6 ms·

Why did he think the paychecks would stop coming?

zdragnar 5y ago
Not all pensions are well managed; some have needed bailing out from public coffers. Other companies have shuttered completely, and the lack of incoming money to the pension funds made them insolvent (again, not especially well managed).
- guessbest 5y ago
  Its doesn't have to be public bailouts. There is something for Americans where the pension funds have been seized by the federal government to be managed. I worked for a company where the executives were using pension funds to give themselves annual bonuses until the federal government stepped in around 2009. There wasn't much money left over, so I'll be receiving very little, but at least the executives could raid the funds anymore. > Welcome to PBGC! Since 1974, we’ve protected retirement security and the retirement incomes of over 33 million American workers, retirees, and their families in private sector defined benefit pension plans. https://www.pbgc.gov/ https://www.pbgc.gov/
  - zdragnar 5y ago
    It's a shame that you got screwed out of what you'd been promised. I'm guessing yours wasn't in the $86 billion bailout (maybe because it only went to multi-employer union plans?) > https://www.cnbc.com/2021/03/08/covid-relief-bill-gives-86-billion-bailout-to-failing-union-pension-plans.html https://www.cnbc.com/2021/03/08/covid-relief-bill-gives-86-b... Unfortunately, it's not just the private sector pensions that have been mismanaged (or raided, as you pointed out) which are in dire straits. California, in particular, has a lot of public pension headaches that will be coming to a head (and in some cases already have): https://www.latimes.com/projects/la-me-pension-crisis-davis-deal/ https://www.latimes.com/projects/la-me-pension-crisis-davis-... https://www.forbes.com/sites/adamandrzejewski/2020/05/19/why-california-is-in-trouble--340000-public-employees-with-100000-paychecks-cost-taxpayers-45-billion/?sh=2c8d73825fb8 https://www.forbes.com/sites/adamandrzejewski/2020/05/19/why...
    - guessbest 5y ago
      No, this was a telecom company where the Canadian executives were siphoning money from the American work force, which was net profitable. The Canadian side was losing money by the billions. The pensions were down to a mid sixty percent reduction before the American government stepped in to stop the transfers. It was in all the papers.
- hannibalhorn 4y ago
  Even well managed funds can result in someone getting the shaft. My dad's pension (Delphi Salaried) was cut to 50% of what it was supposed to be after the events of '08, and it was funded to something like $0.86 on the dollar, above the national average. The hourly workers (i.e., unionized) still got 100%, which was pretty unfair.
giantg2 5y ago
My grandfather worked for the steel mills. Some workers didn't get anything for their pensions. He was one of the lucky ones and got something, like 10 cents on the dollar. I think they even stopped sending them before he died (remember him saying something about that was the last check and complaining about the company).
- refurb 5y ago
  Pensions are all insured in the US
  - giantg2 5y ago
    Do you have a source? I wonder if that covers all pensions or just public pensions? Or if that requirement is newer and didn't exist when the companies went under 50 or so years ago.
    - lotsofpulp 5y ago
      Even taxpayer funded DB pension recipients have had to accept benefit cuts, such as former employees of Detroit and Rhode Island. If the entity that owes you does not have the power to print money, then there is always a risk of non payment. And how much of a bailout you get depends on your political weight.
    - refurb 4y ago
      PBGC is “insurance” for pension plans.
      - giantg2 4y ago
        Looks like their site says there was little protection for pensions before 1974. So it sounds like there wasn't any protection before that. Their wording around "insured pensions" also seems to indicate that some pensions may not be insured (no requirement to insure them).
  - fullstop 5y ago
xen2xen1 5y ago
A large number of folks think the world already ended, and we're just waiting on the collapse. That now both on the right and left.
- bsenftner 5y ago
  I used to work in film, and every once in a while I get a script to read, passed around because it is "too good to be made". One such script I read about 2 years ago had the premise of an archeological discovery, rapidly verified and with duplicates found all over the world proving "the rapture" happened back in the year 1000 AD. The modern world realizes we're in the 2nd century of the 10,000 year reign of Satan. All hell breaks loose, of course.
  - xen2xen1 5y ago
    That's a great premise, and I say this with years of being pentecostal.
  - I-M-S 5y ago
    You probably meant 2nd millennium (VS century). Is this script available on the Black List?
    - bsenftner 4y ago
      I don't believe it is available anywhere, because it is entangled legally, as apparently the author of another literary work with the premise of finding lost bible books documenting a continued life of Jesus with a family and kids sued the author of this script. I've not followed the situation, simply because I don't care about such things.
dehrmann 5y ago
In the last few years, there's been some nostalgia in the US over pensions, but people tend to forget that they're tied to employers, so people feel tied to jobs because they're building up a pension, and the pension is often managed by and dependent on the employer's business in some way.

Not all pensions are well managed; some have needed bailing out from public coffers. Other companies have shuttered completely, and the lack of incoming money to the pension funds made them insolvent (again, not especially well managed).

guessbest 5y ago
Its doesn't have to be public bailouts. There is something for Americans where the pension funds have been seized by the federal government to be managed. I worked for a company where the executives were using pension funds to give themselves annual bonuses until the federal government stepped in around 2009. There wasn't much money left over, so I'll be receiving very little, but at least the executives could raid the funds anymore. > Welcome to PBGC! Since 1974, we’ve protected retirement security and the retirement incomes of over 33 million American workers, retirees, and their families in private sector defined benefit pension plans. https://www.pbgc.gov/ https://www.pbgc.gov/
- zdragnar 5y ago
  It's a shame that you got screwed out of what you'd been promised. I'm guessing yours wasn't in the $86 billion bailout (maybe because it only went to multi-employer union plans?) > https://www.cnbc.com/2021/03/08/covid-relief-bill-gives-86-billion-bailout-to-failing-union-pension-plans.html https://www.cnbc.com/2021/03/08/covid-relief-bill-gives-86-b... Unfortunately, it's not just the private sector pensions that have been mismanaged (or raided, as you pointed out) which are in dire straits. California, in particular, has a lot of public pension headaches that will be coming to a head (and in some cases already have): https://www.latimes.com/projects/la-me-pension-crisis-davis-deal/ https://www.latimes.com/projects/la-me-pension-crisis-davis-... https://www.forbes.com/sites/adamandrzejewski/2020/05/19/why-california-is-in-trouble--340000-public-employees-with-100000-paychecks-cost-taxpayers-45-billion/?sh=2c8d73825fb8 https://www.forbes.com/sites/adamandrzejewski/2020/05/19/why...
  - guessbest 5y ago
    No, this was a telecom company where the Canadian executives were siphoning money from the American work force, which was net profitable. The Canadian side was losing money by the billions. The pensions were down to a mid sixty percent reduction before the American government stepped in to stop the transfers. It was in all the papers.
hannibalhorn 4y ago
Even well managed funds can result in someone getting the shaft. My dad's pension (Delphi Salaried) was cut to 50% of what it was supposed to be after the events of '08, and it was funded to something like $0.86 on the dollar, above the national average. The hourly workers (i.e., unionized) still got 100%, which was pretty unfair.

giantg2 5y ago

My grandfather worked for the steel mills. Some workers didn't get anything for their pensions. He was one of the lucky ones and got something, like 10 cents on the dollar. I think they even stopped sending them before he died (remember him saying something about that was the last check and complaining about the company).

refurb 5y ago
Pensions are all insured in the US
- giantg2 5y ago
  Do you have a source? I wonder if that covers all pensions or just public pensions? Or if that requirement is newer and didn't exist when the companies went under 50 or so years ago.
  - lotsofpulp 5y ago
    Even taxpayer funded DB pension recipients have had to accept benefit cuts, such as former employees of Detroit and Rhode Island. If the entity that owes you does not have the power to print money, then there is always a risk of non payment. And how much of a bailout you get depends on your political weight.
  - refurb 4y ago
    PBGC is “insurance” for pension plans.
    - giantg2 4y ago
      Looks like their site says there was little protection for pensions before 1974. So it sounds like there wasn't any protection before that. Their wording around "insured pensions" also seems to indicate that some pensions may not be insured (no requirement to insure them).
- fullstop 5y ago

xen2xen1 5y ago

A large number of folks think the world already ended, and we're just waiting on the collapse. That now both on the right and left.

bsenftner 5y ago
I used to work in film, and every once in a while I get a script to read, passed around because it is "too good to be made". One such script I read about 2 years ago had the premise of an archeological discovery, rapidly verified and with duplicates found all over the world proving "the rapture" happened back in the year 1000 AD. The modern world realizes we're in the 2nd century of the 10,000 year reign of Satan. All hell breaks loose, of course.
- xen2xen1 5y ago
  That's a great premise, and I say this with years of being pentecostal.
- I-M-S 5y ago
  You probably meant 2nd millennium (VS century). Is this script available on the Black List?
  - bsenftner 4y ago
    I don't believe it is available anywhere, because it is entangled legally, as apparently the author of another literary work with the premise of finding lost bible books documenting a continued life of Jesus with a family and kids sued the author of this script. I've not followed the situation, simply because I don't care about such things.

dehrmann 5y ago

In the last few years, there's been some nostalgia in the US over pensions, but people tend to forget that they're tied to employers, so people feel tied to jobs because they're building up a pension, and the pension is often managed by and dependent on the employer's business in some way.