver is historically considered very good. By dive bombing, you set forward-momentum on the bomb and more accurately place it, compared to dropping it from a hover. The bomb also reaches its target faster, and the pilot has the ability to line-up the shot (especially useful if the enemy is a moving target). I'm very much unimpressed by the "let go at height" videos, its just not good piloting IMO. But if these drones were dive-bombing instead, maybe I'd have a bit more respect. I'm not necessarily saying that the pilots have to dive-bomb, but maybe an AI could control that kind of pass.
sudosysgen 4y ago
Antidrone warfare is very very difficult. They are small and go slow and are thus difficult to shoot down. See how Iraqi militias fly drones into US bases and how Hezbollah regularly flies drone into Israel unpunished (sometimes Israel even has to resort to fighter jets to shoot them down).

dragontamer 4y ago

1kg is similar to smaller warheads in the AT4 anti-tank weapon. But AT4 is not reliable, only 400mm of penetration and tanks can have 500mm or 600mm of armor. (Or really, equivalent to 500+mm once special materials or geometry is factored in). To reliably kill a main battle tank requires a larger munition. Javelin is a 8kg warhead IIRC. This is because Javelin is tandem: two warheads. First warhead destroys reactive armor, 2nd warhead actually kills the tank with 900mm of penetration. --------- For drones to be optimized on the battlefield will require specially designed drones and special warheads designed to fit in the cargo-capacity of drones. Switchblade 300 is nice for example but is too small to reliably kill a tank. Switchblade 600 can kill a tank, but no longer has the small and lightweight form factor that I'm sure the soldiers who have to carry this crap care about.

AdrianB1 4y ago
You ignore that AT4 is fired at the main armor, while drone dropped munitions hit the top armor that is just a few centimeters. The impact point makes all the difference.
- dragontamer 4y ago
  Sure, but Javelins (considered a very reliable weapon), is top-down AND 8kg of tandem charge of 900mm+ penetration. I think NLAW is ~500mm of penetration and top-down. Its not too hard to make a top-down weapon these days, but it does add weight to the device. -------- EDIT: I'm pretty sure that you can't just "drop" a mortar or AT4 warhead reliably either. You'd want to make it into the shape of... well... a bomb. So that the "shape" of the shape-charge points in the correct direction.
  - nradov 4y ago
    Mortar rounds are already the correct shape with fins to stabilize the flight path. Various irregular and insurgent forces have already weaponized the larger consumer drones with a rack that can release a single mortar round straight down. If the drone is hovering and there isn't much wind then the mortar round will fall straight down and detonate on impact. In some cases they may also have made minor modifications to the fuse mechanism in order to ensure reliable detonation when used in that mode. These weapons are very effective against lightly armored targets which lack effective air defenses or electronic countermeasures.
    - dragontamer 4y ago
      > If the drone is hovering and there isn't much wind then the mortar round will fall straight down and detonate on impact. Dive bombing. These drones should be dive bombing. WW2 strategy to increase precision and placement of the bomb. Only lesser-trained pilots glide-bombed or otherwise avoided dive-bombing in WW2. I don't think the let-go at height maneuver is historically considered very good. By dive bombing, you set forward-momentum on the bomb and more accurately place it, compared to dropping it from a hover. The bomb also reaches its target faster, and the pilot has the ability to line-up the shot (especially useful if the enemy is a moving target). I'm very much unimpressed by the "let go at height" videos, its just not good piloting IMO. But if these drones were dive-bombing instead, maybe I'd have a bit more respect. I'm not necessarily saying that the pilots have to dive-bomb, but maybe an AI could control that kind of pass.

sudosysgen 4y ago

Antidrone warfare is very very difficult. They are small and go slow and are thus difficult to shoot down. See how Iraqi militias fly drones into US bases and how Hezbollah regularly flies drone into Israel unpunished (sometimes Israel even has to resort to fighter jets to shoot them down).