5 ms·

India just banned all wheat exports with immediate effect

54 points by camillomiller 4y ago

mytailorisrich 4y ago
Life moves pretty fast: "Last week, Indian PM Narendra Modi told US President Joe Biden that India was ready to ship food to the rest of the world following supply shocks and rising prices due to the war in Ukraine." [1] (Article published on 19th April) [1] https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-61138859 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-61138859
- signal11 4y ago
  India has stopped exports before in response to domestic need. Onions in recent years[1], and also COVID vaccines in response to its devastating 2021 second wave, after it spent 2020 doing rounds of “vaccine diplomacy” where it assured countries it could help with their COVID vaccine needs. India is usually the world’s largest vaccine exporter, but its 2021 2nd wave led to this policy being put on hold as once again, exports were blocked[2]. Actions like these are not new or surprising because India’s economy is quite price sensitive and the government in response likes to micro-manage in the face of rising prices, but it does mean you’ve to take these sound bites to foreign leaders with a grain of salt. Very often these are actually intended for people at home to push the message of “see how much good we’re doing in the world?” None of this is intended to be disparaging or specific to India, a lot of this applies to other countries as well. [1] https://www.reuters.com/article/bangladesh-india-onion-idUSKBN2660XV https://www.reuters.com/article/bangladesh-india-onion-idUSK... [2] https://www.thecambridgeglobalaffair.co.uk/collaborators/what-happened-to-indias-vaccine-diplomacy https://www.thecambridgeglobalaffair.co.uk/collaborators/wha...
  - Throwawayaerlei 4y ago
    Another factor of the Indian national government's failure with COVID vaccines was simply not sending any significant amounts of money to the companies that were either manufacturing them under contract like the Serum Institute of India (SII, largest in the world by doses, 1.5 billion/year in 2020). After that second wave, as far as I know the first really big wave hit, the CEO of the SII had to flee the country because of threatening demands he was getting from various powerful figures in various part of the country. Although the SII also suffered from supply chain issues like everyone else, such as a world wide shortage of 2,000 L sterile plastic bags in which to culture cells and probably bacteria like the E. Coli used in the first step of making the mRNA vaccines.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- mercy_dude 4y ago
  Except US decided to influence a regime change in its rival Pakistan and install a puppet militarist. And to top that provide $12 billion aid through Saudi proxy and another 50+ millions direct aid. US foreign policy has been baffling since last year.
  - chitowneats 4y ago
    I'm not convinced on this issue one way or the other but I fail to see how this is relevant? Are you suggesting it was a consideration in India government's wheat ban? Seems unlikely.
  - gentleman11 4y ago
    I can’t find any news that supports this claim. Do you have a source? Closest is > Khan’s new narrative is that there is a foreign conspiracy to oust him from power. And it is America, Khan says, that is really behind the no-confidence motion filed by opposition lawmakers. https://theconversation.com/what-is-going-on-in-pakistan-and-why-has-the-us-been-dragged-into-it-180731 https://theconversation.com/what-is-going-on-in-pakistan-and... The United States can’t even get lawmakers in the unites states to cooperate. How are they getting an entire foreign legislature to cooperate?
    - allisdust 4y ago
      It's because the political class in Pakistan is already a puppet in the hands of its Military. It's one of the few countries where the nuclear codes and strike decisions are in the hands of the military and not the civilian government. They control a puppet party which almost always gets a fixed number of seats from backward provinces. This party then becomes the king maker and hence controls who is at the helm of civilian government. The previous one (Imran Khan) also came into power with their support and so does the new one.
  - amusedcyclist 4y ago
    This isn't about foreign policy, this is about domestic food prices, which are more politically important than foreign policy for any government in any country
- 10xrubberduck 4y ago
  The heat wave was crazy though [1]. I am wondering whether any plant can survive at 50+°C (except desert adapted ones) [1] https://twitter.com/PlatformAdam/status/1519980107217129472?s=20&t=NUWoVwKWH0fany3RIZ2Aag https://twitter.com/PlatformAdam/status/1519980107217129472?...
RcouF1uZ4gsC 4y ago
I think the last couple of years is a wake-up call for the neo-liberal order. Before, it was cool to talk about efficiency and how backward it was for countries to try to protect domestic industries instead of just allow “free trade”. However, the last few years have illustrated that if you don’t have domestic production of essentials, then you are going to be hurting. Look at the early Covid pandemic and the shortage of face masks and other protective equipment. Look at vaccine production and how countries that could manufacture the vaccine prioritized domestic distribution first. Look now at global food supply and how countries as limiting exports of their grains. The last decade or so is a story about countries and companies pursuing “efficiency” at the expense of increased fragility. Going forward, I think you will see more companies taking a larger role to make sure critical production capabilities stay domestic.
- antifa 4y ago
  I'm concerned the neoliberal notion of "efficiency" might be misleading anyways. Normal people may assume it means less waste but generally it feels like it's silently drifted a little bit into really meaning the amount of money flowing into their pockets.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
- seydor 4y ago
  wars were traded for "fragility". Antifragile empires make great wars, and i m not sure humanity wants to go back to that era.
- Throwawayaerlei 4y ago
  "Look at the early Covid pandemic and the shortage of face masks and other protective equipment. Look at vaccine production and how countries that could manufacture the vaccine prioritized domestic distribution first." I don't think those are very good examples. A large part of the PPE shortage problem was from not restocking the national stockpile after the 2009 swine flu pandemic, in part from a bi-partisan, multiple administrations by both parties capture of that program by Emergent BioSolutions. Which then abjectly failed when it had to deliver cell culture grown vaccines in its Baltimore plant that was in reserve for pandemics (fortunately that didn't hurt so much because the Janssen and Oxford vaccines are ... subpar, and Protein Sciences approach which works for flu generally failed or were extremity late (Novovax and Sanofi Pasteur)). We had part of a system and failed to use it properly. On the other hand if we as in the US were sharp we'd have bought the equipment Honeywell ended up scrapping when they shut down mask making in France. 3M for example does make masks in countries like the US and even keeps an extra set of equipment to double production in case of emergencies like this. But of course just doubling normal production isn't enough, and they and other companies like some that got crushed after 2009-10 found it hard to compete against very cheap PPE from the PRC, and refused to risk their companies again after COVID started hitting. For vaccine manufacturing it's a tall order to expect political systems to be ready for once in a century events. This wasn't so bad for us with COVID since we could tool up during the development and testing of vaccines although the Indian national government abjectly failed to do that, but there was always going to be issues here, especially in learning curve issues. Also how do you prepare for the best vaccines being mostly completely new technology for mass manufacturing? Even for fill and finish BoNTech's vaccine has at least at some point temperature requirements way beyond normal medical freezing, the latter any of us could achieve with a frost free consumer freezer. In general, though, you're right, but solutions free of their own corruption problems are very hard. Plus tariffs are regressive taxes.
mensetmanusman 4y ago
Pandemic War {Present} Famine
- rdtwo 4y ago
ohiovr 4y ago
5 When he opened the third seal, I heard the third living creature saying, “Come and see!” And behold, a black horse, and he who sat on it had a balance in his hand. 6 I heard a voice in the midst of the four living creatures saying, “A choenix of wheat for a denarius, and three choenix of barley for a denarius! Don’t damage the oil and the wine!”
- im3w1l 4y ago
  So uhm why is the barley so much cheaper? Actually.. the more I look into this, the more it doesn't sound like famine so much as a decline in food quality, where even wheat becomes a luxury good, and oil and wine are just unthinkable for anyone except the elite.
  - daniel-cussen 4y ago
    Same thing. Let them eat cake.
    - im3w1l 4y ago
      No, barley was a lower grade poor-people flour. So it's just saying that people will have to settle for less.
      - daniel-cussen 4y ago
        That's what "let them eat cake" means, it's a very confusing expression which means the opposite of what it means, which Marie-Antoinette Bourbon (I think that's her name) said and which got her lynched on the spot. Since then it means they're replacing an argument about scarcity with an argument about economic subordination, ie get into debt to buy cake if you're out of bread so you can buy cake at 1000x the cost, do whatever we say to not die. Become Marie Antoinette Bourbon's slave. A modern form of that is American medicine, that's cake. They tell Americans they're getting the best medical care in the world, so it's OK it's the most expensive. In fact it's the opposite, it's the most inferior because it's the most expensive, the less you pay the better the results, with Cuba achieving the absolute best results linked directly to the absolute lowest prices. Like religion, the less money you have the more devout you can be, prayer and fasting.
OmegaPG 4y ago
This is why India need Farm and Agricultural reforms. India can produce far more wheat (both for domestic usage and export) if they industrialize their agriculture.
- CtznIndn 4y ago
  Which reforms? India already produces a lot of Wheat, and the Gov was sure about it's ability to feed India as well as the World. Hence a month ago, it declared it was ready to export and feed the World. The lesson here is not about Agricultural reforms, but about Government reforms. It's ability to collect and analyze the data properly. But primarily, its also about the need to address the increase in heat due to Climate Change. That's what lead to lower production this year, which the Gov did not factor in into their calculations.
  - splintercell 4y ago
    To begin with, getting rid of land ceiling laws which results in farmer suicides (but that’s not the reason why it should be removed, they should be removed because they make agriculture very inefficient by putting an artificial limit on how much land a farmer can own). Infosys can own 5000 acres of land for a golf course but they cannot own 5000 acres of agricultural land.

54 points by camillomiller 4y ago

Life moves pretty fast: "Last week, Indian PM Narendra Modi told US President Joe Biden that India was ready to ship food to the rest of the world following supply shocks and rising prices due to the war in Ukraine." [1] (Article published on 19th April) [1] https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-61138859 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-61138859

signal11 4y ago
India has stopped exports before in response to domestic need. Onions in recent years[1], and also COVID vaccines in response to its devastating 2021 second wave, after it spent 2020 doing rounds of “vaccine diplomacy” where it assured countries it could help with their COVID vaccine needs. India is usually the world’s largest vaccine exporter, but its 2021 2nd wave led to this policy being put on hold as once again, exports were blocked[2]. Actions like these are not new or surprising because India’s economy is quite price sensitive and the government in response likes to micro-manage in the face of rising prices, but it does mean you’ve to take these sound bites to foreign leaders with a grain of salt. Very often these are actually intended for people at home to push the message of “see how much good we’re doing in the world?” None of this is intended to be disparaging or specific to India, a lot of this applies to other countries as well. [1] https://www.reuters.com/article/bangladesh-india-onion-idUSKBN2660XV https://www.reuters.com/article/bangladesh-india-onion-idUSK... [2] https://www.thecambridgeglobalaffair.co.uk/collaborators/what-happened-to-indias-vaccine-diplomacy https://www.thecambridgeglobalaffair.co.uk/collaborators/wha...
- Throwawayaerlei 4y ago
  Another factor of the Indian national government's failure with COVID vaccines was simply not sending any significant amounts of money to the companies that were either manufacturing them under contract like the Serum Institute of India (SII, largest in the world by doses, 1.5 billion/year in 2020). After that second wave, as far as I know the first really big wave hit, the CEO of the SII had to flee the country because of threatening demands he was getting from various powerful figures in various part of the country. Although the SII also suffered from supply chain issues like everyone else, such as a world wide shortage of 2,000 L sterile plastic bags in which to culture cells and probably bacteria like the E. Coli used in the first step of making the mRNA vaccines.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
mercy_dude 4y ago
Except US decided to influence a regime change in its rival Pakistan and install a puppet militarist. And to top that provide $12 billion aid through Saudi proxy and another 50+ millions direct aid. US foreign policy has been baffling since last year.
- chitowneats 4y ago
  I'm not convinced on this issue one way or the other but I fail to see how this is relevant? Are you suggesting it was a consideration in India government's wheat ban? Seems unlikely.
- gentleman11 4y ago
  I can’t find any news that supports this claim. Do you have a source? Closest is > Khan’s new narrative is that there is a foreign conspiracy to oust him from power. And it is America, Khan says, that is really behind the no-confidence motion filed by opposition lawmakers. https://theconversation.com/what-is-going-on-in-pakistan-and-why-has-the-us-been-dragged-into-it-180731 https://theconversation.com/what-is-going-on-in-pakistan-and... The United States can’t even get lawmakers in the unites states to cooperate. How are they getting an entire foreign legislature to cooperate?
  - allisdust 4y ago
    It's because the political class in Pakistan is already a puppet in the hands of its Military. It's one of the few countries where the nuclear codes and strike decisions are in the hands of the military and not the civilian government. They control a puppet party which almost always gets a fixed number of seats from backward provinces. This party then becomes the king maker and hence controls who is at the helm of civilian government. The previous one (Imran Khan) also came into power with their support and so does the new one.
- amusedcyclist 4y ago
  This isn't about foreign policy, this is about domestic food prices, which are more politically important than foreign policy for any government in any country
10xrubberduck 4y ago
The heat wave was crazy though [1]. I am wondering whether any plant can survive at 50+°C (except desert adapted ones) [1] https://twitter.com/PlatformAdam/status/1519980107217129472?s=20&t=NUWoVwKWH0fany3RIZ2Aag https://twitter.com/PlatformAdam/status/1519980107217129472?...

RcouF1uZ4gsC 4y ago

I think the last couple of years is a wake-up call for the neo-liberal order. Before, it was cool to talk about efficiency and how backward it was for countries to try to protect domestic industries instead of just allow “free trade”. However, the last few years have illustrated that if you don’t have domestic production of essentials, then you are going to be hurting. Look at the early Covid pandemic and the shortage of face masks and other protective equipment. Look at vaccine production and how countries that could manufacture the vaccine prioritized domestic distribution first. Look now at global food supply and how countries as limiting exports of their grains. The last decade or so is a story about countries and companies pursuing “efficiency” at the expense of increased fragility. Going forward, I think you will see more companies taking a larger role to make sure critical production capabilities stay domestic.

antifa 4y ago
I'm concerned the neoliberal notion of "efficiency" might be misleading anyways. Normal people may assume it means less waste but generally it feels like it's silently drifted a little bit into really meaning the amount of money flowing into their pockets.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
seydor 4y ago
wars were traded for "fragility". Antifragile empires make great wars, and i m not sure humanity wants to go back to that era.
Throwawayaerlei 4y ago
"Look at the early Covid pandemic and the shortage of face masks and other protective equipment. Look at vaccine production and how countries that could manufacture the vaccine prioritized domestic distribution first." I don't think those are very good examples. A large part of the PPE shortage problem was from not restocking the national stockpile after the 2009 swine flu pandemic, in part from a bi-partisan, multiple administrations by both parties capture of that program by Emergent BioSolutions. Which then abjectly failed when it had to deliver cell culture grown vaccines in its Baltimore plant that was in reserve for pandemics (fortunately that didn't hurt so much because the Janssen and Oxford vaccines are ... subpar, and Protein Sciences approach which works for flu generally failed or were extremity late (Novovax and Sanofi Pasteur)). We had part of a system and failed to use it properly. On the other hand if we as in the US were sharp we'd have bought the equipment Honeywell ended up scrapping when they shut down mask making in France. 3M for example does make masks in countries like the US and even keeps an extra set of equipment to double production in case of emergencies like this. But of course just doubling normal production isn't enough, and they and other companies like some that got crushed after 2009-10 found it hard to compete against very cheap PPE from the PRC, and refused to risk their companies again after COVID started hitting. For vaccine manufacturing it's a tall order to expect political systems to be ready for once in a century events. This wasn't so bad for us with COVID since we could tool up during the development and testing of vaccines although the Indian national government abjectly failed to do that, but there was always going to be issues here, especially in learning curve issues. Also how do you prepare for the best vaccines being mostly completely new technology for mass manufacturing? Even for fill and finish BoNTech's vaccine has at least at some point temperature requirements way beyond normal medical freezing, the latter any of us could achieve with a frost free consumer freezer. In general, though, you're right, but solutions free of their own corruption problems are very hard. Plus tariffs are regressive taxes.

mensetmanusman 4y ago

Pandemic War {Present} Famine

rdtwo 4y ago

ohiovr 4y ago

5 When he opened the third seal, I heard the third living creature saying, “Come and see!” And behold, a black horse, and he who sat on it had a balance in his hand. 6 I heard a voice in the midst of the four living creatures saying, “A choenix of wheat for a denarius, and three choenix of barley for a denarius! Don’t damage the oil and the wine!”

im3w1l 4y ago
So uhm why is the barley so much cheaper? Actually.. the more I look into this, the more it doesn't sound like famine so much as a decline in food quality, where even wheat becomes a luxury good, and oil and wine are just unthinkable for anyone except the elite.
- daniel-cussen 4y ago
  Same thing. Let them eat cake.
  - im3w1l 4y ago
    No, barley was a lower grade poor-people flour. So it's just saying that people will have to settle for less.
    - daniel-cussen 4y ago
      That's what "let them eat cake" means, it's a very confusing expression which means the opposite of what it means, which Marie-Antoinette Bourbon (I think that's her name) said and which got her lynched on the spot. Since then it means they're replacing an argument about scarcity with an argument about economic subordination, ie get into debt to buy cake if you're out of bread so you can buy cake at 1000x the cost, do whatever we say to not die. Become Marie Antoinette Bourbon's slave. A modern form of that is American medicine, that's cake. They tell Americans they're getting the best medical care in the world, so it's OK it's the most expensive. In fact it's the opposite, it's the most inferior because it's the most expensive, the less you pay the better the results, with Cuba achieving the absolute best results linked directly to the absolute lowest prices. Like religion, the less money you have the more devout you can be, prayer and fasting.

OmegaPG 4y ago

This is why India need Farm and Agricultural reforms. India can produce far more wheat (both for domestic usage and export) if they industrialize their agriculture.

CtznIndn 4y ago
Which reforms? India already produces a lot of Wheat, and the Gov was sure about it's ability to feed India as well as the World. Hence a month ago, it declared it was ready to export and feed the World. The lesson here is not about Agricultural reforms, but about Government reforms. It's ability to collect and analyze the data properly. But primarily, its also about the need to address the increase in heat due to Climate Change. That's what lead to lower production this year, which the Gov did not factor in into their calculations.
- splintercell 4y ago
  To begin with, getting rid of land ceiling laws which results in farmer suicides (but that’s not the reason why it should be removed, they should be removed because they make agriculture very inefficient by putting an artificial limit on how much land a farmer can own). Infosys can own 5000 acres of land for a golf course but they cannot own 5000 acres of agricultural land.