4 ms·

It might explain why WASM stagnated for so long. To be honest, google and apple probably want to kill WASM. Those company lose money because of good standards.

by jokoon 4y ago

CharlesW 4y ago
> Those company lose money because of good standards. They absolutely do not, and they often make money and realize many other benefits by leveraging and/or contributing to standards. https://www.joelonsoftware.com/2002/06/12/strategy-letter-v/ https://www.joelonsoftware.com/2002/06/12/strategy-letter-v/ https://www.fastcompany.com/3044088/apple-and-usb-a-history-of-adoption-acceptance-acquiescence https://www.fastcompany.com/3044088/apple-and-usb-a-history-... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/QuickTime_File_Format#Extensions https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/QuickTime_File_Format#Extensio...
- drewcoo 4y ago
  > "contributing to" standards ftfy The gp post did say "good standards," so I'm assuming that means open, unbiased ones.
  - CharlesW 4y ago
    > ftfy I think the double quotes are meant to suggest that all open source contributions by Google and Apple are bad, somehow? I love the idea of "unbiased" though, as if contributors to standards must have no opinions about the standard one way or the other in order to be "pure".
  - lostcolony 4y ago
    Yep. Good standards = healthy competition in the space. Standards that basically just standardize what someone has already done, standards that require special licensing, require a high degree of effort to implement, etc, all create competitive advantages for large incumbents.
- dahdum 4y ago
  WASM and the further development of API's like WebGL are a dangerous threat to their app store revenue, so both Apple and Google are incentivized to lead (or sometimes stall) development.
  - CharlesW 4y ago
    > WASM and the further development of API's like WebGL are a dangerous threat to their app store revenue… I'm not sure how you arrive at "web technologies are a dangerous threat to app store revenue", given that the iPhone was introduced with the best web browser ever made for mobile, and predated the app store by more than a year. Care to elaborate?
    - dahdum 4y ago
      Sure, Fortnite is a great example. If it can well run via web (which is a current workaround via Xbox Cloud Gaming), Apple can’t take their 30% cut. Same with Roblox and other games. Top paid apps like Procreate could do the same. Apple and Google could lose tens of billions in revenue if they make the web too good too fast.
      - astlouis44 4y ago
        Yeah Fortnite could run well in WebAssembly and WebGPU for example, cloud streaming isn't necessary to get Fortnite on the mobile web. My team is actually developing a suite of tools and platform to enable Unreal Engine game developers to deploy their games to HTML5, bypassing walled gardens and 30% fees entirely.
        CharlesW 4y ago
        > My team is actually developing a suite of tools and platform to enable Unreal Engine game developers to deploy their games to HTML5, bypassing walled gardens and 30% fees entirely. Okay, so your POV makes more sense now. I'm a fan of the web, so I wish you the best in making the web a platform for non-casual gaming. IMHO, if you view this primarily as a technology problem, you're going to learn that it isn't. Even when the technology prerequisites exist (Safari supports both Wasm and WebGL today), someone will need to solve the problems that app stores solve.

It might explain why WASM stagnated for so long. To be honest, google and apple probably want to kill WASM. Those company lose money because of good standards.

by jokoon 4y ago

It might explain why WASM stagnated for so long. To be honest, google and apple probably want to kill WASM. Those company lose money because of good standards.

CharlesW 4y ago

> Those company lose money because of good standards. They absolutely do not, and they often make money and realize many other benefits by leveraging and/or contributing to standards. https://www.joelonsoftware.com/2002/06/12/strategy-letter-v/ https://www.joelonsoftware.com/2002/06/12/strategy-letter-v/ https://www.fastcompany.com/3044088/apple-and-usb-a-history-of-adoption-acceptance-acquiescence https://www.fastcompany.com/3044088/apple-and-usb-a-history-... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/QuickTime_File_Format#Extensions https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/QuickTime_File_Format#Extensio...

drewcoo 4y ago
> "contributing to" standards ftfy The gp post did say "good standards," so I'm assuming that means open, unbiased ones.
- CharlesW 4y ago
  > ftfy I think the double quotes are meant to suggest that all open source contributions by Google and Apple are bad, somehow? I love the idea of "unbiased" though, as if contributors to standards must have no opinions about the standard one way or the other in order to be "pure".
- lostcolony 4y ago
  Yep. Good standards = healthy competition in the space. Standards that basically just standardize what someone has already done, standards that require special licensing, require a high degree of effort to implement, etc, all create competitive advantages for large incumbents.
dahdum 4y ago
WASM and the further development of API's like WebGL are a dangerous threat to their app store revenue, so both Apple and Google are incentivized to lead (or sometimes stall) development.
- CharlesW 4y ago
  > WASM and the further development of API's like WebGL are a dangerous threat to their app store revenue… I'm not sure how you arrive at "web technologies are a dangerous threat to app store revenue", given that the iPhone was introduced with the best web browser ever made for mobile, and predated the app store by more than a year. Care to elaborate?
  - dahdum 4y ago
    Sure, Fortnite is a great example. If it can well run via web (which is a current workaround via Xbox Cloud Gaming), Apple can’t take their 30% cut. Same with Roblox and other games. Top paid apps like Procreate could do the same. Apple and Google could lose tens of billions in revenue if they make the web too good too fast.
    - astlouis44 4y ago
      Yeah Fortnite could run well in WebAssembly and WebGPU for example, cloud streaming isn't necessary to get Fortnite on the mobile web. My team is actually developing a suite of tools and platform to enable Unreal Engine game developers to deploy their games to HTML5, bypassing walled gardens and 30% fees entirely.
      - CharlesW 4y ago
        > My team is actually developing a suite of tools and platform to enable Unreal Engine game developers to deploy their games to HTML5, bypassing walled gardens and 30% fees entirely. Okay, so your POV makes more sense now. I'm a fan of the web, so I wish you the best in making the web a platform for non-casual gaming. IMHO, if you view this primarily as a technology problem, you're going to learn that it isn't. Even when the technology prerequisites exist (Safari supports both Wasm and WebGL today), someone will need to solve the problems that app stores solve.