7 ms·

> Life is chaos; pretending things like this are in your control is useless. Yes, I've been thinking a lot about this and if free will is just an illusion. I

by adam12 4y ago

> Life is chaos; pretending things like this are in your control is useless. Yes, I've been thinking a lot about this and if free will is just an illusion. I sorta like to think it is just an illusion. It does make it easier to deal with "wrong" decisions.

baremetal 4y ago
that kind of thinking could result in repeating your mistakes.
- adam12 4y ago
  If free will isn't an illusion.
  - baremetal 4y ago
    what benefit is gleaned from thinking free will is an illusion?
    - dkersten 4y ago
      Not beating yourself up over past mistakes.
      - MrTortoise 4y ago
        but you are saying you dont have a choice about that i dont really see how you can say free will is an illusion so you shouldnt do something. Thats a direct contradiction
        adam12 4y ago
        > Thats a direct contradiction No, if free will is an illision, then even "choosing" to believe in it and "choosing" to let things go is an illusion. It would apply to every "choice" we make.
        baremetal 4y ago
        if only it were so simple to side step personal responsibility. just call it illusory. to what effect?
- tuyiown 4y ago
  I often see this reaction when people suggests that you should care too much about your past decisions since you can't ever imagine control everything. It's about _past_ decisions, nobody says you shouldn't care about doing the best for you in the present. You can't be sure if your decisions are the best, but you surely have to avoid the bad one if you can !
  - sjg007 4y ago
    Don't repeat the same mistakes, it is boring. Make new mistakes, much more learning happens that way. There's probably a Yodaism in there. The meta level is to recognize classes of mistakes and create a process around preventing them to help avoid future mistakes.
me_me_me 4y ago
(Not OP but) This quote most likely is not about free will. But how life is random/chaotic. Two people in same situation doing exactly same thing might end up with different end results. In professional poker there is a rule/saying, "you can do everything right and still loose" (due to chaos). The trick is to not over-think your mistakes, if you made a stupid decision reflect why, if you didnt make stupid decision it might not have been a bad decision, just unlucky. You cannot control the chaos only adapt and look ahead, instead of if only i did this or that i would be better off. You cannot know for sure if something would happened or not. You absolutely have free will to do something about your situation, but you cannot guaranteed outcome.
- adam12 4y ago
  Think of a situation where you think you could have done something better than someone else. It is likely that you could have using your mind, body and life experience. Do you think that you could have done the situation better if you were using their mind, body and you had their life experience? I believe that we would all have the same outcome. If that is the case, then free will is an illusion.
  - me_me_me 4y ago
    Free will is an illusion, but it doesn't change anything. Lives go on as we cannot predict/simulate our world to 100% predict human reactions and decisions. > I believe that we would all have the same outcome. We are not talking about impossible hypothetical situations. We are talking about Bob and Alice, where Bob thinks to himself that only if he followed same career choices as Alice he would be in the same place as her. Since he is smarter and harder working than her. And that is simply not true due to life being chaotic, unfair and luck plays its part. He would have a chance but not guarantee to have same outcome as Alice.
mgh2 4y ago
Proof: https://trendguardian.medium.com/free-will-a-rich-fairy-tale-4fecf8095812 https://trendguardian.medium.com/free-will-a-rich-fairy-tale...
jpcapdevila 4y ago
I was having this conversation two days ago. I believe free will is an illusion, everything is ruled by causality beyond our comprehension. But even as I say write it, in a couple of minutes my brain will jump back into thinking I'm in control. It's very strange.

by adam12 4y ago

baremetal 4y ago

that kind of thinking could result in repeating your mistakes.

adam12 4y ago
If free will isn't an illusion.
- baremetal 4y ago
  what benefit is gleaned from thinking free will is an illusion?
  - dkersten 4y ago
    Not beating yourself up over past mistakes.
    - MrTortoise 4y ago
      but you are saying you dont have a choice about that i dont really see how you can say free will is an illusion so you shouldnt do something. Thats a direct contradiction
      - adam12 4y ago
        > Thats a direct contradiction No, if free will is an illision, then even "choosing" to believe in it and "choosing" to let things go is an illusion. It would apply to every "choice" we make.
        baremetal 4y ago
        if only it were so simple to side step personal responsibility. just call it illusory. to what effect?
tuyiown 4y ago
I often see this reaction when people suggests that you should care too much about your past decisions since you can't ever imagine control everything. It's about _past_ decisions, nobody says you shouldn't care about doing the best for you in the present. You can't be sure if your decisions are the best, but you surely have to avoid the bad one if you can !
- sjg007 4y ago
  Don't repeat the same mistakes, it is boring. Make new mistakes, much more learning happens that way. There's probably a Yodaism in there. The meta level is to recognize classes of mistakes and create a process around preventing them to help avoid future mistakes.

me_me_me 4y ago

(Not OP but) This quote most likely is not about free will. But how life is random/chaotic. Two people in same situation doing exactly same thing might end up with different end results. In professional poker there is a rule/saying, "you can do everything right and still loose" (due to chaos). The trick is to not over-think your mistakes, if you made a stupid decision reflect why, if you didnt make stupid decision it might not have been a bad decision, just unlucky. You cannot control the chaos only adapt and look ahead, instead of if only i did this or that i would be better off. You cannot know for sure if something would happened or not. You absolutely have free will to do something about your situation, but you cannot guaranteed outcome.

adam12 4y ago
Think of a situation where you think you could have done something better than someone else. It is likely that you could have using your mind, body and life experience. Do you think that you could have done the situation better if you were using their mind, body and you had their life experience? I believe that we would all have the same outcome. If that is the case, then free will is an illusion.
- me_me_me 4y ago
  Free will is an illusion, but it doesn't change anything. Lives go on as we cannot predict/simulate our world to 100% predict human reactions and decisions. > I believe that we would all have the same outcome. We are not talking about impossible hypothetical situations. We are talking about Bob and Alice, where Bob thinks to himself that only if he followed same career choices as Alice he would be in the same place as her. Since he is smarter and harder working than her. And that is simply not true due to life being chaotic, unfair and luck plays its part. He would have a chance but not guarantee to have same outcome as Alice.

mgh2 4y ago

Proof: https://trendguardian.medium.com/free-will-a-rich-fairy-tale-4fecf8095812 https://trendguardian.medium.com/free-will-a-rich-fairy-tale...

jpcapdevila 4y ago

I was having this conversation two days ago. I believe free will is an illusion, everything is ruled by causality beyond our comprehension. But even as I say write it, in a couple of minutes my brain will jump back into thinking I'm in control. It's very strange.